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red crystal+bee shrimp

5.8K views 9 replies 4 participants last post by  ianiwane  
#1 ·
hi to all...i dont understand a thing..in many posts somebody says that keeping red crystal (red bee) and bee shrimps (black bee) is safe...
But we know that red crystal and biene(that is the real name of bee) really hybridize..
So, why someone put togheter shrimps that cost also 30 euro with other that can hybridize with them???
Somebody says that red crystal derive from biene, so mixing them is optimal to "prevent the colour" and other things.. but it isnt really true i think.....

So, what is the true??bye
 
#4 ·
Alright lets try to clear things up for you. I had the same problems a while back which lead to a LONG thread.....:icon_roll

First off the standard common names across the internet (globally recognized common names)

Are;

CRS- Crystal Red Shrimp (white and read stripes)
Black Diamond- Black and white form of CRS Also known on American forums as BEE

From what I understand biene is shrimp in German correct?

Now why would you want to mix them?

They are Generally a few USD cheaper than their brothers and sisters (CRS) They are also the "wild form" or before the genetic red mutation occured they where all black and white. Selective breeding has brought them to where they are today.

To make it more confusing there are also two more shrimp that are "Bee"

New Bee And Bumble Bee

New Bee I'm not sure 100% latin name but basically it's a type of Bee that the orriginal CRS was bred from, not the exact same but a slightly different version (make it simple) These where bread with the higher grade (A-S) shrimp to get the SSS shrimp with all white bodies I have read. The problem with the "BEE" or "old BEE" was that something in the genetics made it VERY hard or impossible to break the bands and make the whole body white. When the high grade CRS where bred with the "New Bee" the bands broke and Hinu Maru and Masura started happening. Now that's only what I have read and can't give 100% proof of that.

Bumble Bee you can see at Freshwater Inverts It is in the same family as CRS, BEE, and New Bee But it will create wierd hybrids. The difference in this shrimp is the black band is the first band near the head opposed to the colored band of black or red.

To make it even more confusing there is "Crystal White shrimp" which there are two different types. One is a VERY VERY VERY..... VERY VERY rare genetic mutation which basically... it's an albino CRS and it goes all white. I've only seen a picture of a head of the shrimp that a mod at ShrimpNow !!! - Welcome has and it's crazy. There is also a wild bee type thats pretty common in SE Asia which looks like Tiger but is really bee that just is clear with white stripes.

So To Try to answer your question. You are probably seeing CRS's brother BEE shrimp. It is usually kept with CRS because many people believe it is good to have them together to keep the whole gene pool in the tank and to improve the CRS stock. The problem is they homogenize (Spelling?) and you get hybrids

(This isn't right... See post #7)

B- Dominate black
b- Recessive RED

BB is a true BEE shrimp
bb is a true CRS shrimp

BB female mates with bb male - so you get BB,bb,Bb,bB
Now you have true BEE, true CRS, Bee with recessive Red gene, And CRS with Usually dominate Black gene.

It gets really confusing after that go to ShrimpNow !!! - Welcome and look at the sticky in CRS forum on the genetics to get a better idea...

Hope it helps a bit....

-Andrew

(Most of this stuff is things I have read. Not personal experience. There are probably mistakes...)
 
#7 ·
So To Try to answer your question. You are probably seeing CRS's brother BEE shrimp. It is usually kept with CRS because many people believe it is good to have them together to keep the whole gene pool in the tank and to improve the CRS stock. The problem is they homogenize (Spelling?) and you get hybrids
You cannot get hybrids if they are the same species. To get a hybrid they must be of different species. There is no such thing as hybridization between a bee shrimp and a CRS.

B- Dominate black
b- Recessive RED

BB is a true BEE shrimp
bb is a true CRS shrimp

BB female mates with bb male - so you get BB,bb,Bb,bB
Now you have true BEE, true CRS, Bee with recessive Red gene, And CRS with Usually dominate Black gene.
Wrong when a BB (homozygous dominant) mates with a bb (homozygous recessive) you will get all Bb(heterozygous) all black diamonds. In the second generation if a Bb mates with a Bb you will get BB + Bb + Bb + bb.
 
#6 ·
well....
in europe (but also in italy) we have

-red crystal
-biene=bee shrimp

the other like bumblebee are different species...
i know for example that bumblebee are the same of newbee (from what we know here in italy)....

I want to mix them only because in that case i have more space to keep another species of shrimps.In fact i'm making a multiple tank with 4 little tanks of 25 liters derived from a 120 cm tank...In this case i will put one species in each little tank except for red crystal and bee...
this is the tank...
ImageShack - Hosting :: vascaluce001ft2.jpg

Is it correct?I dont undestand when you say that "they omogenize and you get hybrids"...So mixing red crystal and bee will generate hybrids????
ciao
 
#8 ·
That is one nice tank you have there... I was going to build one like that but At the time the cost was waaaaaay too high.

What I meant by they will "homogenize and create hybrids" was that when a Biene (Diamond) and CRS (Crystal red) breed, example Female Biene and Male CRS breed and make more shrimp they are of the same type, but they will be a mix of Recessive and Dominate genes.

So if a Diamond Shrimp and a CRS mated and the female diamond's shrimp hatched and they lived... they would be a mix of CRS traits and Diamond trates... I'll try to explain again..(just see post #7 I mixed this stuff up... this would be like the second generation I think... it's confusing lol...)

CRS+Diamond Shrimp = CRS, Diamond shrimp, CRS (with diamond genes being recessive), and Diamond shrimp (with CRS red gene being recessive.)

Recessive means that that shrimp has the genes for the other color, but the other one beat it out.................

Hope that helps...

-Andrew

For people into genetics, Is my Cross genetic wrong? Would it be 25% CRS, 25% Diamond (pure of both) and then 50% Diamond with recessive CRS red gene? I think I'm right... but I feel like I messed something up.....:mad: so if I did point it out...

(I was wrong.... Thanks for correcting me...)