Yamato Green
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I use it, love it and swear by it. It's done WONDERS to my tank- but don't talk about it. Rex get's REAL mad. he'll rant and rave forever about the fact that it's "not a legal fertilizer" It has everything you need in it, and if you NEED Nitrogen because you don't have enough fish, you can get yamato-N
Give it 6 weeks- You'll se a HUGE difference. In particular, watch for your red plants to get very pretty.
IMO-it's money well spent. It's not the cheapest, and not the most expensive. i think for the amoun tyou get it's pretty cheap for a liquid fert. You can get dry (which I haven't tried yet), but I'd rather pay a couple bucks extra to not have any hassel.
Are you running good lights and CO2?
Give it 6 weeks- You'll se a HUGE difference. In particular, watch for your red plants to get very pretty.
IMO-it's money well spent. It's not the cheapest, and not the most expensive. i think for the amoun tyou get it's pretty cheap for a liquid fert. You can get dry (which I haven't tried yet), but I'd rather pay a couple bucks extra to not have any hassel.
Are you running good lights and CO2?
Ya ive got AH supply 36 watt bright kit, and CO2. The tank is only 10 gallons so i'm doing good on the WPG. I ordered it. We will see how it does. I also gave in and got some Greg Watson dry ferts. The "EI" dosing seems to work wonders for people so i thought id give them a try. Im gonna have enough of that to last me until im 70 (18 years old now) but thats cool 
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Now why did you have to go and prove Rex right, kkentert?
What's not legal about it?
Any balanced, comprehensive fertilizer regime will do wonders for a tank that was previously lacking it. The Seachem Fluorish line has the same basic idea as Greg Watson, same as Kent Botanica, and so forth.
I'm not really sure- Rex is on some high horse about tech specs(I think it's mainly because he wants to argue with people about things he's never tried) Anyway, he says it's not LEGALLY a fertilizer because it 's not x% this and y% that. I say it IS a very comprehensive fertilizer if you consider a fertilizer a mix of supplents that makes you plants grow like crazy. He seems to know more about what's in YG than the people who make it (who will happily talk to you about it if you call them- the guy spent a half hour on the phone with me the first time I bought it, and not "salesing" me up)-it's very funny.
The the difference i have seen with YG vs Flourish (which is what I used to use, as well as an Aquarium pharmacudical product i don't remeber the name of and a couple other liquid ferts) is that you only need one thing. They include it all, without making it so you have to buy2-5 bottles.(unless you need something that is probably already in your tank like Nitrogen which you can get Yamato-N for) Plus, it works a lot better. Rex reffers to me as a "yamato green pimp" (and it was soley me who he was talking about) but the difference between him and I is that I haven't tried dry ferts yet-and I'm open to it. He's never tried YG and has something against it.
hey- everyone's different. I say YG is woth a 6 week trial at least. Worst thing that happens is you end up wasting less than $20. In my opinion- ANY amount of money is wasted on something that doesn't work, or doesn't work well, and money spent one something that gives you a jungle is well spent!
Oh- One last thing - the key to why the stuff works so well (according to the makers) It contains growth stimulators. they won't say exactly which, or how much or anything, but they are present, and they're the key as to how you can mix the same "formula" at home that's on the bottle and not get the same results. Can you tell I LOVE the stuff?
The the difference i have seen with YG vs Flourish (which is what I used to use, as well as an Aquarium pharmacudical product i don't remeber the name of and a couple other liquid ferts) is that you only need one thing. They include it all, without making it so you have to buy2-5 bottles.(unless you need something that is probably already in your tank like Nitrogen which you can get Yamato-N for) Plus, it works a lot better. Rex reffers to me as a "yamato green pimp" (and it was soley me who he was talking about) but the difference between him and I is that I haven't tried dry ferts yet-and I'm open to it. He's never tried YG and has something against it.
hey- everyone's different. I say YG is woth a 6 week trial at least. Worst thing that happens is you end up wasting less than $20. In my opinion- ANY amount of money is wasted on something that doesn't work, or doesn't work well, and money spent one something that gives you a jungle is well spent!
Oh- One last thing - the key to why the stuff works so well (according to the makers) It contains growth stimulators. they won't say exactly which, or how much or anything, but they are present, and they're the key as to how you can mix the same "formula" at home that's on the bottle and not get the same results. Can you tell I LOVE the stuff?
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I think if there was a such thing as "growth stimulators" for plants they would be well known and everybody would be using them. There is no magic potion. No hocus pocus. Growth stimulators are NPK and micros. That's it. Also I may be wrong but how could this stuff contain everything you need when you aren't supposed to mix P with Fe? It must not have one of them.
There are stimulators- they are called Auxins. The thing is - there are many different kinds.
As for P with Fe- I asked the same question- they used to NOT put them in the formula together- they do now, and have not had any problems to date (they've been doing it I THINK they said for 6 years now) before that they did not, but when they wan test, they say found no problems with it. More than anything though- it works for me!
I wonder if they're able to mix them because they make small batches that are fresh- Does it take a long time for them to react with each other? Does that make sense? But they said it still has a good shelf life (though it does have to be refridgerated...
As for P with Fe- I asked the same question- they used to NOT put them in the formula together- they do now, and have not had any problems to date (they've been doing it I THINK they said for 6 years now) before that they did not, but when they wan test, they say found no problems with it. More than anything though- it works for me!
I wonder if they're able to mix them because they make small batches that are fresh- Does it take a long time for them to react with each other? Does that make sense? But they said it still has a good shelf life (though it does have to be refridgerated...
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The Technical Specifications portion of Yamatos website states that phosphate is not included in YG because "excess Phosphate can stimulate unwanted algae growth" I will leave the merits of this statement to each individual. Anyways, I would like to know what specifically the auxins are. Perhaps a visit to the hydroponic store is in order.
If that is what they said then they are wrong. If you have a large amount of plants, are using CO2, have good filtration, and are dosing the correct ferts including Phosphate, then you should not have any algae. Phosphate will make your plants nice and colorful, along with iron as well.
If your plants are well nourished and healthy then you will not get any algae. I promise. If your plants are not nourished or healthy then the algae will gain from that. Good luck.
By the way, dosing EI is a great method. I have said this time and time again- there is not set amount of ferts to dose depending on the size tank you have. If you have a 29gallon you may need to dose a lot more ferts than someone elses 29gallon. The reason being is plant uptake. Use one of the dosing calculators on this site to figure out how to calculate how much your plants uptake/need. You may be surprised to find out how much more ferts your plants may need if you have a heavily planted tank.
-Ryan
I stand corrected- Sometimes I type to fast without giving it all the thoguht I should- Yes, there are NO phosphates. There should be phosphates in the tank already. If for some reason your tank does not have sufficient levels, you should dose that- but most likely, if your keeping fish in your planted tank, you should have them there.
But now-I have to go back- there are two things you shoudn't mix that they do (if I remember correctly) I'l try and remember what they are instead of posting falsly again- be back with the info later...
But now-I have to go back- there are two things you shoudn't mix that they do (if I remember correctly) I'l try and remember what they are instead of posting falsly again- be back with the info later...
Fish are not going to provide enough phosphates. You will have to dose phosphates. I don't know where you are getting this information.
-Ryan
For anyone out there that read this, please do not think that fish food is a source of phosphate. You should only be feeding your fish an amount that they can consume in a very short period of time. If you are overfeeding your fish in the expectation that you are also providing phosphate, you are asking for disaster.
kkentert- I am not trying to be rude to you or anything, but please stop giving out false information. If you don't know what you are talking about then please don't give bad advice. There are a lot of people just starting the aquascaping hobby that read these posts in order to learn. If they think that fish food is a good source of phosphate then they will be asking a million questions about planaria, disease, snails, fish death, etc. Once again, I am not a mean person trying to make you feel bad. I just think its not proper to give false advice, thats all.
-Ryan
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Growth stimulators (auxins, gibberellins, etc.) wouldn't matter if the plants don't have what they need to grow in the first place.
I'm sure Tom Barr will show up soon to clear up the hormone deal.
I'm sure Tom Barr will show up soon to clear up the hormone deal.
I appreciate the civil tone, and guidance (and no- I'm not being sarcastic) I was told years ago about the phosphates being present from fish food, and my plants have always done relatively well, so I never questioned it. The when I gt Yamato green, their website said the same thing that I had already heard. That said, my plants have been even better since I swicthed to YG, but maybe they're not doing as well as they COULD be with more Phosphates. i apologize for any misinformation, it was what i had come to believe from some other "misguided" people. I'm going to try dosing some and see if thing do even better. Thanks for the info. I'll deff. read up some more! (I still say the YG is great stuff!)
Question- Did fish foods contain more phosphates a couple years ago than they do now? Could my info just be old? or is it flat out wrong?
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You can call feces gold. That doesn't make them gold.
Federal and State laws are very specific about what can and can not be called fertilizers. Seachem follows the law and calls Flourish a supplement. Unless you have specific amounts of NPK in it then it can't be called a fertilizer. I have explained that to you several times kkentert.
Also you have never tried dosing real ferts. You speak from an EXTREMELY limited knowledge base. And those of us who have been around for a while have heard the old "secret ingredient" spiel many times. And yet those of us who don't use these "magic products" seem to grow buckets of weeds with our basic inexpensive bulk nutrients.
Yamato Green may well work on a low light tank full of slow growing plants for quite some time. But attempting to use it in a high light CO2 injected weed factory will result in failure.
It's kind of funny. What works in "fast" tanks will also work quite well in "slow" tanks. But what works in "slow" tanks doesn't do so well in "fast" tanks
Federal and State laws are very specific about what can and can not be called fertilizers. Seachem follows the law and calls Flourish a supplement. Unless you have specific amounts of NPK in it then it can't be called a fertilizer. I have explained that to you several times kkentert.
Also you have never tried dosing real ferts. You speak from an EXTREMELY limited knowledge base. And those of us who have been around for a while have heard the old "secret ingredient" spiel many times. And yet those of us who don't use these "magic products" seem to grow buckets of weeds with our basic inexpensive bulk nutrients.
Yamato Green may well work on a low light tank full of slow growing plants for quite some time. But attempting to use it in a high light CO2 injected weed factory will result in failure.
It's kind of funny. What works in "fast" tanks will also work quite well in "slow" tanks. But what works in "slow" tanks doesn't do so well in "fast" tanks
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See the first line of my first reply to this thread.
Comprehensive fertilizer has a legal meaning under law. It must contain measurable amounts of NPK above the trace level.
Yamato Green has NO P, NO N, and only trace K.
If you want to call it a great trace additive or supplement I have no problems. But you constantly refer to it as a fertilizer and it's not.
So- they didn't do the study on guppie's waste, but it is still fish waste (processed and expelled food)- but check this outFishPoo
Just some food for though-but it says there is 2.54% Phosphorus. The fact that the guy at YG wrote that on his site also kind of makes me believe it as he has a Doctorate in Microbiology and biochemistry...(plus has worked in aquaculture for 50? years)
I'm not saying what you said is untrue- I'm just doing some more research on my own and thought I'd bring that study to you to check out.
No-I'm sure it could be argued that a few small fish is not ENOUGH for a tank full of plants-
Off to read more!
I'm glad you got the wheels turning...
As for fast and slow tanks- I have 4 WPG, and injected co2 (though I used to run Carbo-Block (HATED it) and I have VERY fast growing plants (almost too fast-it's a pain in the neck)
Just some food for though-but it says there is 2.54% Phosphorus. The fact that the guy at YG wrote that on his site also kind of makes me believe it as he has a Doctorate in Microbiology and biochemistry...(plus has worked in aquaculture for 50? years)
I'm not saying what you said is untrue- I'm just doing some more research on my own and thought I'd bring that study to you to check out.
No-I'm sure it could be argued that a few small fish is not ENOUGH for a tank full of plants-
Off to read more!
I'm glad you got the wheels turning...
As for fast and slow tanks- I have 4 WPG, and injected co2 (though I used to run Carbo-Block (HATED it) and I have VERY fast growing plants (almost too fast-it's a pain in the neck)
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