What do I dose?

1380 Views 11 Replies 5 Participants Last post by Carissa, Sep 20, 2007

Johnny Relentless

Discussion Starter · Sep 13, 2007

I am new to planted tanks.
My tank is 12 days old. It is a 29G with 65W of light and red fluorite substrate. I have a Betta and 12 ghost shrimp in there. It is pretty heavily planted, and more are coming in the mail. As of now I do not have CO2 injection, but I think I will get it in about a month or so.
Ammonia and nitrites have already spiked. I just received dry ferts in the mail. Potassium Sulfate, Potassium Nitrate, Mono Potassium Phosphate and Plantex CSM+B.

These are the test readings I just got.
Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 2
Nitrate: 10
Phosphate: 10
PH: 7.2
KH: 3 degrees
GH: 14 degrees (which was actually off the chart)

Am I correct in thinking that I do not need to add phosphate or nitrate with readings like this?

Am I correct in thinking that I do not need to add trace minerals if my GH is so high? When I first moved in, the water came out brown because the pipes are rusted. It looks clear after they snaked the pipes, but I don't drink it. I suspect there may be a lot of metals in it. Also, I live in South Florida, which has notoriously hard water.

And I am also wondering what the heck is Potassium Sulfate for, why did I order it, and how do I test for it?

Should I dose with Flourish as well, until I get a CO2 setup?

Any advice I could get would be greatly appreciated.

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kunerd

· #2 · Sep 13, 2007

First off I would read this sticky if you ahvent already
http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/water-parameters/21944-_dosing-regimes_.html
Then yes i would suggest dosing with excel if you already have it. Best advice I got from this site is to DO the research FIRST. Especialy with dosing. If you do not know what it is you are putting in your tank dont. i didnt take their advice and am paying for it with horrible algae and what not.

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tazcrash69

· #3 · Sep 13, 2007

Yes, read up on ferts in that sticky, good explanations.

Johnny Relentless said:
Am I correct in thinking that I do not need to add trace minerals if my GH is so high? When I first moved in, the water came out brown because the pipes are rusted. It looks clear after they snaked the pipes, but I don't drink it. I suspect there may be a lot of metals in it. Also, I live in South Florida, which has notoriously hard water.

Sorry no, not correct. You will still need to supply traces. No, I have very hard water KH 8, GH ~18 degrees, and need traces.

Johnny Relentless said:
And I am also wondering what the heck is Potassium Sulfate for, why did I order it, and how do I test for it?

Adding Potassium (K the chemical symbol, not a strikeout) which is a macro nutrient. I haven't seen a hobbyist grade test kit.

Johnny Relentless said:
Should I dose with Flourish as well, until I get a CO2 setup?

Careful with what you purchase. You want Flourish Excel to add carbon, but with 3 WPG, getting the pressurized CO2 sooner will help you out.

You also might want to test your tap water, so you know what you are adding when you do a water change.

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Johnny Relentless

Discussion Starter · #4 · Sep 13, 2007

Thank you for the responses. Yes, I have been reading everything I can over the last few weeks, but it wasn't till I had the ferts in my eager little hands that I realized I had a few questions. It wasn't until then that I realized, for instance, that I had never seen any mention of a test for potassium sulfate. Now that I know that there really isn't one, I will just use the Rex Grigg recommendations.

I'm also wondering, after I mix up a batch of this or that, how long will it stay good? Forever? A month? Will the iron in the CSM begin to oxidize?

I will test my tap water when I get home.

Do you think I should try to lower my phosphates?

When dosing iron, is it enough to just use the CSM? Or should I dose iron separately as well? Rex's web site gives recommended amounts, but without an accurate test for iron, how do you know how much to dose? Estimate?

Thanks for all your input.

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tazcrash69

· #5 · Sep 13, 2007

To the best of my knowledge, the only mix that can goes bad is CSM +B can grow mold so some keep it refrigerated. BTW, why not dose dry? Just as easy, and nothing to go bad.

You might not need the iron. Try without it, and if you see a deficiency, add it. In my tank with fluorite (has a lot of iron in it), I haven't found a need for it dosing with CSM + B.

YMMV

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Johnny Relentless

Discussion Starter · #6 · Sep 13, 2007

I have fluorite as well, so I won't worry about the iron so much, although I am going to dose some CSM. I guess I will keep it in the fridge. Thanks.

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Carissa

· #7 · Sep 13, 2007

My phosphate solution went bad too, I have to keep that one in the fridge now too. Actually what I did was mix up one solution with everything but phosphate in the correct ratios, and another just phosphate. So all I have to do is add x ml of each solution, it made it easier than dealing with several dry ferts. The phosphate is really strong, it's hard to measure accurately without making a solution. I don't think you should try to lower phosphates, more important to make sure all the other nutrients are there in adaquate amounts. Algae usually comes from deficiencies, not having too much. If something is deficient, the plants can't use what IS there in adaquate amounts, so algae starts growing.

If you do ei, you won't have to bother testing anything or worrying about whether your test kits are accurate. I don't own a test kit for anything fertilizer related and my plants do great with ei just dosing the quantities recommended.

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Johnny Relentless

Discussion Starter · #8 · Sep 13, 2007

I came home and all my plants are covered in tiny spots of brown algae! Uh, what should I do? Tank is new (2 weeks), I don't have any algae eaters yet. Should I go get some? What about the nutrients? Dose the tank using the estimative index?

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Johnny Relentless

Discussion Starter · #9 · Sep 13, 2007

Ok, if you remember from my post above, these are the readings I got last night -
Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 2
Nitrate: 10
Phosphate: 10
PH: 7.2
KH: 3 degrees
GH: 14 degrees (which was actually off the chart)

I just tested my tap water, which is -
Phosphate: .25
PH: 6
GH: 4 degrees

I just did a 30% water change, and my readings are now -

Nitrate: 10
Phosphate: 2
PH: 8
KH: 3
GH: 11

Nitrates stayed the same.
Phosphates dropped pretty dramatically. (which I'm thinking is good because of all the algae I got overnight - is this correct thinking?)
PH jumped up (extremely bad for the fish, right? Also, if my tap water has a lower PH than my tank, why would a water change raise it?).
KH stayed the same.
GH dropped a little.

I have driftwood in the tank, and some rocks which I tested with vinegar before putting them in. I also have red fluorite and a small amount of silica gravel.

Should I dose now using the EI method?

Should I do another water change tomorrow to combat the algae?

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Cheesehead Cory

· #10 · Sep 14, 2007

Your brown spots are most likely diatoms, common in new tanks. It will clear on its own, but algae eaters love the stuff. If you're going to get algae eaters anyway, it'd make a fine "welcome home" treat. I swear my CAE grew half an inch during my diatom phase.

The EI guidelines in the sticky are for CO2 enriched tanks. You don't want to dose that often until you have your CO2 running. Tom Barr has suggested just dosing once a week in a non-CO2 tank, so that's what I do in my 33gal/55w/non-CO2 tank, occasionally skipping a week. You would probably also do well to decrease your lighting until you've got CO2.

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Johnny Relentless

Discussion Starter · #11 · Sep 14, 2007

Whew! Thanks I was a little worried there.
I just added Flourish Excel, people seem to be saying it fights algae, even though that's not what it is marketed for. Plus the carbon will be good for my plants.
They are growing pretty fast. Should I change water every few days and try to keep phosphates down? Or should I add phosphates to keep the plants growing?

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Carissa

· #12 · Sep 20, 2007

I see no reason to limit phosphates. If you starve your plants of any nutrients, algae will then start taking over. The brown algae will go away on it's own, you can clean it off now and then if you're worried about it. So yes, start dosing ei now but only once, or twice a week if you're doing Excel too, until you get co2. And I agree, limit your lights a bit until you get things going. Too much light is only going to invite more algae and won't help your plants.

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