Treating ick on heat sensitive fish (With Shrimp!)

2364 Views 13 Replies 7 Participants Last post by roadmaster, May 19, 2014

Kehy

Discussion Starter · May 15, 2014

I've got a 5 gallon with ~10 heterandria formosa, a small native livebearer and some of my only shrimp (red rilis with interesting genetics). Last weekend I broke down the tank and redid the substrate (removed dirt from under a gravel cap). Obviously, despite my best efforts, this was a little stressful on the fish, and last night I noticed a young male fish with small white specks on him. Other fish have been scratching and seeming unhappy (hiding more, faded colors, not showing off like they usually do), but I figured that was from the rescape and them having to deal with too much flow from the filter (working on that).

Honestly I haven't had ick in years, and it seemed to come out of nowhere. I haven't added anything to the tank, and when I broke it down to redo the substrate, I kept all the plants and driftwood wet in the fish bucket with the filter, fish, and shrimp. They seemed alright with that, unhappy but dealing with it.

Since I saw little white specs on a sluggish and pale fish with somewhat clamped fins, I figured it was ick. From experience with this colony of fish, they don't like temps over 80, and I'm wary about using meds with my shrimp. I'm considering just trying the salt treatment, but is there something else I can do? I don't have anywhere else to put the shimp.

TL;DR: Will salt alone work as and ick treatment if I can't remove shrimp and the fish don't handle high temps well?

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Bryanmc1988

· #2 · May 15, 2014

this would be hard as you cant heat up the tank fish fish inside as the ich will just reproduce faster... but you have sensitive fish and shrimps which means you cant heat the tank or they die.... what i would do is take the shrimps out as they cant get ich put them in a spear tank, then with the tank that is infected, i would dose come medications in small amounts about half of what the bottle says and see how your fish reacts to it... if their ok for the next few days then add just a pinch more ever few days till u reach max dosage on the bottle or when your fish reacts bad to the meds...

if the fish reacts bad to it then do a 25% water change and you should then know how much your fish can handle... then treat the tank every time you do a water change... till all the ich is gone off the fish then continue treatment with meds for the next 2 weeks just to be sure all the ich are dead...

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Kehy

Discussion Starter · #3 · May 15, 2014

Bryanmc1988 said:
this would be hard as you cant heat up the tank fish fish inside as the ich will just reproduce faster... but you have sensitive fish and shrimps which means you cant heat the tank or they die.... what i would do is take the shrimps out as they cant get ich put them in a spear tank, then with the tank that is infected, i would dose come medications in small amounts about half of what the bottle says and see how your fish reacts to it... if their ok for the next few days then add just a pinch more ever few days till u reach max dosage on the bottle or when your fish reacts bad to the meds...

if the fish reacts bad to it then do a 25% water change and you should then know how much your fish can handle... then treat the tank every time you do a water change... till all the ich is gone off the fish then continue treatment with meds for the next 2 weeks just to be sure all the ich are dead...

Unfortunately I don't have a spare tank that's fit for shrimp (only other option is a 3/4 gallon bowl that's cycling with high ammonia) so any treatment has to be done with shrimp in the tank.

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mistergreen

· #4 · May 15, 2014

hmm. Did you introduce something in the tank recently. Ick don't pop up from nowhere.

Heat treatment works to speed up the ice life cycle. Provide lots of aeration. I'd be more worried for your shrimp with the heat.

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Kehy

Discussion Starter · #5 · May 15, 2014

mistergreen said:
hmm. Did you introduce something in the tank recently. Ick don't pop up from nowhere.

Heat treatment works to speed up the ice life cycle. Provide lots of aeration. I'd be more worried for your shrimp with the heat.

I haven't, haven't added anything new in 3+ months. Again, I can't raise the heat more than 80 or the fish really don't do well, even with extra aeration. My particular colony of Het Formosas prefer cooler temps (60-75) than warmer.

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greaser84

· #6 · May 15, 2014

Instead of moving the shrimp I'd move the fish. I'd set up a temporary QT tank with another tank or some kind of plastic container. Put the fish in the container or whatever you choose, set up an old filter with some used media, then treat the fish for a couple weeks. Any parasite in the main tank will die without a host. That way you don't have to move the shrimp or worry about meds harming them.

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mistergreen

· #7 · May 15, 2014

Kehy said:
I haven't, haven't added anything new in 3+ months. Again, I can't raise the heat more than 80 or the fish really don't do well, even with extra aeration. My particular colony of Het Formosas prefer cooler temps (60-75) than warmer.

Most 'cold water' fish can stand high temps for a short amount of time. A table spoon/10G of salt should help too.

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mistergreen

· #8 · May 15, 2014

Kehy said:
I haven't, haven't added anything new in 3+ months.

Hmm, are you sure it's ick?
pictures?

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Kehy

Discussion Starter · #9 · May 16, 2014

mistergreen said:
Hmm, are you sure it's ick?
pictures?

Unfortunately the one fish showing external signs is a 1/2" sand-colored fish in a sand-colored tank. He's got small white specks, just a few of them, all along is body, appears to be attached to his skin, even along his mouth. I haven't seen him rubbing against things, but he's difficult to observe in general. If it's only an individual fish, I can pull it out and quarentine that fish.

Other symptoms included sluggishness, washed out color, rubbing against things, semi-clamped fins, and not too interested in eating. I say included because I first noticed the sick fish while I was feeding some live daphnia (via a container pond), and while they were hunting, ALL of the fish came out of hiding, colored up, and starting behaving like normal. The sick fish was keeping more to himself, but was still somewhat colored up, and more energetic than I've seen most ill fish. This morning, the fish were still better colored and behaving like their usual selves.

The change happened within moments of adding live critters for them to hunt, and in hopes of keeping them happy and strengthening them up with nutritious food, I gave them more live daphnia again today. They have been eating a standard omnivore flake food, and frozen daphnia. I guess they just decided that with a new scape, they needed a new diet as well. Odd.

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Grah the great

· #10 · May 16, 2014

H. formosa can be found in Florida, so I doubt they are particularly heat sensitive...sure, they like subtropical temps, but I doubt they will complain if you up the temperature to help you get rid of ich.

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roadmaster

· #11 · May 16, 2014

Have used product Quikcure at half dose with cherry shrimp present while treating cardinal tetra's/otocinclus.
No need to raise temp with this med.

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Kehy

Discussion Starter · #12 · May 16, 2014 (Edited)

roadmaster said:
Have used product Quikcure at half dose with cherry shrimp present while treating cardinal tetra's/otocinclus.
No need to raise temp with this med.

Thanks, I'll be on the lookout for that. My LPS has a very limited selection, so hopefully they have it. Can/should I use salt with this?

Update: Fish are still active and no longer clamping fins. Noticed they were pale when I fist turned the lights on, but colored up quickly (like many other fish species). First time I've seen my bunch do it.

Also could not find the fish with the spots on it. Last night I'd quarentined him so I could get pics (none turned out) and this morning he's gone. Not in the quarentine, not in the cycling bowl next to it, not dried up out of the tank. Odd.

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Oceangirl

· #13 · May 16, 2014

I would invest in some Seachem Paraguard. I have treated Ich in a planted tank, with cherries, Panda Cories, and Galaxy Rasboras. You'll just have to treat longer and vacuum the substrate every other day. Good luck. Did you introduce any new plants? Ich can lay dormant till a tasty snack comes by!

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roadmaster

· #14 · May 19, 2014

Kehy said:
Thanks, I'll be on the lookout for that. My LPS has a very limited selection, so hopefully they have it. Can/should I use salt with this?

Update: Fish are still active and no longer clamping fins. Noticed they were pale when I fist turned the lights on, but colored up quickly (like many other fish species). First time I've seen my bunch do it.

Also could not find the fish with the spots on it. Last night I'd quarentined him so I could get pics (none turned out) and this morning he's gone. Not in the quarentine, not in the cycling bowl next to it, not dried up out of the tank. Odd.

No.I would not use salt unless I was using heat/salt method.

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