[Krib]

Hi. I started my tank in mid November. Things were going great and growing in and I was about to happily post some update pics in my build thread. Then, in the past couple of weeks, I was blindsided by an absolute blizzard of blue/green, BBA, and GHA that has me wondering if I should tear down and start over.

Build thread is here for equipment and tank size.

Livestock is:

• 6 Celestial Pearl Danios
• 10 Ember tetras
• 4 assorted Neocardinia shrimp
• 4 Cory Sterbae
• 2 Nerite snails

Plants are:

• A large, dense growth of Stargrass
• Jungle val
• Anubias Barteri and Congensis
• Assorted Crypts
• Dwarf Sag

Water chemistry is:

• Ammonia - 0 ppm
• Nitrite - 0 ppm
• pH - 6.7 going down to 6.1 during the day
• Nitrate - Was high at 40-80ppm (I can't read the API kit colors) until I did a 75% water change this weekend. Now it's 20-40 ppm (I can't read those colors either).
• GH - 3 dGH
• KH - 4 dKH

Husbandry is:

• Light for 6 hours per day at 90% of this Twinstar.
• C02 for an hour before lights on and off an hour before lights off, drops the pH by about .70.
• I feed the fish lightly every other day.
• I dose with NiloCG Thrive (the original)... I was doing 5ml 3 times per week but have cut back to 5ml once per week.
• I do 50% water changes once per week (EI). My water is very soft, so I re-mineralize with Seachem Alkaline buffer and NiloCG GH booster in my water change container.

I have blue green algae in what is something of a dead spot on the opposite side to my powerhead, BBA all over, GHA all over. It's astonishing. The pace of the outbreak is so fast. The tank is acting like I don't maintain it and have a huge nutrient imbalance. This isn't the case. The one thing that did happen was that I had some Lud Orvalis that didn't do well. It grew in leggy and weak and eventually melted. I pulled it all out when I saw that, but it probably had a week to melt. I cannot keep red plants. I'm not sure if that's because I don't dose extra iron.

As for actions taken, I cut down ferts as mentioned and also did that larger water change when I noticed nitrate was high. I bought some Flourish Excel today and squirted it on some of the Dwarf Sag with the filter off, but it's going to be like boiling the ocean. If I'm being honest, I don't know what to do.

Help is appreciated. I've put a lot of love into this tank (my first planted) and don't want to see it fail. Pics are attached below. They don't really do it justice, there's algae on every plant and it's increasing exponentially.

 

[CoveBeach]

From what i am reading your plant mass is not out competing the algae at this point. I also am thinking the bags of soil are supplying all the extra nutrients the algae is using and adding ferts on top of that is where the problem is. I would quit the ferts for now, continue with decent size water changes at least twice a week and see how it goes. This is my thought, hopefully others will chime in.

 

[Krib]

Thanks! There's no soil, just inert pool sand. I don't think that's easy to tell from my build thread though as I changed my mind on substrate midway through.

 

[zdrc]

This looks like staghorn algae, not BBA, and I think staghorn is associated with excess fertilizer/ammonia. I have this problem right now too. I upgraded my light, but I'm not injecting CO2. I feed the tank pretty well and I've been dosing an all-in-one with macros (NilocG Thrive, like you). As a result, my nitrate and phosphate are a little to high (40-80ish, 2-4ish ppm). My plan is to do a large water change and stop dosing for a while. It sounds like you might've had a similar thing happen. I think you've already taken some good steps to fix the problem. Now, I would try to physically remove/kill as much of the algae as possible and hope that it won't grow back now that you've changed the conditions.

 

[vraev]

Hi there,

It is interesting that you are facing this issue. I also made a planted tank just using fluorite black and mostly caribsea sand. I have been dealing with a lot of stag horn algae, BBA, hair algae and green algae. I think it was multiple factors that I realized: lack of aqua soil, too much light (cut it down from 80% to 50% max) and another major one for me was temperature (too low). I personally think the lack of aqua soil may have something to do with the balance/stability of water parameters. Again, that's just a theory.

I pretty much added heat to make the tank stable at 70F (the heater died and it was like 65 - 68F). I sprayed H202 on the algae, added excel after water changes, lowered light levels...and try to keep feeding low. It is slowly making a difference.

 

[Krib]

Thanks! It's definitely a pickle. Would you both be kind enough to make your own threads? Our tank variables are all totally different, so things will surely get confused if everyone posts pics of their tank in this thread and asks for advice

cc: @somewhatshocked

 

[zdrc]

Thanks! It's definitely a pickle. Would you both be kind enough to make your own threads? Our tank variables are all totally different, so things will surely get confused if everyone posts pics of their tank in this thread and asks for advice

cc: @somewhatshocked

I wasn't asking for advice. I was giving it. I simply noted that you had already done what I would suggest (large water change, reduction in ferts) and that I didn't think you had BBA but instead have staghorn (the algae is clearly branched).

Is the algae continuing to grow at a fast rate or have you noticed any differences since the larger water change this weekend?

According to 2hr aquarist, staghorn is associated with high organic waste levels and instability. How long ago did the Lud Orvalis melt? Any clue what your CO2 levels are? Have you noticed any fluctuations in them recently or is your pH drop consistent? Any changes in feeding or loss of livestock?

 

[somewhatshocked]

Thanks! It's definitely a pickle. Would you both be kind enough to make your own threads? Our tank variables are all totally different, so things will surely get confused if everyone posts pics of their tank in this thread and asks for advice

cc: @somewhatshocked

Both people appear to be sharing their experiences in hopes of helping you come up with solutions. Not sure I see why they would need to start their own threads. They're not asking for advice.

Though, one of them is mistaken. You don't need Aqua Soil, an ADA brand, to do anything. Also don't need any other brand of clay/dirt-based substrate. Sand is obviously fine in planted tanks because there are tens of thousands of those tanks documented here on the forum.

 

[Krib]

Both people appear to be sharing their experiences in hopes of helping you come up with solutions. Not sure I see why they would need to start their own threads. They're not asking for advice.

Fair enough. My apologies to everyone. I was seeing pictures of other setups and got concerned the thread would be derailed. It's not always easy to know why one setup would get algae, let alone a different one with other equipment, water chemistry, livestock, etc.

To answer @zdrc, the Lud melted a couple of weeks ago, so the timing is right. I'm not sure what my CO2 levels are off the cuff, but I think that at my pH, I should be within a good saturation based on how much I'm dropping during the day. I did remove my C02 monitor, which I found annoying, and need to put it back in.

There's been no livestock loss (I haven't lost any fish during the life of this tank) and feeding has been constant. I also cleaned the filter, minus biomedia, a couple of weeks ago.

I'm still not sure if this is staghorn or BBA. I'll try to get more pics.

Again, sorry about getting grumpy.

 

[somewhatshocked]

Again, sorry about getting grumpy.

I know I don't speak for everyone but I'm sure you don't need to apologize.

Algae is one of those things that cause us all to pull our hair out sometimes.

 

[zdrc]

Fair enough. My apologies to everyone. I was seeing pictures of other setups and got concerned the thread would be derailed. It's not always easy to know why one setup would get algae, let alone a different one with other equipment, water chemistry, livestock, etc.

To answer @zdrc, the Lud melted a couple of weeks ago, so the timing is right. I'm not sure what my CO2 levels are off the cuff, but I think that at my pH, I should be within a good saturation based on how much I'm dropping during the day. I did remove my C02 monitor, which I found annoying, and need to put it back in.

There's been no livestock loss (I haven't lost any fish during the life of this tank) and feeding has been constant. I also cleaned the filter, minus biomedia, a couple of weeks ago.

I'm still not sure if this is staghorn or BBA. I'll try to get more pics.

Again, sorry about getting grumpy.

No problem, I've seen lots of posts get derailed so it's a valid worry.

The melt combined with the disruption to the filter could've messed with the stability of your system. Hard to know for sure right now. Interestingly I had some Alternanthera reineckii melt in my system corresponding with the staghorn I'm getting. Perhaps something about melting plants in particular can trigger an algae outbreak like this.

I'd get after the algae now. I think you've corrected the core problem, and you are just dealing with the aftermath now. If the algae continues to grow back aggressively then I'm not sure what the problem is.

 

[Krib]

The melt combined with the disruption to the filter could've messed with the stability of your system. Hard to know for sure right now. Interestingly I had some Alternanthera reineckii melt in my system corresponding with the staghorn I'm getting. Perhaps something about melting plants in particular can trigger an algae outbreak like this.

I'd get after the algae now. I think you've corrected the core problem, and you are just dealing with the aftermath now. If the algae continues to grow back aggressively then I'm not sure what the problem is.

Yeah, what worries me is that this week after I did the 75% water change was the strongest algae growth yet. I have a feeling that short of a teardown, this will be a long recovery.

Has anyone used Excel with good results in this situation? I can't spot treat because algae is everywhere, but I can add it after water changes, etc.

Another thing that has me wondering is my C02 cannister. It's a 5-pounder and I connected it in late November. It still shows enough juice, and comes up to 30 psi working pressure / reliably drops the pH. But it's the first one I've ever used, so I'm unsure if this is a crazy amount of time to use it. Almost four months!

 

[somewhatshocked]

Has anyone used Excel with good results in this situation? I can't spot treat because algae is everywhere, but I can add it after water changes, etc.

Excel's never been a winner for me but hydrogen peroxide has been with staghorn. Spot treating, of course, which is extremely time consuming but could be worth it. You could spot dose it on water change day. Though peroxide neutralizes pretty quickly, you'd have the added security of a water change a bit later to assuage any fears/worry.

Betting you could hit most spots in your tank in about 10-15 minutes.

 

[Krib]

Excel's never been a winner for me but hydrogen peroxide has been with staghorn. Spot treating, of course, which is extremely time consuming but could be worth it. You could spot dose it on water change day. Though peroxide neutralizes pretty quickly, you'd have the added security of a water change a bit later to assuage any fears/worry.

Betting you could hit most spots in your tank in about 10-15 minutes.

The stuff people are saying is staghorn (I'm sure it is, it just looks like BBA to me) is everywhere. It's super-deep in the dwarf sag, so I'm not sure if I could spot that. One thing I will do is drop down the water level and paint the bad spots on the driftwood with peroxide with a little paintbrush. I can't remember which YouTuber demo'd that trick.

 

[somewhatshocked]

I'm not sure if I could spot that.

Just get a squirty bottle of some sort usually in the travel section of Target or Walmart - or even a small spray bottle - and go absolutely ham on it all. I have a $1 condiment squeeze bottle I sometimes use for that sort of thing but find it's easier to use smaller travel size containers even if I have to refill them a couple times.

Rinse and repeat over the course of a week or two while trying to get everything else under control and see if it helps.

 

[Krib]

How often can I spot with peroxide? Do I use literally straight-up peroxide or dilute?

 

[somewhatshocked]

How often can I spot with peroxide? Do I use literally straight-up peroxide or dilute?

If it were me, I'd search around to find a few people who have treated with it and find a happy medium you're comfortable with in terms of dilution. Some will say you need to, some will say you won't and most will include their reasoning. I'm hesitant to tell anyone which method is best. But... I've never diluted it when spot treating and I keep extremely sensitive shrimp, mind you.

You could probably treat it every day if you wanted. If it were me, I'd do it every couple days just because I hate messing with my tanks on a daily basis. And, honestly, I'd probably just do it on water change days because of laziness. But you can definitely do it more frequently than once per week.

 

[jaydazell]

No need to nuke the tank. Just breathe.
I personally would drain the tank as far as i can reasonably and spray everything down with peroxide and let it dwell for 3-5 minutes. Then trim leaves that are damaged if you have any.
After that fill her up and then spot treat every day until its gone

 

[Goodwood]

Hydrogen peroxide undiluted (3% concentration) has worked for me on several occasions and I used it liberally. I use a small syringe or pipette to spot treat with the filter off, also manual removal in conjunction will be best! I would also note that reducing lighting intensity has always helped me when going toe to toe with algae.

 

[Krib]

Thanks, all! Here's what I'm planning. Do you see any gaps?

• Reduce light on the Twinstar to 60% intensity from 90%. Too far?
• Stop fertilizing completely.
• Add Flourish Excel to my water changes.
• Three times a week, spot treat with peroxide in a squeeze bottle. On water change days, mist plants with a spray bottle of peroxide when the level is low.
• Paint my driftwood with peroxide.

What nitrate level should I target? I can get it down to zero if I change a lot of water because I won't be fertilizing and my bioload is light.