[Jim_PA]

Any downside for not having sump return pump in the middle of the sump, rather than on the right or left side. my pump always seems running out of water never had this problem with my old sUmp when it was in the middle

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[HD Blazingwolf]

baffle design?
is there enough water in the system total??

 

[Jim_PA]

Yes has ton water, I have foam right before the pump. Maybe that the problem. Or need to turn pump down. Baffle 3 been removed. Right filter socks, 2nd chamber bio bale, 3rd bioballs heater, 4th is foam then pump.

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[HD Blazingwolf]

I just don't see how if there is enough water in the system its not making it to ur pump. if it wasn't draining fast enough. it would just overflow the top of the tank. if there is enough water it should just overflowing the baffle or underflowing if that's the case and be returned. are u sucking up bubbles sometimes then?

a picture is worth a thousand words

 

[Craigthor]

If the sump is running dry the pump is moving more water to the tank then the tank is returning. With a well tuned system the tank and sump should stay at a fairly constant level minus evaporation.

 

[Jim_PA]

So it sounds like I just need to tune it a bit more so it balances, and don't need to move the pump.

 

[Jim_PA]

Excuse the mess in the stand, I still need to clean up and mickey mouse bucket works perfect for slight drip I have in a union that I need to replace. :hihi:

 

[HD Blazingwolf]

if the water isn't close to the rim of the tank. i'd add more just based off that picture. if the tank stays full and the sump does not fill up at all. then ur pump is pushing more than ur drain can handle

 

[Jim_PA]

The tank is about 1/2 to 3/4 inch from the top, bit higher than I would like it. When the pump off, the sump fills up. I am thinking you are right just need to turn the flow down on the pump and see how it goes? I was also thinking about adding bio bale where the foam is since I have 2 extra bags still.

 

[DaveK]

You issuse is that the return area of your sump is much too small.

In other words, the amount of water needed to be pumped to the display tank for the overflow in the tank to function properly is greater than the amount of water the return area can hold. This causes the return area to empty, and your pump run dry.

As an example, take a look at this manufacturer's sump (offsite link) - http://www.superskimmer.com/48_Sump.htm

Note that the return area on the right, is about 1/2 the entire sump. It's true that this is a sump specifically designes for a reef system and in that application, that return area may have other things in it and the flow through it tends to be much greater that what is typically used for a planted tank, but you get the idea.

I think you best long term solution would be to rebuild your sump, making the return area larger. You might want to use either a larger tank or two tanks for the sump to get in every feature you want.

You could restrict the flow from the return pump, but that's going to be counter productive, and the water level in your main tank will be a bit lower.

 

[Jim_PA]

You issuse is that the return area of your sump is much too small.

In other words, the amount of water needed to be pumped to the display tank for the overflow in the tank to function properly is greater than the amount of water the return area can hold. This causes the return area to empty, and your pump run dry.

As an example, take a look at this manufacturer's sump (offsite link) - http://www.superskimmer.com/48_Sump.htm

Note that the return area on the right, is about 1/2 the entire sump. It's true that this is a sump specifically designes for a reef system and in that application, that return area may have other things in it and the flow through it tends to be much greater that what is typically used for a planted tank, but you get the idea.

I think you best long term solution would be to rebuild your sump, making the return area larger. You might want to use either a larger tank or two tanks for the sump to get in every feature you want.

You could restrict the flow from the return pump, but that's going to be counter productive, and the water level in your main tank will be a bit lower.

ugh, that not good. I just built this sump about 2 weeks ago to replace my old one. since the tank is fully stocked, with 100's of dollars worth of fish, I don't think rebuilding the sump is an option since I am not sure what I would do for the 48 hours it would take to let it dry. now I am not sure what to do. As far as larger tank, that the biggest tank that will fit under my stand, it 38 gallons. I have to put it in from the front, no side door, so I don't have much room to work with. 40, 50 or 55 won't fit.

 

[Jim_PA]

What if I were to just take out the last 2 baffle and use foam as my divider? That would be the simplest fix?

 

[HD Blazingwolf]

Can u drill holes in the bottom of the baffle to increase flow? I know it would be easy to drill higher up im just thinking to reduce splashing and noise?

U could take that baffle out and add one of those tank dividers that is drilled and slottrd. Make the whole bigger and keep the foam where it is?

 

[Jim_PA]

What about just moving the pump to the middle section.

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[Jim_PA]

The far left baffle is already 2 inches up from the bottom, could I not just remove this baffle and problem would be solved? Seems like that is my only option or go buy another tank and build another sump. ugh.

 

[HD Blazingwolf]

DON'T BUY ANOTHER TANK!!! this is supposed to be an enjoyable hobby
lol
u could cut that baffle out...
or just turn ur gate valve slightly. im still under the impression ur drain isn't returning water as fast as the pump is filling.. sump space or not. if there was enough water flowing. it wouldn't be an issue i wouldn't think

 

[HD Blazingwolf]

i could be wrong........ but my sump is this way. (except i have lots of pump area volume) if i don't have enough water in the system my pump sucks up air. or i can turn down the flow ad more water will drain and it will work fine im just following my example's logic

 

[NWA-Planted]

The pump area is not to small I am saying and sticking to a balance issue! it should not make any difference how large or small the area where the pump sits. its a total system operation if there is enough water it fills as fast as it empties, ASSUMING its balanced, I say this cause my Sump on a 125 gallon tank is only a 20 long and I top off every one to two days due to evap and my return pump area is smaller then that...

Not pictured is one baffle with filter floss...

Its a flow issue has to, try two things, throttle the pump back, you have 1800gph pump on a 90? Gallon even throttled back your going to have plenty of flow....

Secondly take out your bio Bale as it is probably crammed full of nasty and could be inhibiting flow some if it is put some clean stuff back in.

You have a great setup just needs some tweaking

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[Jim_PA]

Ok, good about a new sump, think wife my divorce me if she were to see another new tank.

It supposed to be enjoyable hobby? No one told me that ha ha. To be honest though my congo tetras are supposed to be in this morning I am very excited.

The more I think about this problem with my sump, the more I have to wonder if it an
evaporation problem, and since I have less room in my return pump area I have more problems than other people would see.

Right now my tank is open along with the sump. I have glass top's that will be in today as well then my canopy will sit on top like it does now. Also have a guy making me a custom top for the sump .

So if just guess about the evaporation problem, for example 2 hours ago I filled up the return pump area to right below the union and the water level stays normal.

So do I remove the last baffle? Or do I wait and see what happens once I have the glass top on the tank and the top on the sump?

I was just going to fill the middle section of the sump with bio bale, so I could just move the foam over if you think that would be better in the long run, or for that matter pull it out.

 

[jcgd]

I put a downturned elbow on the intake of my pump so the water level can drop more without sucking air.

If the water levels isn't dropping in the return chamber while the pump is running I can't see how water out doesn't equal the water returning.