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Prices terrorism Indonesia

1588 Views 16 Replies 12 Participants Last post by  ikuzo, 
P
Hello guys,

A few weeks ago I have launched a serious ask for help at the MAC forum(s). Help with receiving some CR grade A, Tiger shrimps, Malaysian rainbow shrimps and Bee shrimp (Caridina Cantonensis):help:
- From all the people who did read my scream, just two nice persons did give an response. To give the shrimps after a payment of course, this is not the problem, the problem is: how to get them alive in my aquariums. One of them, member “ppyeoh”, did like to bring this shrimps personally to Jakarta because several times a year he comes to this country to do some business. :icon_smil Great, fantastic but, the custom officials of this country are unbelievable incompetent and more corrupt than you ever can imagine.:icon_evil This very kind and very nice reaction of Yeoh did have to cancel….. Several times I have asked my selves, what kind of drug or medicine Immigration / Custom-officials of this country must consume every day. What do have this spirit narrow result it makes possible for them to be so shameless, unbelievable corrupt busy with their job. When I was one of them, immediately I was immigrating to a place in Farawayistan where nobody can recognize me… Extortion does have an more civilized name called: “Culture”….. :hihi: And nobody likes, or really does have the “balls” to do something about this destructive “culture”… From MAC member Kevin Tan who also do sometimes business with Indonesian primates I did receive an address from a person he did call “My friend”.. and do live in Bogor. His name is Jeffrey… This did give me some hope of course…. Specially because Kevin did called him: “his friend”. After a mail I did received a very kind and nice reply. Jeffrey did like to help me with some shrimps. No problem at all… . A few days’ later he did asked me for more information about my self and give this to him. Now Jeffrey did realize I am a Dutch man……. He did give me quickly a reply and did let me know, he do only export……:tongue: What is going one and did give him a very clear mail and again I did receive back the message; he will help me. I did make an appointment and a week later after five hours of travel I arrived at the place he has given to me. The name I did read at a small nameplate called: CV MAJU :icon_excl did give me a very bad taste. I did recognise this name of an long list of fraudulent firms immediately and did realize, to be very carefully. I did come in his office and somebody did tell to me: Jeffrey is to fitness and we do only export….. :help: The foreigners do like to pay 80 US dollar a piece for the shrimps. And do have to order a minimum of thousand shrimps… :icon_eek: We do export to Holland and Belgium to many importers. 80 dollar a piece why’ll they are grade C or less. A bloody lie of course… :icon_evil I do know very well there is absolutely no Indonesian export of shrimps to Holland. I am free lance agent for several import/export firms in Europe so they did show to me their real attitude like I did have all ready from almost all the other exporters of this country and did leave this office with a very bad temper of course. This is Indonesia and so this people do like to do business. A business based at only quantity and not quality. Receive big money because the crazy foreigners like to pay a lot of money for this shrimps. Much, much more than they ever can and shall receive from the Indonesian people. I am sure, you all shall say: this is a very bad development. Not good for business and certainly not good for the shrimps as well…. personaly I do see this as an nasty PRICES TERRORISM
To: All the importers World Wide of freshwater aquarium-shrimps from Indonesia…. When you do like information about the exporters of this country, just give me a PM and you’ll receive all the needed information for free…….

PeterB
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medicineman
... And why do you think it is hard for guy like me to lay my hands on just one quality shrimp? (I mean they are being bred locally here).

All sorts of beurocrats and all sorts of monopoly. Layers upon layers of "tables" to be given envelope just to make things work/done express.

We just stay united as hobbyist and by then we eventually can get some "leaks" from good relations.
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SearunSimpson
Couldn't you get them ordered from a member on here from the US or Canada and then breed them out yourselves, creating your own market and income? It would be good, that way you could support other Indonesian hobbyists.
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fishscale
You'd have to get them into the country...which would be difficult.
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P
Many people did offered help. People from Malaysia, Singapore, Thailand, many friends from Holland.... The shrimps are not the problem. The problem is the brutal, incompetent and absolutely shameless custom officials and the immigration offiscial at the airport of Jakarta... They do open everything of letters, packages and boxes. Evenb when all the paperworks are included like Phyto certificates etc., etc. so they can read what is inside the box.. They do open everything with all the nasty consequences of dying shrimps or what so ever...
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P
sorry to hear about your troubles. poor little shrimp! customs agents all over the world are known for being difficult, but it sounds like yours are especially bad. good luck!

-D
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W
If the package is shipped via FedEx or UPS, is it safer or more secure?

The reason I ask is because maybe customs will be reluctant to mess with those carriers packages versus the regular mail?

Just a guess?

-Ryan
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P
shrimps

Delivery with FedEx or UPS.. :eek5: It does not make anny different. :mad: Here in Indonesia this transporters do have other rules than in siviliced countries.:icon_roll
Even when I do pay the transportcost immediatly by placing an order, as soon as they arrive in Indonesia, suddenly I have to pay again. :confused: Even the administration costs for this transportfirms...:mad: But all the packages shall opened by the customofficials... Culture remember...
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T
personally, I would have given up on that type of shrimp a long time ago.
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C
When they open it, do they open it in front of you? If they do, will you be able to pay them extra (tip) to take extra careful of the package because it contains fish?
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medicineman
As a local here, I can only give these tips for so far importing plants and aquatic creatures as I know :

-Know your customs officials well.
-Be sure to know exactly when will your package arrive.
-Notice them in advance and have clear papers/documents ready.
-Generous amount of sweet talk and be ready to shove in deep into your pockets just for the tip/"envelope".
-Expect some extra charges and difficulties because you are a privateer. Who knows if affiliation do exist with the "monopoly mafia" and it is exactly what they do to keep the "envelope" and "good relation" business going on.

*ps : customs people, please do not be offended because of what I say. It is just the way it goes over there I know, you guys never get salary paid enough for the job anyway!

Now I have never imported fish/shrimp myself, but our local guys do import aquatic plants occasionaly.

@Peter,

Dont get stressed about this. Make your life easy. Get some red crystal, pinnochio shrimp and such of exotic Indonesian origin/breed instead.
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K
I don't know what all the fuss is about? What's all this pointing fingers and shouting "corrupt"??

In my honest opinion, the customs officials have a job to do, and they are doing it... preventing anything illegal from entering the country and a shrimp (or anything live for that matter) should go thru the propper channels, have propper clearance and health certificates issued by the propper authorities. Why should there be any exception just for you?

We want our countries to be safer, yet at the same time we want exceptions for ourselves? That's a bit selfish isn't it?

To digress, if you think the Indonesian customs are bad, maybe you should go to Australia!:) A lady was arrested at the airport bringing in some exotic plecos and dragged through the slammer and court. I believe the final penalty fine was around about a six figure sum in Australia. If you ever try sending a parcel even by post or courier with live fish, (or even plant, or soil for that matter), I'd say 99% of the time, the Australian customs will pick it up and issue the person you were trying to send to with a warning and possibly even a hefty fine. It it is contraband, it is contraband.... I'm sorry, but your mail is NOT private if it is illegal.

I have been in the international ornamental fish trade long enough to know a few things. Indonesia is a net tropical fish exporting country. In order to import live tropical fish (or shrimp for that matter), there are many many hurdles and hoops to jump thru, many government departments to deal with, and lots of tariffs and taxes to pay. So, for those that do jump the hurdles I see no problem why they'd not want to protect their interest. If they decide that they don't want to sell locally (in order to protect their own interest) and only for export, that is their perogative.

If you are a hobbyist in that country, I sympathise with you, but if you REALLY must have something then all I can say is, "Money talks. Bull**** walks".

U either bite the bullet, get the propper government approval to import and bring it in legally yourself; OR travel elsewhere and *smuggle* the contraband in yourself (and if you do get caught, don't winge! It was illegal anyway so be prepared to face the consequenses.); OR pay whatever is asked to get it locally (black market). It's THAT simple. If that doesn't fit with you, then move to another country.:icon_roll

Peter, I'm sorry, but your issue is a non-issue to me. What price terrorism??
Mind you, I know for a fact that in Australia, the going rate for C grade CRS is a mind boggling AUD$50/pc, "A" grades go for more than double that!! Hemianthus callictrichoides "Cuba" cost around about AUD$100 for 2square inches!!... and that's the way it is.
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squirrelproductions
As a country that has had actual terrorist attacks, I would think that Indonesians would be more "careful" in their word choice. But to compare the fee structure and/or corruption in Indonesian customs system to terrorism is just in poor taste and, frankly, sounds whiny.

Did any people die when you did not get your shrimp? Again, this is extremely poor word choice, I think, and little bit of "boy who cried wolf"-syndrome.
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E
jesus man just chill out TERRORISM TERRORISM TERRORISM no one is gunna die because of this
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ikuzo
sometimes having corrupt government officials can be annoying, but some other times it helps a lot. we local hobyist enjoying super cheap price of shrimps/fish/plants, but of course it's hard to find them in good quality. just like in any other mass producing countries.
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P
shrimps

Reading and understandable reading…...:eek5:

It is amazing and refreshing to read the differences of reactions at my article;:confused: Prices terrorism in Indonesia.:eek5: But,… but it become inconceivable for me when people of Indonesia, who do belong to the really rich people of this country, write shameless “how they do pay their custom officials”. Impudence or shamelessness is elevate to “Culture”..:mad: And that’s exactly the point and the proof of my integrity in this case. I do talk about two hundred million families, not persons but families who do live far below the poorness line. Have to live from, when they are “lucky”, 1 US dollar a day… Most days’ this amount is lower……:confused: In the year of our Lord 2007 people do die at the streets of Jakarta and many other places, because of hunger..:mad: When I did give you guys the impression, I did talk or complain about my self, because I cant reach the shrimps I do like.. I have to say, sorry, this really is beside reality. I do have my shrimps already for a long time. :icon_redf The point is, the past year it was possible for many people to buy Crystal Red and Crystal Black for 3000 to 4000 Rupiah = 30 – 40 dollar cent.. :) For this people a very high price for one very small shrimp but, payable for them. :) This year people do have to pay 35000 to 75000 Rupiah for the same bad quality of shrimps…. :icon_eek: Why this high prices.. Because in foreign countries like in Europe, they do like to pay this insane high prices for an shrimp …. :icon_eek: The very riches of this country who do control almost everything concerning business, :mad: do have a nice new toy to play with beside their Arrowannas, fancy cars, heavy shoppers, etc., etc. Realize this, for you all is an aquarium a nice hobby. Poor people also do like to have a hobby but, in this country, the most of them, they even can not dream about a hobby. :icon_redf This is something easy to forget.

Ta, ta, ta…:thumbsup: :)

PeterB
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ikuzo
everything you mentioned here happens elsewhere, not just in Indonesia. every country has poverty. if something is good with lots of demand, of course the price will rise. nothing new here.
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