Hmm yea i am also very interested in seeing what the pros have to say about this. I saw this last night and was wondering why did each website have different measurements, im getting my pps pro kit soon so i would like to know what dosing is better ?
PPS PRO Has been changed?
So poking around on the PPS Pro site.....
https://sites.google.com/site/aquaticplantfertilizer/home/pps-pro
Things have changed? Micro doses are now being recommended at 2 drops per 10g ?
I noticed nilocg recipe on his site is the old recipe and dosing, hopefully he can chime in on this.
Is there another thread on these changes that I missed?
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https://sites.google.com/site/aquaticplantfertilizer/home/pps-pro
Things have changed? Micro doses are now being recommended at 2 drops per 10g ?
I noticed nilocg recipe on his site is the old recipe and dosing, hopefully he can chime in on this.
Is there another thread on these changes that I missed?
.
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Micros were always .1ml per 10 gallon as far as I remembered.
How long have you been dosing PPS? I'm curious as to when it changed.Micros were always .1ml per 10 gallon as far as I remembered.
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My PPS Pro supplies from GLA was 1ml per 10 gallon for micro and macro (about 1.5 years old). Since then there has been a lot of discussion regarding micro toxicity. I belive the recommended dosage for Micros in the EI formula have also been reduced (not sure to what level).
I'm sure others will chime in with more info.
I'm sure others will chime in with more info.
From the Greenleaf site - Plantex CSM+B – 28.6 grams (Trace Elements (TE) recipe updated 4/11/2016, previous recommendation was 40 grams),
If 28.6g of TE yields .01 PPM FE then 40g of TE would have yielded approx .013 PPM. However, the site also states that the previous recommendation prior to 4/11/16 was 1ml per gallon, so if both the dose and the mix changed, the reduction in PPM cannot be 10 fold from .1 ppm to .01ppm, not exactly. Unless the product itself changed.
If I am incorrect, please show your math.
If 28.6g of TE yields .01 PPM FE then 40g of TE would have yielded approx .013 PPM. However, the site also states that the previous recommendation prior to 4/11/16 was 1ml per gallon, so if both the dose and the mix changed, the reduction in PPM cannot be 10 fold from .1 ppm to .01ppm, not exactly. Unless the product itself changed.
If I am incorrect, please show your math.
Edward made some changes to his site earlier in the year, late Spring maybe.So poking around on the PPS Pro site.....
Things have changed? Micro doses are now being recommended at 2 drops per 10g ?
Is there another thread on these changes that I missed?
Also he included a nitrate-free recipe for PPS Pro.
I think many have accepted that previous dosing methods could create micro toxicity issues.
I wonder why it's at 0.1ml per 10 gallons? Kind of makes dosing nano tanks under 5 gallons a PITA.Edward made some changes to his site earlier in the year, late Spring maybe.
Also he included a nitrate-free recipe for PPS Pro.
I think many have accepted that previous dosing methods could create micro toxicity issues.
Oops! 2 drops fell in my 5 gallon shrimp tank. I just double dosed my micros.
I would have thought they would keep the doses from bottle 1 and bottle 2 identical. Just makes life simpler.
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Just make weaker solution, like 2.9 g micro for 500 ml bottle and you can dose 1 ml daily for 10 gallon.
From the original 40g to 2.9g ? Were we overdosing that much? Omg my grand children won't need to buy CSM+B. Lol
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Well, just like KH2PO4 which lasts forever!From the original 40g to 2.9g ? Were we overdosing that much? Omg my grand children won't need to buy CSM+B. Lol
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This chance as well as a possible change to EI dosing were just brought to my attention. I havent made the change yet, but may do it soon in the future. The change in micro dosing for PPS doesnt seem all that well thought out. Why .1 per 10g instead of just reducing the amount of CSM+B in the bottle 10 fold and still dose 1ml per 10g like we are still doing for the macros?
Exactly what I thought. I kind of thought something that drastic of a change, to something a lot of us do daily would have been posted in here as a hot topic, or maybe I just missed it.This chance as well as a possible change to EI dosing were just brought to my attention. I havent made the change yet, but may do it soon in the future. The change in micro dosing for PPS doesnt seem all that well thought out. Why .1 per 10g instead of just reducing the amount of CSM+B in the bottle 10 fold and still dose 1ml per 10g like we are still doing for the macros?
So nilocg, you figure nel's suggestion of 2.9g per 500ml is the way to go to keep life simpler?
Has anyone switched over to these new dose rates for PPS? Any updates on it?
This may be the reason for the TDS climbs and shrimp deaths we've seen as well. Come to think of it, most of my shrimp deaths only incurred it tanks I dosed, even then I only dosed at 50% of the old recommendation.
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Exactly what I thought. I kind of thought something that drastic of a change, to something a lot of us do daily would have been posted in here as a hot topic, or maybe I just missed it.
So nilocg, you figure nel's suggestion of 2.9g per 500ml is the way to go to keep life simpler?
Has anyone switched over to these new dose rates for PPS? Any updates on it?
This may be the reason for the TDS climbs and shrimp deaths we've seen as well. Come to think of it, most of my shrimp deaths only incurred it tanks I dosed, even then I only dosed at 50% of the old recommendation.
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I was under the impression that PPS-PRO used to suggest 40g CSM+B, in that case I would suggest 4g. Im not sure where 2.9 came from but it would probably be ok as well.
On PPS-Pro website new recipe is for ~29g (dosing 0,1 ml a day). It was changed from 40 g (don't know when).
I just like how pretty soon you will need a lab grade pipette to dose your aquarium... Just because you can make such a concentrated solution does not mean any aquarist should. Think on your feet and as others suggested, put at least 10 times less solute in your solution and you get 1ml doses. Better would be to add 3 grams in 4 times the volume and dose 4ml each time.
The other thing is ... how many aquatic plant species did you see examined in controlled experiments ? where are the results published ? I mean the change is certainly motivated by tests with various concentrations, conditions and with conclusive results, not just random observations and guesswork like... well maybe half will be enough. Oh wait ! So if the people who decide on these values do so soley based on guess work, I have something better for you. Decide based on the growth of your plants. Let your plants dictate how much you should dose.
The other thing is ... how many aquatic plant species did you see examined in controlled experiments ? where are the results published ? I mean the change is certainly motivated by tests with various concentrations, conditions and with conclusive results, not just random observations and guesswork like... well maybe half will be enough. Oh wait ! So if the people who decide on these values do so soley based on guess work, I have something better for you. Decide based on the growth of your plants. Let your plants dictate how much you should dose.
Makes you wonder how they came up with it in the first place!The other thing is ... how many aquatic plant species did you see examined in controlled experiments ? where are the results published ? I mean the change is certainly motivated by tests with various concentrations, conditions and with conclusive results, not just random observations and guesswork like... well maybe half will be enough. Oh wait !
Exactly.So if the people who decide on these values do so soley based on guess work, I have something better for you. Decide based on the growth of your plants. Let your plants dictate how much you should dose.
All these "official" regimens should be viewed as starting points only, a reference from which to begin if all this is new to you.
Then after a while, if necessary, one can adjust the doses of this or that based on how their plants respond.
Just because a number changed doesnt mean you all have to suddenly adjust your routine. If it aint broke...there's no reason to start trying to fix it.
So the new dosing suggestion is 29g CSM+B into 500ml then dosing 0.1ml per 10g(adds 0.01ppm FE from CSM+B). That is 1/13th the old amount and 1/50th the EI amount. I too would like to see where people came up with these numbers.
Was 0.01ppm FE just a nice round number that sounded safe?
Was 0.01ppm FE just a nice round number that sounded safe?
There was a thread on APC a while back that i stumbled upon that was a collection of research by zappins on toxicities/deficiencies of various elements. Maybe one of these played a role in the changes to dosing?
Toxicity / Deficiency Literature Research - Plant Deficiencies - Aquatic Plant Central
I didn't really read through any of the micro toxicity stuff as I was more curious about potassium dosing, and the only take away I really had was that if you are WAY over dosing potassium (k2so4) (40ppm plus) without water changes over a couple week period you could start to bump into the sulphur toxicity point... other than that most things seemed pretty benign in the amounts we are dosing
Toxicity / Deficiency Literature Research - Plant Deficiencies - Aquatic Plant Central
I didn't really read through any of the micro toxicity stuff as I was more curious about potassium dosing, and the only take away I really had was that if you are WAY over dosing potassium (k2so4) (40ppm plus) without water changes over a couple week period you could start to bump into the sulphur toxicity point... other than that most things seemed pretty benign in the amounts we are dosing
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