The Planted Tank Forum banner
1 - 16 of 16 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi all. I’ve recently started my first high tech aquarium. It’s a 75 gallon with a Fluval 3.0 59w, a pressurized co2 system and inline atomizer, and Fluval 407 canister filter. The base substrate is seachem fluorite red, then a layer of tropica nutrition capsules, and topped with tropica aqua soil. I run the lighting at 100% for 10 hours a day at about 20” from the substrate. Co2 comes on 30 minutes before lights and turns off an hour before lights go off. I dose NilocG Thrive+ 5 pumps every 2 days, and NilocG Iron 7 pumps every 3. I do 30-50% water changes every 3 days. I have a violet lily pipe to help push the co2 towards the ground (trying to carpet monte carlo), and a powerhead on the opposite corner to help complete the water flow throughout the tank. The tank is fully cycled.
Parameters:
PH 6.8
GH 9
KH 5
Ammonia 0
Nitrites 0
Nitrates 30
Temperature 77

I used many tissue culture plants, and experienced the “normal” shock of planting and melting associated, but then after about 2 weeks, things started growing! However, over this past week, many plants have started to melt. It’s been 3.5 weeks since planting the Monte Carlo, which melted a lottt in the beginning but is still experiencing modern melting and very slow growth/spread. Even my Ludwigia super red that had been growing great has started to melt and stall. As you can see on the left, my dwarf saggitaria that was once green and spreading has almost fully melted away. My monte carlo hasn’t grown at all from what I can tell over the past week.
1026109
1026110

Today
1026111
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
150 Posts
Sounds like you are doing everything right. Wish I could offer some guidance. One thing I'd say is you don't need all those water changes but I wouldn't think that would effect plant growth. It always takes time for plants to settle in to a new tank. Have you had any other conditions change recently? I listened to a podcast recently where Diana Walstad talked about having a period during the day when lights were off to increase C02 uptake I believe. You can listen to it here.
Good luck.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Sounds like you are doing everything right. Wish I could offer some guidance. One thing I'd say is you don't need all those water changes but I wouldn't think that would effect plant growth. It always takes time for plants to settle in to a new tank. Have you had any other conditions change recently? I listened to a podcast recently where Diana Walstad talked about having a period during the day when lights were off to increase C02 uptake I believe. You can listen to it here.
Good luck.
Ya I agree. I’m slowly doing less water changes but I just was doing that much since I’ve had so much melting, so trying to keep any decaying plants and water effects limited.
I lowered my fertilization when I added my shrimp since I didn’t want to negatively effect them, but I’m still at/above the directions on the bottle. Maybe my plants got used to that higher fertilization?
Thanks! I’ll check it out. That’s an idea I read on another thread today as well so hopefully it will help.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4 Posts
If i get the number right, your light condition with 59W for 75g/283L would be considered a quite low lights (you can calculate this on www.flowgrow.de). Your Ludwigia Super Red (oh boy, this one really need lots of light) IMO would struggle a lot with this condition. You might want to consider Evo Quad LEDs and lower your lights duration to max 8 hours. I would beg differ about the water changes, you need it daily with the first months of planting but for 10-20is% daily, slowly reduced to a constant 20-25% every three days, and 30% every weeks after the first months rule achived. Plants thriving with the water change because it provides a whole new Co2 from the water but with the shrimp already added...you might want to stick with weekly change only (adding shrimp/fish when the tank not ready yet is not really good option for me). I would also turn the Co2 injection an hour before and an hour after the lights goes off. You might also want to put hydrocotyle tripartita as a 'parameters' plant. If you any problem with the lights, Co2, even algae, this plant is the first one visibly affected in my experiences. Dont worry too much cause i think youll find the right plant along the way and those monte carlo will be fine.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
If i get the number right, your light condition with 59W for 75g/283L would be considered a quite low lights (you can calculate this on www.flowgrow.de). Your Ludwigia Super Red (oh boy, this one really need lots of light) IMO would struggle a lot with this condition. You might want to consider Evo Quad LEDs and lower your lights duration to max 8 hours. I would beg differ about the water changes, you need it daily with the first months of planting but for 10-20is% daily, slowly reduced to a constant 20-25% every three days, and 30% every weeks after the first months rule achived. Plants thriving with the water change because it provides a whole new Co2 from the water but with the shrimp already added...you might want to stick with weekly change only (adding shrimp/fish when the tank not ready yet is not really good option for me). I would also turn the Co2 injection an hour before and an hour after the lights goes off. You might also want to put hydrocotyle tripartita as a 'parameters' plant. If you any problem with the lights, Co2, even algae, this plant is the first one visibly affected in my experiences. Dont worry too much cause i think youll find the right plant along the way and those monte carlo will be fine.
If I’m seeing correctly, those lights seem to be only white leds. Wouldn’t that be missing the other spectrums, even though they’re bright?
I didn’t add the shrimp until the cycle was finished. I did two full ammonia dosing tests and it was cleared (as well as the nitrites) in 12 hours both times.
I think my Monte Carlo are my plants I worry about the most because I want as much ground coverage as possible for the shrimp. I plan on adding large schools of very small fish that won’t bother shrimp much (I know here and there they might, and babies may get picked off) but wanted to give my shrimp a thick carpet to feel secure.
many tips on those would be most appreciated. As for the melting of the Monte Carlo, since they’re so small and compact, it’s almost impossible to remove the melting leaves like I would with larger leaf plants. Is that ok? I do see the shrimp picking at the dead leaves here and there.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4 Posts
If I’m seeing correctly, those lights seem to be only white leds. Wouldn’t that be missing the other spectrums, even though they’re bright?
I didn’t add the shrimp until the cycle was finished. I did two full ammonia dosing tests and it was cleared (as well as the nitrites) in 12 hours both times.
I think my Monte Carlo are my plants I worry about the most because I want as much ground coverage as possible for the shrimp. I plan on adding large schools of very small fish that won’t bother shrimp much (I know here and there they might, and babies may get picked off) but wanted to give my shrimp a thick carpet to feel secure.
many tips on those would be most appreciated. As for the melting of the Monte Carlo, since they’re so small and compact, it’s almost impossible to remove the melting leaves like I would with larger leaf plants. Is that ok? I do see the shrimp picking at the dead leaves here and there.
If I’m seeing correctly, those lights seem to be only white leds. Wouldn’t that be missing the other spectrums, even though they’re bright?
I didn’t add the shrimp until the cycle was finished. I did two full ammonia dosing tests and it was cleared (as well as the nitrites) in 12 hours both times.
I think my Monte Carlo are my plants I worry about the most because I want as much ground coverage as possible for the shrimp. I plan on adding large schools of very small fish that won’t bother shrimp much (I know here and there they might, and babies may get picked off) but wanted to give my shrimp a thick carpet to feel secure.
many tips on those would be most appreciated. As for the melting of the Monte Carlo, since they’re so small and compact, it’s almost impossible to remove the melting leaves like I would with larger leaf plants. Is that ok? I do see the shrimp picking at the dead leaves here and there.
If you dose the Co2, ferts and cycle the water correctly (as i said earlier) the only problem then would be the light...i tried to put your tank spec with the your current 59W light and the score was 0.21W/L out of 1W/L. If i be you i'd try to reach at very least, a medium W/L (roughly 0.40+ W/L) to begin with and run it 8 hours a day. I suggest to remove the melting monte carlo leaves when youre about to do a routine water change. Unless any water parameters exceed normal level, i wouldnt recommend a nearly 50% water change. Routine and consistency is a key.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
400 Posts
Try dosing iron. It never hurts and can give you growth without boosting algaes. Some stem plants seem to melt after a few months no matter how well they start out..but in your case its waaay too soon for that.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Try dosing iron. It never hurts and can give you growth without boosting algaes. Some stem plants seem to melt after a few months no matter how well they start out..but in your case its waaay too soon for that.
I have also been using NilocG iron every 3 days. My moss seems to be much greener and fuller but I’m not sure if that was just a coincidence in timing.

If you dose the Co2, ferts and cycle the water correctly (as i said earlier) the only problem then would be the light...i tried to put your tank spec with the your current 59W light and the score was 0.21W/L out of 1W/L. If i be you i'd try to reach at very least, a medium W/L (roughly 0.40+ W/L) to begin with and run it 8 hours a day. I suggest to remove the melting monte carlo leaves when youre about to do a routine water change. Unless any water parameters exceed normal level, i wouldnt recommend a nearly 50% water change. Routine and consistency is a key.
Ok sounds like a plan. I’ve read on other threads of people using two Fluval 3.0 lights on tanks this size, so I’ll try that as well. I know the overlap of the lights will be where the lights the strongest, but I figure it will help overall having better coverage and more direct lighting having two, especially since I have hardscape through the center of the tank, so keeping a light on each side would help with the direct lighting under the units. Thoughts?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
400 Posts
No..mosses and ferns as Java and Bolbitis love iron. So do sword plants..you can almost watch the flush of deep green come over them instantly...but 24 hours is close enough-ha.
One stem plant I tried and fools me every time is Ammania gracilis. Looks great when you bring it home..grows fine,then sulks...rots.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
117 Posts
I have a 72g bow front. I run 2 fluval 3.0's. I also run co2. I couldn't get enough light to grow monte carlo. Although, I tried when I only had 1 light. I now have 2 and am still having a hard time growing marislea crenata as a carpet for my shrimp.
 

·
Premium Member
75g, 33L, 2g and play tanks
Joined
·
641 Posts
You have nearly the same setup that I do. Light, tank and such. I had issues with some of my plants as well. My Dwarf Sag that I thought would carpet like mad took... 2 months before it started runners. Before that I had other plants that melted, but that was before the Fluval 3.0. Personally, let it be. The plants that all die out are just not going to grow in your water. Find a substitute for whatever that was. I usually buy two of each plant. not only cause shipping can be hard but because one may do well and another may not. I like to place them in a little different locations as far as lighting or depth and see what they like.

The first thing that I knew was wrong for me was lighting. Then I realized that some plants were root feeders and I wasn't doing tabs yet. Another plant I learned later that I had it buried too much in the substrate which caused it to rot away and likely that is why it never grew and not my water. Could be a lot of things. good luck though.
 

·
Premium Member
75g, 33L, 2g and play tanks
Joined
·
641 Posts
If you dose the Co2, ferts and cycle the water correctly (as i said earlier) the only problem then would be the light...i tried to put your tank spec with the your current 59W light and the score was 0.21W/L out of 1W/L. If i be you i'd try to reach at very least, a medium W/L (roughly 0.40+ W/L) to begin with and run it 8 hours a day. I suggest to remove the melting monte carlo leaves when youre about to do a routine water change. Unless any water parameters exceed normal level, i wouldnt recommend a nearly 50% water change. Routine and consistency is a key.
So one thing is that the watts/gallon doesn't work with LEDs.... here's a little chart of some readings taken for the Fluval 3.0 on max lighting. But that doesn't mean that one Fluval 3.0 is necessarily going to be your answer for everything lighting. Also, don't forget that the corners will obviously be darker. but it's working great on my 75 gallon.
1026247

I actually lowered my tank's water for about 2 weeks by about 1.5-2 inches just to increase lighting for getting my dwarf sag to really start up. now that they are rolling, it doesn't look like they can be stopped and my water level is back to normal. still only double the amount of those since I bought them about 3-4 months ago but these doubled in the last 2 weeks(first week and a few days I had the water lower)... just glad they held on for so long.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
Discussion Starter · #13 ·
So one thing is that the watts/gallon doesn't work with LEDs.... here's a little chart of some readings taken for the Fluval 3.0 on max lighting. View attachment 1026247
I actually lowered my tank's water for about 2 weeks by about 1.5-2 inches just to increase lighting for getting my dwarf sag to really start up. not that they are rolling, it doesn't look like they can be stopped. still only double the amount of those since I bought them about 3-4 months ago... just glad they held on for so long.
Ok so, at 22”, I may only be getting around 45 par? I raised the light to get better spread, but once I get my second light in, I’ll have 16-18” depth across the entire tank. So 70par and maybe up to 110-130 in the overlapping sections. If I’m understanding the par charts I’m seeing, that will put me in the medium-high lighting range, whereas right now I’m in low-medium, correct? That should be a big help for my Monte Carlo I’d guess
 

·
Premium Member
75g, 33L, 2g and play tanks
Joined
·
641 Posts
Ok so, at 22”, I may only be getting around 45 par? I raised the light to get better spread, but once I get my second light in, I’ll have 16-18” depth across the entire tank. So 70par and maybe up to 110-130 in the overlapping sections. If I’m understanding the par charts I’m seeing, that will put me in the medium-high lighting range, whereas right now I’m in low-medium, correct? That should be a big help for my Monte Carlo I’d guess
basically. I am not going to guess where that PAR would come down to but your estimate seems reasonable. So I would say, "yeah, sounds good to me." hahaha. unfortunately that's the best we can do in these situations sometimes. But yeah, I would guess with the Monte Carlo you should be good with a second Fluval 3.0.

as far as the spread on those Fluval 3.0's, they have like 120 degree so mine isn't raised at all on my 75. everything gets light. I have a few floaters and if they stick in a corner they don't get a lot of light. But I drilled 3 holes that point up more to create surface agitation on my spray bar and anything on the sides or corners doesn't stay there long.

This isn't the greatest photo but it's the latest( still a couple weeks old) There are about 6-7 swarf sag plants in there in front, this doesn't show it but they now all have runners. This is also full for my tank as far as the water level. man and the sword plant on the right is almost touching the surface now. or would be close if it wasn't swaying in the current.
1026249
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
Discussion Starter · #15 ·
basically. I am not going to guess where that PAR would come down to but your estimate seems reasonable. So I would say, "yeah, sounds good to me." hahaha. unfortunately that's the best we can do in these situations sometimes. But yeah, I would guess with the Monte Carlo you should be good with a second Fluval 3.0.

as far as the spread on those Fluval 3.0's, they have like 120 degree so mine isn't raised at all on my 75. everything gets light. I have a few floaters and if they stick in a corner they don't get a lot of light. But I drilled 3 holes that point up more to create surface agitation on my spray bar and anything on the sides or coners doesn't stay there long.
I have some moss higher up on some driftwood that doesn’t get lit at all, and when my ludwigia grows more than halfway up the back, it soon becomes shaded, so those are my biggest issues with coverage, along with the shadows created from hardscape. I’ll probably end up having to replace some moss and other plants I’ve attached too high on the driftwood, as I think my lighting might be too intense at that height, but oh well, live and learn.
Thanks for the feedback though!
 

·
Premium Member
75g, 33L, 2g and play tanks
Joined
·
641 Posts
I have some moss higher up on some driftwood that doesn’t get lit at all, and when my ludwigia grows more than halfway up the back, it soon becomes shaded, so those are my biggest issues with coverage, along with the shadows created from hardscape. I’ll probably end up having to replace some moss and other plants I’ve attached too high on the driftwood, as I think my lighting might be too intense at that height, but oh well, live and learn.
Thanks for the feedback though!
oh yeah. Ludwigia is gonna want that light. I have water sprite in the back. that stuff doesn't care at all. lol. just through it in the water it will grow.

also I updated a few things on my last post for more clarity if you wanna look.
 
1 - 16 of 16 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top