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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Some of you might already follow me around and know of what I use for all my tanks for the last one year or so.

I'm in the middle of packing my formulations into commercial products.
Since many people who tried sample of the product reported positive results and imported products seems to be a lot overpriced, I dare myself to market my own brew. Running production locally gives me a huge advantage in terms of marketing and price difference that it is possible to sell at half the price of the competitors' retail value. Should the quality is found to be comparable by most consumers, by then export would be something I may consider.

The products I refer to are liquid ferts for aquascaping.
The names will run under "wonder-gro" series :

1. wonder-gro micro plus
which is iron/micro elements mix


2. wonder-gro macro plus
which is macro nutrients/macro elements mix


These labels are concept specimens which may not represent the actual products upon production.
Details on the label-to-be are just there for show. So please do not mind if the website does not work and so on. There might be lots of typos and not so appropriate language, and you are welcome to make corrections or give better ideas.

Comments and opinions are highly welcome!
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Liquids... trying to follow the footsteps of what are available out there you see mr rex. I also figure that not many people have a microgram scale for measuring very precise dosings, so a more diluted form of liquid is better, measured by mL or by the bottle cap.

If you are looking forward to tablet ferts, I'm in the middle of doing some research. This kind of plant nutrition research take quite some time to finish, not to mention doing the effectivity test.
 

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great job medicine if you can effectively undercut imports.
smart of you to make a with and without macros formula.
as for exporting it, the market here is pretty cluttered with
products, so unless your product was very concentrated,
I doubt many here would be compelled enough to switch.
 

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Go with powered ferts. Find a small dosing spoon. They are available. Or bulk up the ferts with something like K2SO4 which can't be overdosed.

Just because everyone else sells high priced water is no reason to do the same. Offer something different.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
That is also a good idea to do, rex.
I just need to make sure that the trace ingredients can mix evenly with the bulkier ingredients (acts more as carrier I guess) so every dose will be homogen. I'm sure it is the main problem as the quantity difference between the trace ingredients and main ingredients are much far apart. I will find a way though such as spray or granulation method or something else. Powedered/dry form also easier/cheaper to transport, has less restriction, and much more concentrated.

Not to worry too much. For the local market and neighbouring countries I'm sure that I'm offering something a bit different in terms of price. Concentration can also be doubled while maintaining the stability. I just have to listen what my customers like :)
 

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I think it's a great idea medicineman. Some folks (myself included) hate dosing dry fertilizers. Is it cheaper? Yes. Easier? Depends on the person.

A couple questions:

What is the N to P ratio?

How does the trace mix compare to Flourish/Master Grow?

How much do you think it will cost once it reaches the states?

If you do plan on an American market, will you adjust liters to gallons? Us yanks are kind of particular about our beloved customary system.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I do agree that dry dosing is one of the cheapest way to fertilize your aquascape. This is very real when people started to have mutiple tanks or very big tanks. That is why I plan to make in bulk pakcaging as well, selling much cheaper for each liter/gallon of the product.

Looking at the current formulation (which can still be altered following to necessity), each bottle (the smallest of packaging) could treat up to 650+ gallons of water (250mL micro) and 325+ gallons of water (500mL macro). These assumptions based on a normal planted tank, with reasonably heavy plant load, normal fish load and CO2 injected. Counting from the speculation with weekly/bi-weekly water change, the smallest bottle of each product could last up to 6 months when used in a 20gal planted tank.
For least I will make 250mL, 500mL, 1000mL bottles. A bulkier pakcaging (1 gallon or more) will also be made should the demand says so.

I'm not too sure if folks find it too weak/diluted. I still can alter the micro plus into double the concentration without serius ill effect to the shelf life. The macro plus however, since contains high amount of macro elements such as N, P, K and so on is already very concentrated with 20-30% spare to saturation point.

To answer the N to P ratio, it is around 5 vs 0.5
To answer the effectiveness, some tester comments that the products are still somewhat less effective than notorious TMG (with all those years of dedicated experience). They would score my brew at 80%. However they are eager to see the product on the local shelves since I could manufacture and have them on display for 1/3-1/4 the imports value.

I cannot foresee how much each of the product would sell in the US. Probably almost equal to the local brands since it would certainly lost its "locally made" advantage. It is still possible that the product may be cheaper still, considering how big US market is... quantity over price thingy. Manufacturer can earn less profit per each bottle in exchange of increased quantity.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I believe to sell in the US legally as a fertilizer you need a list of the breakdown of the product percent composition.
That is stated to the authority's office for database and testing or stated at the product bottle/label for consumers to see? I can do break down list for like patent office and departements if it is required.

Need to know because many of the imports right here does not have :
- expiry date (is this even necessary for hobby ferts?)
- exact broken down content (they just stated concentrated iron and such)
- sometimes the manufacturer's data (website, company name, etc)

Where can I look for the US requirements for such product?

The requirements here is very loose since this kind of product is not meant to be used on very large scale (such as farming) and does not included in food chain. The victims are just pet fish and plants... they say.... and used inside enclosed and controlled (most of the time very small) body of water. As long as the product does not contain any serious environment issues, it does not need to be under check/databased ----> this is why there are several "junk" products selling around here :mad:
 

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One thing I noticed. You are thinking about 10 ml for 50 liters. That will not provide decent potassium dosing. You can't dissolve a lot of most any common (read inexpensive) potassium compound into water. The most common, K2SO4, is almost impossible to make any kind of concentrated solution with. And if you add in the KNO3 (or other nitrates) it is impossible. That's why so many of us dose dry.

Maybe I'm wrong here.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Well... trial and research proves otherwise.
In such a way I can fit all those into the bottle... in solution form of course :)
I really appreciate the concern, it gives me an idea of how people would think of the product, a bit sceptical upon seeing the dosing, and I think it is very normal.

I can assure you that the macro plus consist of 5- 0.5 - 15 in NPK at the least. Each dose accordingly to the bottle label suggestion will add at least 5ppm of N, 0.5 ppm of P and 15ppm of K. It is possible to dissolve all the needed compounds into such concentration, but to go further the extent is a bit out of the question. Each dose will create that dissolve/ripple effect to the water once the fert is in contact, showing that it is pushed to near limit.

I'm not trying to claim giving 5 - 0.5 - 15 is the best. Extended research and user's feedback will be valuable for any reconsideration on the brew. Most people claim that in general at least 30ppm of K is needed (as in pmdd folowers). Some reported 50ppm for great result (contest people and some pros). Some other reported just giving 10-15 ppm is enough (researchers people). Different tanks needs different things I guess.
 

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Well MM I have to say keep up the good work. It can't be easy to do this type of thing and most of it is over my head just in this topic. But Depending on the price it would be to get to me, If it was the same or cheaper than whats around here I would probably try some out just to support a fellow member opposed to a big company. (The big companies make great products though! No doubt about that I just like supporting other entrepreneurs). So I would like to see you're results with this because its deffinatly interesting! Especially since its to help the people in your area!


Good luck!
-Andrew
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Thanks for the encouragement, Andrew. I cannot promise anything about the product ending up in US market and valued at the right price though.

My friends and testers are also backing me up with their support. They kindly reported back to me of individual results via calls, sms, PMs or e-mails, describing of certain effect to certain plants and the overal tank. Some are even grateful enough for the product that they post their tanks in the local aquascaping forum.
You may not be literate of the language, but it is not wrong just to browse around :)
Forum Diskusi Seputar Ikan Hias O-FISH :: Lihat Forum - Setup Akuarium Tanaman

There are actually a lot of local aquascaping players running underground, playing behind the scene, not wanting to be identified of just plain computer blind. The forum actually could see more members and posts. It is just the nature or local people... and also economy and geography issues.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Here is the illustration inside transparent bottle (in case some of you have not seen it yet)


Green is micro, red is macro.

There are at least three normal sized packaging : 250mL, 500mL and 1000mL


I also plan 5000mL packaging in small plastic jerrycan should the demand exist.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Well... not too sure either when.

I need to overcome obstacles such as patent office and other local government office before legally marketing (so far the selling is done underhand, from me to known fellow hobbyists). After that seeing how is the general response, then doing some export approach (and expect obstacles from M'sian agricultural departement and the likes of that). Still a long way to go for sure :)

Anyway care to share me what do you have (liquid ferts) in Msian market and how much the items cost?
 
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