[tuggythetugboat]

Hello, I just recently finished cycling my 7 Gal Planted tank. The ammonia and nitrite were successfully converting to nitrates and showing as 0 within 24 hours. I just recently switched from Seachem Flourish to Tropica Specialised to help plant growth and health. After I realized my tank was cycled, I changed out around 40% of the water, added prime, and I picked up 5 small endler guppies. After testing my nitrite after an hour or so I realized it was at .25 and this morning it is a little higher. What could this be? Is the prime giving me false nitrite but correct ammonia at 0? Could the fertilizer be adding nitrite somehow? My other parameters are. 72 degrees, around 7.4 ph at night and 6.6-6.8 during the day (since I have CO2) and KH at 5 GH at 7.

 

[MoreliaViridis]

Tropica specialized contains NH4+, which will turn into nitrites.
Flourish comprehensive also contains NH4+ but in much lower doses.
Bacteria needs to adjust to increased amount of food so give them time to reproduce.

 

[tuggythetugboat]

Tropica specialized contains NH4+, which will turn into nitrites.
Flourish comprehensive also contains NH4+ but in much lower doses.
Bacteria needs to adjust to increased amount of food so give them time to reproduce.

Oh really, I was thinking it could have something to do with that. I was so stumped since I knew my tank was fully cycled and the bioload is small. About how long do you think it'll take to get used to the extra nitrite and go back down to 0. In the meantime should I just add prime and let the bacteria grow to get used to the increased Nitrite? Also thank you for the reply!

 

[MoreliaViridis]

Oh really, I was thinking it could have something to do with that. I was so stumped since I knew my tank was fully cycled and the bioload is small. About how long do you think it'll take to get used to the extra nitrite and go back down to 0. In the meantime should I just add prime and let the bacteria grow to get used to the increased Nitrite? Also thank you for the reply!

Keep dosing tropica fert. Dose frequently to minimize ammonia spike.
I wouldn't be worried about tiny amount of nitrite. If you feel uncomfy then some wc would fix it quickly.
I guess couple of weeks should be enough.

 

[ElleDee]

Flourish does not have ammonia in it. I'm not sure about tropica, as I can't quickly find a reliable source that lists its ingredients/nutrient analysis.

But you just added fish to a new system, so it's pretty normal to not have enough bacteria to handle the amount of waste they are making. It should fix in a few days, just use water changes to dilute the problem in the meantime.

 

[NoahLikesFish]

What are you testing with? Api isn’t correct

 

[MoreliaViridis]

Flourish does not have ammonia in it. I'm not sure about tropica, as I can't quickly find a reliable source that lists its ingredients/nutrient analysis.

But you just added fish to a new system, so it's pretty normal to not have enough bacteria to handle the amount of waste they are making. It should fix in a few days, just use water changes to dilute the problem in the meantime.

Woops my bad..
Flourish NITROGEN contains urea which breaks down to ammonia via urease.

Tropica specialized do contain NH4+. It comes from NH4NO3.

James' Planted Tank - All In One Solution

Link above is an analysis of TPN, now renamed to Tropica specialized.
As far as I know they did not change the formula for specialized.

 

[tuggythetugboat]

Keep dosing tropica fert. Dose frequently to minimize ammonia spike.
I wouldn't be worried about tiny amount of nitrite. If you feel uncomfy then some wc would fix it quickly.
I guess couple of weeks should be enough.

Okay will do, that makes sense that Flourish doesn't have NH4+ because I've never really seen and nitrite spikes because of it. I'm actually not getting ammonia spikes surprisingly enough, I think the bacteria that converts ammonia to nitrite is plentiful. My problem is the nitrite to nitrate bacteria is lacking. I'll continue to dose the tropica twice a week.

What are you testing with? Api isn’t correct

Yes I am using API. I have heard that about the ammonia test. I've only seen one source about the nitrite test being affected by prime but I don't believe that is tbe case this time around since it's been accurate before.

Flourish does not have ammonia in it. I'm not sure about tropica, as I can't quickly find a reliable source that lists its ingredients/nutrient analysis.

But you just added fish to a new system, so it's pretty normal to not have enough bacteria to handle the amount of waste they are making. It should fix in a few days, just use water changes to dilute the problem in the meantime.

Okay, how much of a water change to you recommend for .5 nitrite? I don't want to stress out the fish with 50%+ changes.

 

[Discusluv]

Okay, how much of a water change to you recommend for .5 nitrite? I don't want to stress out the fish with 50%+ changes.

The stress coming from nitrite at .5 ppm is way more stressful than a 50% water change in 99.9% of circumstances from tap water in the US.
I do 50-75 percent water changes weekly on my discus tanks-- and they are very sensitive fish.

Do a 50% water change - then, retest. If the nitrite is still present- do another one back to back. Nitrite toxicity is brutal on fish. If it doesn't kill them instantly- it leads to secondary issues that are difficult to treat.

 

[tuggythetugboat]

The stress coming from nitrite at .5 ppm is way more stressful than a 50% water change in 99.9% of circumstances from tap water in the US.
I do 50-75 percent water changes weekly on my discus tanks-- and they are very sensitive fish.

Do a 50% water change - then, retest. If the nitrite is still present- do another one back to back. Nitrite toxicity is brutal on fish. If it doesn't kill them instantly- it leads to secondary issues that are difficult to treat.

Okay I'll have to do a quick WC right now. I'm also using Prime so the fish are not affected by it currently.

 

[NoahLikesFish]

Yes I am using API. I have heard that about the ammonia test. I've only seen one source about the nitrite test being affected by prime but I don't believe that is tbe case this time around since it's been accurate before.

Api test is way off, idk if there’s any other real tests for fresh. Mabye sera has one I think

 

[ElleDee]

Woops my bad..
Flourish NITROGEN contains urea which breaks down to ammonia via urease.

Tropica specialized do contain NH4+. It comes from NH4NO3.

James' Planted Tank - All In One Solution

Link above is an analysis of TPN, now renamed to Tropica specialized.
As far as I know they did not change the formula for specialized.

Thanks for the link. This is as much detail as I have seen, but it is a far cry from the guaranteed analysis fertilizer in the US is required to have. (I see you aren't from the US, so there's no reason for you to know or care about our laws, I'm just explaining where I'm coming from - all this guesswork is bananas to me.) Maybe they haven't reformulated, but we don't know that. I'm unclear why James says that all the nitrogen is from ammonium nitrate; it looks like the analysis just has percent N, so I'm not clear where he's getting information about the source. I'm not saying he's wrong, but it can't be verified.

 

[MoreliaViridis]

Thanks for the link. This is as much detail as I have seen, but it is a far cry from the guaranteed analysis fertilizer in the US is required to have. (I see you aren't from the US, so there's no reason for you to know or care about our laws, I'm just explaining where I'm coming from - all this guesswork is bananas to me.) Maybe they haven't reformulated, but we don't know that. I'm unclear why James says that all the nitrogen is from ammonium nitrate; it looks like the analysis just has percent N, so I'm not clear where he's getting information about the source. I'm not saying he's wrong, but it can't be verified.

Welp, Found this pdf file from ukaps thread from 2015:

Tropica plant growth specialised fertiliser

Hi, does it contain NPK and trace elements? Thanks

www.ukaps.org

Official Tropica account posted this analysis.
It does not show source for N, however it is
impossible to use KNO3(which is go-to chemical for non ammoniacal nitrogen source) as sole source of N and have the same ratio of N:K.


If they were to not include NH4 in the mix without using KNO3, options are basically Ca(NO3)2 or Mg(NO3)2...there might be something more but thats what I can come up rn.
Both are also impossible because specialized does not contain Ca and N:Mg ratio is off.
Mixing KNO3 and Mg(NO3)2 also cannot achieve the same ratio to the mix.


So unless one of these is true

1. Tropica lied.
2. I missed something. (Its 3am here at korea. Good chance I missed something.)
3. Tropica changed formula.

Tropica has to include some NH4+ in the mix.



Btw there were some googling results where people reporting nitrite spike on forums after dosing Tropica specialized.

 

[ElleDee]

@MoreliaViridis everything you've said sounds reasonable, and really the op is on the right path regardless of if there's ammonia in the fertilizer (and you're probably right about that, but I'm still annoyed that this requires detective work instead of just looking on the label or on the tropica site!) or just from the endlers.

 

[Savetheplants]

Api test is way off, idk if there’s any other real tests for fresh. Mabye sera has one I think

I think Salifert is supposed to be good. I found a Salifert freshwater Nitrite test kit on Aquacave.