[Mannie Bothans]

Hi,

I'm new to aquariums in general. My son wants some goldfish, so the fish are the priority, but I'd like a few live plants (but plants are secondary to the health of the fish).

I have no aquarium yet, but have a filter. My son wants goldfish, so this means cooler water. What setup would be most economical and complementary-- given constraints such as:

Freshwater
No trimming
65° to 68° temps
30 gallon tank. EDIT: Now 56 (30"x18"x24")
two ryukin goldfish
Filter flow = AquaClear 50 plus Emperor 400
No added CO2
No regular fertilizing
Hardy plants (impossible to kill)
Flourite and sand substrate

I am fine with putting sand and Flourite as substrate if needed. I have no hood/lightbox (I have no tank right now, even) but I'd rather buy whatever will keep the temperature best for the fish and get plants that are okay with that.

What hardy plants wouldn't require trimming? What lights would I need for those plants? What substrate?

 

[VeeSe]

Be aware that goldfish eat (and thus destroy) most plants, so it will be best to start with the very small list of plants that they don't eat and then pick from there.

 

[kribkeeper888]

I've never actually kept goldfish so I'm probly not the one who has the best idea on this but I might give you some advice, lighting is essential, pretty much no matter what the case, I mean everyone wants to be able to see their fish right?
Heating isnt essential for goldfish certainly but I know a guy who kept goldfish at 82 degrees F.
I THINK you should be able to keep the above mentioned fish in a 30 gallon but dont quote me on that haha But as to the question of plants; when i first started keeping fish (and had no idea what i was doing) I successfuly kept two Anubias Nana very well under 15 watts of lighting (basically your simple single bulb light fixture) and in simple riverbed peagravel bought at my local petsmart, no flourite, no fertilizer. The plus side to this plant also is that its leaves are very tough, I had some plant eating fish that couldnt hurt them and it doesnt die period, at least in my experiance.
As for filtration, I have a friend who had and Aquaclear, witch served as a very basic filter but he liked the merineland penguin series filters much better and i personally use them on three of my 5 tanks. But if your really on a budget the aquaclear is cheaper.
Anyway, hoped I helped a little

 

[lauraleellbp]

That's a pretty small tank for goldfish. Maybe a single "fancy" variety, but IMO a 55gal + would be a much better size.

That being said, some Crypts, Java fern, mosses, Anubias, and Vals would probably be good choices in terms of plants to try.

 

[ValMM]

Goldfish have no stomachs, just intestines, so they don't really digest what they eat. It goes in and comes out. That's why most people say, "They're messy fish." They eat all day long, so if you put a little duckweed as a floating plant, they'll eat it.

 

[Mannie Bothans]

Thanks everyone. Now is the time for me to make big decisions that will limit my options down the line. Tank size is a very important factor for me to consider. I have a new option for a location that could accomodate a larger tank, so that might be worth taking advantage of right now.

The Anubius sounds perfect! Now I need to do more research on vals, crypts, javafern, mosses etc, to see how likely it might be that a goldfish would destroy each one. My son is really set on a ryukin goldfish, so my plant choices will need to revolve around that.

 

[Lutra]

Mannie, I have a fantail living with some plants under medium-low light. She munched the top off of an Echinodorus 'Vesuvius' but she hasn't touched the anubias or the Java ferns, I recommend them as a good place to start. I put in some Java moss and though she didn't eat it, she seemed offended by its presence -- at least she keeps tearing off any stem that gets more than an inch long. I'm still experimenting! It's not impossible, so don't be discouraged. And yes, if you can get a bigger tank, by all means do so.

 

[Mannie Bothans]

GOT THE TANK! Need lighting advice

Anubius nana, Java Ferns, and crypts seem to be getting universally great reports. I'll start there. Many seem to say Vallsneria is good as well (and the twisty ones look really neat.

I bought a tank tonight. Now I just need to figure out what to do about the lights. It came with a plastic "Model 30PAL-F" light (which appears to be a single fluorescent bulb, encased in a fanless perfectastrip that has "Rated 120VAC, 60Hz, 20 W" on a sticker.

The tank itself is a 56G column that's 30inches wide, 18inches deep, and 24inches tall.

I need to figure out a good layout and then decide how to cycle the thing. :help:

I need to return the Aquaclear 50 to the LFS, tonight I picked up an Emperor 400 from PetSmart. PetSmart has some healthy-looking anubius nana and something that might have had crypt in the name. I feel like I have a steep learning curve.

 

[Lutra]

I feel like I have a steep learning curve.

You and me both!

 

[kribkeeper888]

Well as for your filter choice you couldnt have done better, my emporer 400 is the best filter i have ever had, it really keeps the water clear and with the biowheels it helps your tank out with more then just keeping it clean !

 

[londonloco]

Whoaaa, I really wish you hadn't returned that AC50, there is a reason AC's have been around forever, it's the best HOB out there...I just noticed you bought a 56g col tank. I would have suggested buying another AC50, or going with an AC110.

 

[Coursair]

With Goldfish you want to Overfilter. So for 56g I'd double that and get either a canister filter or an HOB filter rated for 100+ g or two AC50's. I do prefer Aquaclears.

I worked at a Petsmart for 3 years. AC's were the quietest and the most reliable HOB filter we sold IMHO.

Get used to weekly partial water changes.

Plants :
+1 Anubias (seem to taste bad)
Java Ferns
Bolbitis
All of these can be tied to rocks or Dwiftwood which will avoid the uprooting issue.

If you want to try some Cryptocoryne you can either plant them in pots and hide pots with decor OR plant them and surround the stem with rocks or wood to keep the fish from uprooting them.

I believe if you offer a varied diet with lots of fresh veggies; shelled green peas, zucchini, spinach, romaine, etc... Your plants have a better chance at survival.

Your fish will LOVE having a large tank to grow into. Avoid sharp edged decor with Fancy GF. And you can set large rocks to break up the flow, if the current is too strong.

No floating flake food. Presoak it or feed sinking food. Fancies have issues with food expanding in their gut.

Plus you can try training your fish
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3JFmrlgWAk&feature=youtube_gdata_player


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Mannie Bothans]

Well, I guess I don't have to take back the AC50. The Emperor 400 is rated for 90gallons, and the AC
50 might have an adjustable flow, so maybe I'll try one on each end of the tank.

I wish the included hood could support enough light just by changing a bulb, but alas, that doesn't look like an option. I just need to figure out a good balance for growth that won't require additional co2 and wont encourage algae growth.

THANKS everyone for all of the Goldfish-specific advice!

 

[kribkeeper888]

I dont want to cause any problems here but i have used both the AC and the 400 and I liked the 400 a LOT more

 

[Mannie Bothans]

Wow, it makes me feel good that people are saying that both of my hobs are top notch. I am on my way out to find better lights.

 

[xjasminex]

Hello, just adding my two cents, i have two fancies in a 55 gallon.
I have no plants with them yet, as i need better light but in the future it will be so.
I have read alot though.
Goldfish eat plants, as it has been said. One thing when planting a goldfish tank is to plant heavy, if there are a couple of plants they goldfish will pick at them even if they dont eat them. They will try to pull it outta the gravel, so planting lots of plants distributes the picking.

Also since goldfish are dirty fish and eat everything ( i call them cows underwater ) Usually intense gravel vacuuming in needed depending on your subtrate. Like rifling through the gravel with the end of your vacuum, because of this many goldfish owners keep a bare bottom tank and keep their plants in pots like terra cotta or pretty glass (like candle holders from walmart). It just depends on what you want. I dont like bare bottom tanks, plus i think my goldfish would get really bored with out stuff to pick through.

General rule for tank size and goldfish is starting out your first fish needs 15-20 gallons, and every fish after that needs ten gallons. So a thirty would have worked if your fish were small bit after they get bigger they just look cramped, so bigger is always better with goldfish.

And for the filters the rule is ten times the filtration an hour so if your tank is 56 gallons you need 560 gallon an hour.

And weekly water changes are a MUST, lol.
www.thegab.com is a great goldfish centered website that has greatly helped me to improved the life of my goldfish. Its definitaly a great site for goldfish!

Good Luck!
Jasmine

 

[hydrophyte]

Certain kinds of riparium plants go well with goldfish too. If you can keep them with fairly bright light they'll also provide very good plant filtration.

 

[sweet chariot]

I have for goldfish in a 55, and some good plant choices I've found are:
-vallisneria
-echinodorus
-sagittaria
-java fern
-rotala

There is a link to my journal for that tank in my sig.
As Jasmine said thegab is a great goldfish forum. You can also check out koko's goldfish forum . It is another great site to help beginners with goldfish keeping.

 

[kribkeeper888]

Ja you have a good taste in filters

 

[Mannie Bothans]

TYhis is EXTREMELY helpful advice! I was searching for a good Goldfish forum. I think I will need to special order lights. Locally I can only find very low wattage ones.