New setup, new stand

2693 Views 24 Replies 6 Participants Last post by accordztech, Aug 6, 2012

accordztech

Discussion Starter · Jul 20, 2012 (Edited)

Well My last tank I purchased a prebuilt stand. It was constructed great, better than others but it was mdf. Long story short I got a leak under there and it destroyed the stand.

My new setup is for my 40b. Sexy tank! Its going to be a show tank on a slight budget :hihi:.

Im going to probably create something similar to this:
http://picasaweb.google.com/jotape65/40GTankStand ----are the main posts 4x4??
or this
http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=64722

I was thinking of a nice cherry red. But then I really want it to pop. So I was thinking of the pannels on the sides being black. So the 4x4 will be cherry next to the black inlay pannels.

Do you guys think that will be sweet? Should I use a quality wood like birch, since im going to paint it? Should it be stained black or painted black?

I was also thinking of doing removable side and front door pannels. I seen salt water guys secure their pannels with wood attached with magnets. Just a plan in my head. Should I not even do this because the pannels may have a gap?

But really im stumped a little on the construction. I want to mimmik the last link, but I cant tell if he used 4x4's for the posts. I went to my local hardware store and I am not sure what posts stain nicely. I have experience in painting and building stands, but as for stains....its something im going to practice with. What wood can stain nicely without breaking the bank? I seen oak (nothing in my size I need), redwood, dug fur...but thats about it.

Aside from the 4x4 posts, im guessing id be using 2x4 (1.5'' x2.5'') multi purpose stud. But how will this stud stain since its going to be exposed like the one in the second link?
Thanks

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[email protected]

· #2 · Jul 20, 2012

Cherry on a budget may not be your best option. Instead of looking for 4x4 cherry posts, consider doing a -proper- glue up using three or four boards.
Stains generally show the grain. Paint can show the grain. Or not. What do you, or more importantly, any significant other in your life, prefer?
One of the basics for staining is sealing the wood surface so the stain goes on evenly.

accordztech

Discussion Starter · #3 · Jul 20, 2012

I saw some 1/4'' cherry boards that I can use to pannel the stand....but I just want a clean stain look. I seen stands that are beutiful but then they stain it and it looks like "very antique" or "very old". I like fresh looking, and smooth grains.

Im down to spend like around 100 bucks on this stand.

GraphicGr8s

· #4 · Jul 21, 2012

If you look at the left leg in the picture it is definitely a glue up. He also used a form of loose tenon called beadlock. Not bad but I prefer a true mortise and tenon joint.
Besides cherry there are a lot of other woods you can use. But you won't find them in the Big Box stores. We have an actual lumber supply here. Besides having quality boards you'll never find in BB stores they'll also joint and plane boards for glue up. For a fee of course.
Heck even poplar if done right looks great. With the plethora of aniline dyes you can get some bold colors.

shrimpNewbie

· #5 · Jul 21, 2012

No need for 4x4 on a 40g tank, you can get away with 2x4 very easily and skin it with ply wood.

GraphicGr8s

· #6 · Jul 21, 2012

shrimpNewbie said:
No need for 4x4 on a 40g tank, you can get away with 2x4 very easily and skin it with ply wood.

No need but in the example he gave it looks better. For the other members I'd use 5/4 wood. (Five quarter. A true 1" wood not 3/4 like a 1 x is.)
If he uses a good wood instead of construction grade he could use a 1x3 for the front part of the leg then trim the side piece the thickness of the front and just make a nice corner piece

tanks4allthefish

· #7 · Jul 21, 2012

+1 ShrimpNewbie.

acitydweller

· #8 · Jul 21, 2012

Painting versus staining is up to personal preference. You. The determinant is whether you want to expose the wood grain or not.

accordztech

Discussion Starter · #9 · Jul 22, 2012

GraphicGr8s said:
If you look at the left leg in the picture it is definitely a glue up. He also used a form of loose tenon called beadlock. Not bad but I prefer a true mortise and tenon joint.
Besides cherry there are a lot of other woods you can use. But you won't find them in the Big Box stores. We have an actual lumber supply here. Besides having quality boards you'll never find in BB stores they'll also joint and plane boards for glue up. For a fee of course.
Heck even poplar if done right looks great. With the plethora of aniline dyes you can get some bold colors.

Yea I heard about pre treating wood before staining. Thinking of doing it. I may be using birch plywood.

Can I just screw together these woods instead of those other types of joints you talk about? I was going to glue it and then screw them in at an angle.

GraphicGr8s

· #10 · Jul 22, 2012

If your doing the first example then I would use a solid wood for the structural parts. Joinery can be pocket screws and glue no problem. Just make sure you use actual pocket screws. Other types will split the wood. I use the Kreg system. Don't just try screwing in at an angle. At least buy the right drill bit (it's a stepped bit and leaves a flat bottom for the screw head) and the cheap jig.
Knotty pine would make a good looking stand if your into old school.
Another thought. You could use a cabinet (solid wood prebuilt) would save building it. Also could look into bare wood furniture. Most if not all is solid wood and plywood. No pressboard.

If you build out of plywood you still need a solid wood for the front frame that covers the plywood edges. And pocket screws do ok in plywood.

tanks4allthefish

· #11 · Jul 22, 2012

accordztech said:
Yea I heard about pre treating wood before staining. Thinking of doing it. I may be using birch plywood.

Can I just screw together these woods instead of those other types of joints you talk about? I was going to glue it and then screw them in at an angle.

IMO the Kreg jig is one of the best and sturdiest ways to join 2 pieces of wood, not to mention the easiest. Its a standard these days in cabinet joinery unless you just want to do it the old fashioned way.

I built the frame of my stand out of 2x4 and across the front I spanned the opening with a sandwiched 2x6 header. It was then wrapped with cabinet grade red oak plywood. I wanted it to be sturdy but I think I overkilled it somewhat because this thing is heavy! Since I built the frame out of 2x4 I didnt use my Kreg jig but looking back I could have done it a little differently I think and used it with no adverse effects.

GraphicGr8s

· #12 · Jul 22, 2012

tanks4allthefish said:
IMO the Kreg jig is one of the best and sturdiest ways to join 2 pieces of wood, not to mention the easiest. Its a standard these days in cabinet joinery unless you just want to do it the old fashioned way.

I built the frame of my stand out of 2x4 and across the front I spanned the opening with a sandwiched 2x6 header. It was then wrapped with cabinet grade red oak plywood. I wanted it to be sturdy but I think I overkilled it somewhat because this thing is heavy! Since I built the frame out of 2x4 I didnt use my Kreg jig but looking back I could have done it a little differently I think and used it with no adverse effects.

Kreg jigs are nice. I've got the kit they sell at woodworking shows. They now carry screws for 2x4s. Nice but not perfect. It does have its drawbacks. Biggest one is how difficult it is to get the face frame even. Seems unless you do it just right it pulls it out of alignment. And yes, I know how to use the jig and how to compensate for it. I've put close to 7000 screws into wood with my kit.

I've just finished the first of 3 utilitarian stands for my 22 gallon breeders. Each stand holds 4 tanks. The legs are 2x4's. The "shelves" are 2 x 3. All with lap joints and old school wood screws. My 55 gallon stand is built the same way. No reason for 2 x 4s for horizontal members at all. Only reason I used 2 x 4 for the legs is for the lap joints.

tanks4allthefish

· #13 · Jul 22, 2012

Overkill is the best way to go, whether its a tank stand or filtration.lol

GraphicGr8s

· #14 · Jul 23, 2012

tanks4allthefish said:
Overkill is the best way to go, whether its a tank stand or filtration.lol

That's why I have a 75 gallon sump for my 1/2 gallon betta bowl.

Overbuilding a stand more than 10% is for those who aren't sure of their construction skills or lack them. IMPE

accordztech

Discussion Starter · #15 · Jul 23, 2012

Im going to look into that kraig system. I believe I saw that at harbor freight tools.

Now I have to decide on my wood. If I do the 4x4 route (which I know is overkill) then I may just go with redwood. I did see some 4x6 douglous fir, but I think the porportion may be to big.

Then stud it with 1.5x2.5 studs.

Then wraping the unit, I will probably use 15/32'' birch ply or 1/2 birch ply. I dont think 3/4 ply is necessary.

Im hoping the unit wont look "to massive" with the 4x4's. I hope the stan will look good with a redwood, and a birch together. Personally I do want the side pannels to look like they are "panneled" like a door, so I may buy a few strips of oak or popular to make it look like a panel.

Will the combo of redwood, birch, and popular (or oak) look ok? Or will the different shades make the stand look ugly when I stain it?

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GraphicGr8s

· #16 · Jul 23, 2012

You didn't see that at Harbor Freight. They only sell the cheap Chinese garbage. However reviews on the one you saw there seem to be good.

You don't need the 4 x 4 posts. If you're going to skin it anyway you can really get away with building a leg from 1x4s and make corners (it will look like an L from the top) using the pocket screws and glue. You just rip the side leg down 3/4 of an inch so when assembled it is the same size as the front part. Definitely strong enough for a 40 breeder especially when skinned.

Poplar won't work well with the other woods. It can be stained with the right techniques but needs to be a darker stain. Poplar is usually used as a "secondary" wood or is painted.

Notice I didn't say it couldn't be stained. It just requires a different technique than most other woods because of the coloration in it.

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accordztech

Discussion Starter · #17 · Jul 23, 2012

I didnt want to skin it 100%. I done that before and I want to try something different. I just want something to help it pop, like showing off the 4x4 or something. But now that I think of it, using 1x4 to make the same effect may just work...if THAT is what your saying =). I have to look for those 1x4's, it seems like no one has it in my area. I didnt see any and home depot is out of stock. I saw 1.5x2.5 tho.

Thanks for the advice on the poplar wood.

Im thinking of checking out this wood place after work, its local.

http://www.woodcraft.com/

GraphicGr8s

· #18 · Jul 23, 2012 (Edited)

accordztech said:
I didnt want to skin it 100%. I done that before and I want to try something different. I just want something to help it pop, like showing off the 4x4 or something. But now that I think of it, using 1x4 to make the same effect may just work...if THAT is what your saying =). I have to look for those 1x4's, it seems like no one has it in my area. I didnt see any and home depot is out of stock. I saw 1.5x2.5 tho.

Thanks for the advice on the poplar wood.

Im thinking of checking out this wood place after work, its local.

http://www.woodcraft.com/

1.5 x 2.5 is a 2 x 3. Wood is listed in the rough cut size before it is planed. A 1x wood is 3/4. For a different look try 5/4 (said as "Five Quarter") wood. It's a true one inch thick.
Home Depot sells 1 x 4 in Red Oak Poplar and in Pine. At least all the ones here do. As do the Lowes. HD also has 1 x 4 "super strips". I made a set of rustic cabinets out of them.
This is what I was thinking. Sort of. (It should be "Shadow Line" in the drawing.)

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GraphicGr8s

· #19 · Jul 23, 2012

For your sides. You can glue and screw stiles and rails together. Then take 1/4 plywood after the cabinet framework is built and skin the inside. It will give the illusion of a frame and panel. You won't have to cut any groves and it will help prevent racking. Only bad thing about 1/4" plywood is only one side has a g hardwood veneer. 1/2" and 3/4 have Hardwood (like oak) on both sides.

accordztech

Discussion Starter · #20 · Jul 23, 2012

Thanks bro, I kinda get it now. This is what I was initially was thinking. I got to look again, but it seems like all the home depots in my area are out of stock (so they say online).

Will 1x4's be solid enough to hold structure?

...Probably the horizontal 1x4's will be set back a little to create depth. But now looking at your sketch I may change my design

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