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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi, after failing horribly last time, I have come up with a new plan to setup a CRS breeding tank. Please bear with me as I describe what I have in my mind. Feel free to fill me in on anything I've missed.

Tank:
20inch long tank, height 12 inch, depth 9 inch.

Substrate:
3 litres of ADA Malaya + 1 litres of ADA Amazonia
My RO water comes at TDS 7.6. Last time my ADA Amazonia could buffer it to 7.0. I have heard Malaya has better buffering capability so I would put 3 litres of Malaya and top it off with 1 litre of Amazonia.

I was planning to add Borneo Wild Minerax and Enlive under the substrate layer. Would it be risky to add Borneo Wild Humic as well or that might buffer the pH down too low?

Do you have any suggestion for substrate additives?

Filtration:
Double sponge filter + a small (~200L/H) Hang on back filter with sponge prefilter (intake) and ceramic rings inside the chamber. I also intend to use an airstone 24/7. Will it increase the pH? In a video I saw some kind of ceramic O2 reactor/diffuser which was releasing very very tiny O2 bubble, any idea what that was? A web-link would be great!

Another option is to go for a PVC UGF (Liams design), but not sure how it will hold up without a canister filter. What if I attach a small powerhead instead of connecting it to a canister intake?

Cycle:
I will cycle the tank for two months. I will use tap water for cycling but two weeks before introducing shrimps, I will do a 100% water change using RO water and watch for parameters for two weeks. Unlike last time, I would only introduce a pair of CRS and observe them for a week. If they behave normal, I would get 2/3 more pairs as a starter.

Mineralization:
I have SaltyShrimp Bee Shrimp GH+ and planning to use that. I am aiming for a GH of 5. Whatever the TDS reaches at GH 5, I will match my water changes to that TDS. I dont intend to do frequent water changes, may be 2/3 litres every 3/4 days.

Food:
I am planning to use Spinach, IAL leaves and one commercial food as staple. Which one would you recommend? Also I will be using BW Frenzy as treat and BW Bebi if I see shrimplets.

Do you have any suggestion for a staple or a treat food?

Decors:
No rocks except for Minerocks or Deep Sea Mud rocks. I will also put a small piece of driftwood with moss tied or a ADA branchwood with moss tied.

Lighting:
Since this will be a low-tech non-co2 tank, I will go for 2 WPG 6 hours a day.

Do you see any potential issue with the plan? I am planning to use BW products because thats the only good brand which is available here, but if there is something really good or a must have, I can get it online. I have failed two times, don't want to fail again! If you can think of anything, please let me know! Thanks in advance.
 

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Do you have access to something from a mature tank like some piece of driftwood, a used filter pad etc? I would try to get that and use the water you intend to use right away and add the shrimp as well. They have such a low bioload that I would not worry about it. Even if you do not seed the tank by adding some live plants, a few shrimp won't produce that much ammonia and what they are, the plants will absorb right away. I never cycle a new shrimp tank. I seed it with some media from another tank and put the shrimp in.
 

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Why do many additives? CRS should breed without much in the way of additives.
Mine breed like crazy and the only things that add much of anything to my water is salty shrimp bee mineralizer until I hit 150 tds, and the active substrate (fluval shrimp stratum).

Personally, following the K. I. S. S. principle means only adding only what is needed to have healthy shrimp. I would be very careful adding anything more to the water than absolutely necessary. I don't even put my hands in the water if I can avoid it.

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Do you have access to something from a mature tank like some piece of driftwood, a used filter pad etc? I would try to get that and use the water you intend to use right away and add the shrimp as well. They have such a low bioload that I would not worry about it. Even if you do not seed the tank by adding some live plants, a few shrimp won't produce that much ammonia and what they are, the plants will absorb right away. I never cycle a new shrimp tank. I seed it with some media from another tank and put the shrimp in.
Yes, I can definitely do that! But yet so, I might have to wait for a few months for the shrimps to actually arrive in our LFS. Its not very common and requires special order.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Why do many additives? CRS should breed without much in the way of additives.
Mine breed like crazy and the only things that add much of anything to my water is salty shrimp bee mineralizer until I hit 150 tds, and the active substrate (fluval shrimp stratum).

Personally, following the K. I. S. S. principle means only adding only what is needed to have healthy shrimp. I would be very careful adding anything more to the water than absolutely necessary. I don't even put my hands in the water if I can avoid it.

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk
I have seen some pro breeders using Old Sea Mud and Bacteria + Bacteria food to kick start a proper biological balance. We dont have much products available here, so I was thinking of using only whats available. Do you think a layer of Malaya + Amazonia accompanied by Minerocks as decoration would be enough? No Additives?
 

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Honestly I don't know enough about those to give any answer but a guess, so I will let someone else answer that. What I can tell you is I have been using Fluval shrimp stratum with moderate light plants: mosses, crypts, windlov. Everything growing well, but I have to increase the light as the colors are fading a bit from my shrimp.

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For my rack I am planning on making internal fluidized bed filters with k1 kaldness (or similar) media and a sponge prefilter in each. Some of the media sellers include biodegradable bio balls used in saltwater fluidized filters. They are supposed to kickstart the bacteria. I may also incluee some gravel from the first tank.

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Do you have access to something from a mature tank like some piece of driftwood, a used filter pad etc? I would try to get that and use the water you intend to use right away and add the shrimp as well. They have such a low bioload that I would not worry about it. Even if you do not seed the tank by adding some live plants, a few shrimp won't produce that much ammonia and what they are, the plants will absorb right away. I never cycle a new shrimp tank. I seed it with some media from another tank and put the shrimp in.
This doesn't really work well with Aquasoil. New Aquasoil will leech large amounts of ammonia for weeks. The low pH keeps the ammonia from being to toxic but I wouldn't chance it.
 

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I agree with oblongshrimp, the leech it take a long period. Last time it took me about 3 month to get it over with cycled.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
This doesn't really work well with Aquasoil. New Aquasoil will leech large amounts of ammonia for weeks. The low pH keeps the ammonia from being to toxic but I wouldn't chance it.
I thought only Amazonia leaches ammonia? I was planning to use 3 litres of Malaya and 1 litres of Amazonia... last time 3 litres of Amazonia took around a week to cycle, I used matured filter media from another tank.

Any ways, what you guys are syaing that I dont need any mineral additives. But thats what I did last time and lost all CRS over 3/4 days. Few had molting issues, could not molt properly and those which did, died shortly after molting. I posted that in another thread: http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5638817
 

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Maybe just use de-chlorinated tap water, add real driftwood and peat moss packs to the tank to lower PH?
 

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Everyone is saying you're doing it too complex, but to me it sounds fine. Maybe one or two too many additives but the soil and everything sounds fine. With sponge filters you won't need an extra airstone. The ceramic diffuser is normally used with co2, not o2, but regardless is not necessary.

I have used a Liam designed ugf with a hob filter (aquaclear 50) but you don't really need it. A sponge predicted is fine and will save you money.

You're going for your first true success with Crs, so swing big like you are. Yes, for some of us we can do it simpler and have success but we want to guarantee you 100% success right now and I think you're doing it right for you.


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The mineralization sounds right on the money. I do the same thing, but use the fluval stuff instead (Just because it's easier for me to get).

I wouldn't do tap, or straight RO (except for topoff).

I use amazonia in my CRS tank, does a great job keeping the PH at the right level. It does leach Ammonia, but only at first.

Whiskey
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Everyone is saying you're doing it too complex, but to me it sounds fine. Maybe one or two too many additives but the soil and everything sounds fine. With sponge filters you won't need an extra airstone. The ceramic diffuser is normally used with co2, not o2, but regardless is not necessary.

I have used a Liam designed ugf with a hob filter (aquaclear 50) but you don't really need it. A sponge predicted is fine and will save you money.

You're going for your first true success with Crs, so swing big like you are. Yes, for some of us we can do it simpler and have success but we want to guarantee you 100% success right now and I think you're doing it right for you.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
What do you suggest for additives?
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Also, the water temp gets close to 30C during summer... I can use two small fans to bring it down to 26/27 (I will have to top off 2 litres of RO water everyday though)... is that okay? I can put a heater at 25C so that during winter it does not go below 25.
 

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Conventional wisdom says that they should be kept at 20-23 I think,.. though I have mine at about 24.

The tank looks like about a 10G based on the dimensions. The problem I see with 2 liters of RO topoff every day is that it might cause a fairly large swing in GH being dumped in all at once. CRS are very sensitive to this sort of thing - I just lost my entire colony by doing the same water change I do every week, only this time the water was about 2dGH above the tank.

Is there any way you can do an auto topoff to keep things more stable?
If not, maybe drip the RO in every day to avoid rapidly changing conditions.

Whiskey
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Conventional wisdom says that they should be kept at 20-23 I think,.. though I have mine at about 24.

The tank looks like about a 10G based on the dimensions. The problem I see with 2 liters of RO topoff every day is that it might cause a fairly large swing in GH being dumped in all at once. CRS are very sensitive to this sort of thing - I just lost my entire colony by doing the same water change I do every week, only this time the water was about 2dGH above the tank.

Is there any way you can do an auto topoff to keep things more stable?
If not, maybe drip the RO in every day to avoid rapidly changing conditions.

Whiskey
I was planning on dripping but yes, even so, it would cause large swings in TDS/GH/pH... let me check if I can get an auto-top off system. Thanks for the advice. :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
how about I place a piece of 2 liters ice and let it drip all day long? :D If I get the size right, do you think it would do the trick?
 
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