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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi guys,

I am going a bit crazy here about reading different lighting options and I would like to ask your help :)

Tank:
140 gallons or 530 liters.
63inchx24x24inch or 160cmx60cmx60cm

Soil and I am injecting co2.



At the moment I have quite basic plants:
Ceratopteris thalictroides
cryptocoryne parva
Cryptocoryne wendtii 'Mi Oya'
Nymphaea lotus
Hygrophila difformis
Ceratopteris thalictroides
Echinodorus bleheri

I am thinking of adding Java Moss, Anubias and maybe one or two red plants.

This is my previous set up before I went travelling for couple years:


So I am thinking of doing something similar again. Not sure about the carpet though.


I have the same light under the hood:
4x80w T5



I kinda want to replace that with LED lighting.
This brings me to the problem. I do not know what to choose.

I am living in Europe, so basically I have picked out 4 different options:

1. Zetlight ZP 4000 48-56inch, which 46W, 4100 LUMENS
The cost is roughly with the signal receiver and controller ~ 250€ or
280usd

2.Finnex planted 24/7
The cost is roughly the same with the first one, ~250€ or 280usd
3. USA satellite Plus PRO 48-60 inch 60w, with 60 leds.
The most expensive one, coming about 380€ or 430 usd.
4.DIY? Have no idea how much it would cost or how do it though :D


What do you think guys?
What would be the best option?
If I pick something from 1-3, do I need two of them because of the size of my tank?

Probably the cheapest option would be best for me. I do not really have a lot to spend on this upgrade.
 

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Any LED under 160W will be a downgrade.. roughly, from what you are used to..
There is no cheap led option except a DIY...and that is not "exactly" cheap either..

PAR 38 floods are the cheapest optin but involve hanging fixtures and limited control..
IF you can get Bridgelux VERO COB's then you have some fairly cheap and easy to build chips to use..

To be honest my current "go to" recommendation is DSunY direct from China..
Slightly hard to work with and apparently has a "fear factor" involved.. but .... it is what it is..

3 =C6F Panels plus controller.................
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
What do you reckon how much light will I lose if I swap my current set up with the first option (Zetlight ZP 4000 48-56inch, which 46W, 4100 LUMENS) ?
At the moment I have 4x80=320W under the hood. Are the W even comparable to each other?
I do not think it is that simple 46w vs 320w? Or is it?

Would I be needing something like this from DSuny?
For 120-150cm freshwater tank programmable dimmable led aquarium light new programmable controller with 4 channels dimmable, View led aquarium light, DSunY Product Details from Shenzhen DSunY Electronic Science And Technology Co., Limited on Alibaba.
 

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What do you reckon how much light will I lose if I swap my current set up with the first option (Zetlight ZP 4000 48-56inch, which 46W, 4100 LUMENS) ?
At the moment I have 4x80=320W under the hood. Are the W even comparable to each other?
I do not think it is that simple 46w vs 320w? Or is it?

Would I be needing something like this from DSuny?
For 120-150cm freshwater tank programmable dimmable led aquarium light new programmable controller with 4 channels dimmable, View led aquarium light, DSunY Product Details from Shenzhen DSunY Electronic Science And Technology Co., Limited on Alibaba.
no it is not "quite" that easy but w/out PAR measurements you need to go by something..
t5's are relatively efficient in output but how much "effective" light is based on reflector and its efficiency.
From your image I'm not impressed by the current reflector so that is a downgrade.
t5's can do 100l/w and if properly reflected are quite efficient though from a new tech perspective, a bit boring.. ;)

As to watt conversion.. well if one can ONLY use w/gallon and only use a small collection of studies then t5's then your close to 3WPG t5s translate into 11/2wpg LED..Actual PAR measurements from diverse sources such as aquarists and orchid growers have it documented.. As does Phillips ect.
LED efficiency and its light geometry just make it a good approximation at 2x the effective light of a t5..
The Zetlight woud need the best current state of the art diodes (200l/w to even come close to your t5 setup..at best they are running 100 lumens/w and their own calculations bear that out a bit..
t5's can do 100l/watt so your current "theoretical" output is 32,000 lumens..
JUST using raw theoretical output the zet is 8x less output than your current setup..:(

Point is even w/ out hard numbers there are numerous "pointers" that will point you in the right direction..

And "generally" speaking the "light delivery efficiency" and spectrum" point to LED's being 2x more effective on a w/w basis......and getting better all the time.

As to your link just be aware each "panel" in the series is :
54x12x3.6cm............ 21.26x4.72x1.42inch
So you only need 3 panels not 4 and the "fit" is a bit tight..
54cm x 3 = 163cm plus spacing between panels..

IF you are serious about doing a DSunY just write to them and give them your tank dimensions and type i.e freshwater. They may have a better fit option. They make at least 2 sizes of panels
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
no it is not "quite" that easy but w/out PAR measurements you need to go by something..
t5's are relatively efficient in output but how much "effective" light is based on reflector and its efficiency.
From your image I'm not impressed by the current reflector so that is a downgrade.
t5's can do 100l/w and if properly reflected are quite efficient though from a new tech perspective, a bit boring.. ;)

As to watt conversion.. well if one can ONLY use w/gallon and only use a small collection of studies then t5's then your close to 3WPG t5s translate into 11/2wpg LED..Actual PAR measurements from diverse sources such as aquarists and orchid growers have it documented.. As does Phillips ect.
LED efficiency and its light geometry just make it a good approximation at 2x the effective light of a t5..
The Zetlight woud need the best current state of the art diodes (200l/w to even come close to your t5 setup..at best they are running 100 lumens/w and their own calculations bear that out a bit..
t5's can do 100l/watt so your current "theoretical" output is 32,000 lumens..
JUST using raw theoretical output the zet is 8x less output than your current setup..:(

Point is even w/ out hard numbers there are numerous "pointers" that will point you in the right direction..

And "generally" speaking the "light delivery efficiency" and spectrum" point to LED's being 2x more effective on a w/w basis......and getting better all the time.

As to your link just be aware each "panel" in the series is :
54x12x3.6cm............ 21.26x4.72x1.42inch
So you only need 3 panels not 4 and the "fit" is a bit tight..
54cm x 3 = 163cm plus spacing between panels..

IF you are serious about doing a DSunY just write to them and give them your tank dimensions and type i.e freshwater. They may have a better fit option. They make at least 2 sizes of panels


Thank you for your answers! I really appreciate them!! :) :)
So I took your advice and wrote to Dsuny. They suggested getting this one:
http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=609465&thumb=1


It is 290€/325usd without the wifi and the version with wifi is 330€/370usd.


You mentioned that they have a fear factor in. What kind of? :D

Also with that light I should probably to an open tank. I think it could be pretty awesome to add another dimension to the aquarium and maybe have plants growing out. I wonder how much light would I lose if I have it hanging. Would I be able to grow any red plants or carpet?
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
For some odd reason my last message disappeared, so I´ll write it again.

Thank you for all your answers. I really appreciate them!! :)
So I took your advice and wrote to DSunY. They suggested getting this one for my tank:
http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=609473&thumb=1

It would be with two panels.

Roughly 290€/325usd without the wifi and 330€/370usd for the wifi operated controller. The price is kinda in the ballpark I would be willing to spend. Probably no more.
The only thing is that I would have to hang it from the ceiling. I have always had closed aquariums so this would be something new. I kinda like the idea of adding another
dimension to seeing the tank and letting plants grow out as well.
But if I have it hanging above the tank, would I be losing light as well? Would it still be strong enough that I could grow red plants and maybe carpet?


You mentioned that Dsuny lights have a fear factor in them? What do you mean by that? :D

I can see that there are 4 different functions with the controller, but would it be possible to use it like this:
9am-12pm 50% lights
12pm-6pm 100% lights
6pm-10pm-50% lights
Or something similar..

At the moment I have my lights on for 8 hours and I kinda wish to have it more. If it is not possible or it will cause algea then I understand and I would stick with my 8 hours.
 

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Well China direct, communication issues, and most warranty service I've seen is DSunY sending you replacement parts..
That said most things are an easy fix..

Each channel is individually dimmable in 10% increments so theoretically just dim each ramp each and then dim.
No idea in the number of "steps" per channel though..
Maybe check out the facebook users page..


did remind me that the wifi module is a simple "plug in" and can be bought later..
https://www.facebook.com/DSunyownersforum/

There are lens options so hanging can be more targeted.. but there is also a rail kit so it can be set right on the tank.
At 120 degrees you only need to be about 7" off the water line..

Hmmm still a bunch lower lumen output than your orig. t5's...
to be honest.. 2 "units" would really be recommended, but one is better than any other alternative..

WELL NOT quite...
https://www.reefbreeders.com/new-photon-v2/
Just an fyi, these lights are "chinese OEM but currently just reef centric.. A "set" for your tank would cost almost $1000.. 24 + 36
They should start to appear in the flee bay area under a different name and "hopefully" fw centric,,

For $200 plus US you can get a static LED:
EVO Quad 60" Timer LED Aquarium Light Marine Coral Reef Cichlid 80x 3W 150 cm


Dimensions - 59.50” x 9.25” x 1.25”
Brackets add 0.65" in height
Includes 80 LEDs
10800 Lumen
3 watt LEDs
64x 10000K
16x Actinic 460nm
2x two mode on/off switch
Mode 1 turns on all LEDs
Mode 2 turns on Actinic LEDs only
Timer ready. Fixture pre-wired for add on timer module
2x pre-wired connection for timer modules
Timer module is not included
External LED drivers
Extendable wire brackets
Slim and contemporary design
Extendable bracket 60"-62" (150cm - 160cm)
Optional timer module add $22.00
Optional cooling fan add $25.95
Optional hanging kit add $17.50
110V - 220V

Listing includes:

1x 60" EVO Quad fixture
2x External LED driver
might need to hunt for a 6500k version though.............

Edit: better answer to the channel program question..

For Turing light, we have a big advantage of the program mode, we offer 8 time points for your to design your own mode. And the light intensity doesn't change suddenly, slowly changed like the natural light, isn't it amazing? haha, hope this can help you make fantastic mode by yourself.
If any interests about our Turing light, please feel free to contact [email protected]
https://youtu.be/O5lCoCZoqPQ
 

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As Jeff mentioned before the vero 18s, and maybe for a tank the size of yours vero 29, are a very good option, if your are willing to do a little diy work. You technically don't have to solder because you can buy a harness for the lights. But personally I would still solder the wires together.
With the vero 18 you get two colors 2700k and 5600k décor series lights and mount the two colors side by side. Then for the length of your tank you would probably do 5 sets, so 10 LEDs total. Each light produces 4000lm at 1000ma so that's 40000lm total, which actually gets you more light than you theoretically have now. And technically you can get 1500ma drivers so that brings each light up to 5000lm each and 50000lm total. Now you will most likely want to run the 2700k at a lower power to get a good look. But it's still a lot of light.
So cost wise the LEDs are $15 each so your at about 170 for LEDs and there harnesses. Then you will probably need a 600w 48v PSU which is 80 then you need the controllers, there are many options here. I don't have much experience in controllers. I'm using a iAqua controller. But a storm controller with 2 8xldd board and 10 ldds is about 160. So that brings you to around 400. Then you also need a heatsink so around 500 total.
Now that is more than you want to spend but becuase you have pwm dimming you can dim from 0-100% and depending on the controller you can ramp up your lights very slowly. I have heard of people having their lights on for 12 hours a day and not having algae issues. Vero's especially the décor series have very high cri which is the color rendering index. Now cri isn't the greatest measurement of color accuracy but it is the best currently available and used. So the colors of your plants will be very accurate there are some filler LEDs that could be added to make the vero's better but they are not needed to get great results.
I must pay credit where it is due and say that most of what I just said is information that Jeff gave to me in my thread. And also I am from the US so these are the prices I can get stuff for, your prices may very.
,Brian
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
As Jeff mentioned before the vero 18s, and maybe for a tank the size of yours vero 29, are a very good option, if your are willing to do a little diy work. You technically don't have to solder because you can buy a harness for the lights. But personally I would still solder the wires together.
With the vero 18 you get two colors 2700k and 5600k décor series lights and mount the two colors side by side. Then for the length of your tank you would probably do 5 sets, so 10 LEDs total. Each light produces 4000lm at 1000ma so that's 40000lm total, which actually gets you more light than you theoretically have now. And technically you can get 1500ma drivers so that brings each light up to 5000lm each and 50000lm total. Now you will most likely want to run the 2700k at a lower power to get a good look. But it's still a lot of light.
So cost wise the LEDs are $15 each so your at about 170 for LEDs and there harnesses. Then you will probably need a 600w 48v PSU which is 80 then you need the controllers, there are many options here. I don't have much experience in controllers. I'm using a iAqua controller. But a storm controller with 2 8xldd board and 10 ldds is about 160. So that brings you to around 400. Then you also need a heatsink so around 500 total.
Now that is more than you want to spend but becuase you have pwm dimming you can dim from 0-100% and depending on the controller you can ramp up your lights very slowly. I have heard of people having their lights on for 12 hours a day and not having algae issues. Vero's especially the décor series have very high cri which is the color rendering index. Now cri isn't the greatest measurement of color accuracy but it is the best currently available and used. So the colors of your plants will be very accurate there are some filler LEDs that could be added to make the vero's better but they are not needed to get great results.
I must pay credit where it is due and say that most of what I just said is information that Jeff gave to me in my thread. And also I am from the US so these are the prices I can get stuff for, your prices may very.
,Brian


Thanks Brian!

That is a lot of good information. They are selling vero 18s and vero29s here. Roughly $30 here in Estonia. The only thing that worries me, is that I am not really a diy guy :D Especially with something like that :D


Have been speaking a bit more with Dsuny and their offer was:
1 unit of FW-C6-4(4 panels + 1 wifi controller) is USD549.99 with shipping.


Whereas if I order Zetlight from the US, I could get two of these for the same price:

48inch Zetlight ZP 4000 48-56inch, which 46W, 4100 LUMENS The cost is roughly with the signal receiver and controller

It would still be a bit cheaper.

I wonder, which one of them has better build quality?
Been looking for reviews for the DSunY one and I have seen quite a lot bad ones out there :D
 

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You probably need two lights is what I was thinking when I first saw your posting. I don't know anything about the Dsun products, but you have a 24" deep tank and a single light may not give off enough to cover the whole floor without taking it far enough off the tank that it isn't helpful at all.

I personally own the Planted Plus 24/7 and like it. It appeals to me enough I'm putting 2 of them on my cube, but people are different in what they like. :)
 

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You probably need two lights is what I was thinking when I first saw your posting. I don't know anything about the Dsun products, but you have a 24" deep tank and a single light may not give off enough to cover the whole floor without taking it far enough off the tank that it isn't helpful at all.

I personally own the Planted Plus 24/7 and like it. It appeals to me enough I'm putting 2 of them on my cube, but people are different in what they like. :)
Old style 2 channel Dsuny..
https://youtu.be/jFzfLmBmfDc

some par data.. Source was independent I believe but dsuny "borrowed" it for marketing..
not sure it is "that" high on the 24" tank.. but even if off by 50% still plenty for a planted tank

 
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