[Greggz]

Since I've been battling BBA and I do have a good amount of flow in my tank this is an interesting theory that I might have to test out myself!

As far as your tank, I would say it looks awesome with all those plants! But I'm sure it is a bunch of maintenance to keep them all looking good!!

You know at one point I had loads of flow. In addition to three filters, had four power heads running. Just crazy flow.

Then I began to notice a correlation between where the flow was aimed and algae. Even on the front glass, I would get it right where the power heads were aimed. As I began to phase them out, right away I noticed a reduction.

So not saying flow isn't important. But plants waving around barely staying rooted is not good flow in my book. In my tank I think a wide gentle flow is better.

Now that being said, who knows this dang BBA could spring up again any time. But so far so good.

 

[Greggz]

Interesting, but it can't be just be the mechanical movement of water molecules on the algae ...could it?

Seems more likely that the higher flow is either bringing more of something(s) to bear on the BBA that it likes or the increased flow is moving something(s) away from the BBA that it hates. Maybe something is leaching from the substrate or accumulating near it that the BBA likes. Maybe the BBA misses the organics that Purigen removes.

First test is to put the Purigen back to see if that's it. Then, what is the flow adding or taking away that makes the difference.

Re: PO4. I has similar reactions from plants and algae when I tried maintaining 2ppm. Had to bump it back up to the 6-8ppm area to recover.

You know I have no idea of any scientific reason, but I sure have seen a correlation between BBA and high flow areas.

As to Purigen, I will probably put it back in sometime, as I enjoy the crystal clear look it gives the tank. Going to let it go a week or two more first, just to see how things run for awhile without it and with lower flow.

Now as to P, I've never been afraid to dose good amounts. Standard EI levels and my plants seem starved. And personally I have never seen a correlation between high P levels and algae. Just the opposite, too little P and unhappy plants are easy target for algae.

 

[chayos00]

As to Purigen, I will probably put it back in sometime, as I enjoy the crystal clear look it gives the tank. Going to let it go a week or two more first, just to see how things run for awhile without it and with lower flow.

Thought you put the purigen back in on 5/5 or about that time.

 

[Greggz]

Thought you put the purigen back in on 5/5 or about that time.

I did. Put it back in, and made no other changes for three weeks. BBA was still forming right at the front of the tank.

That's when I started looking for other possible causes.

Pulled it when I lowered the flow, as I didn't want it to be an influencing factor.

None of this is really an exact science.....right now I'm guessing flow had a causal relationship with the BBA.........but then again, could be something completely different.

You get what you pay for with my experiments!:grin2:

 

[mgeorges]

I did. Put it back in, and made no other changes for three weeks. BBA was still forming right at the front of the tank.

That's when I started looking for other possible causes.

Pulled it when I lowered the flow, as I didn't want it to be an influencing factor.

None of this is really an exact science.....right now I'm guessing flow had a causal relationship with the BBA.........but then again, could be something completely different.

You get what you pay for with my experiments!:grin2:

I'm a firm believer in your theory sir. Where do I have BBA in my tank? On my power head. I've got a few minor spots on less-than-healthy leaves and on the substrate, but my power head is covered in the stuff.

 

[sdwindansea]

BBA in my tank definitely likes the high flow areas (e.g. spray bar). However, it also likes certain surfaces way more than others (wood, buce, eco complete).

 

[Maryland Guppy]

BBA liking high flow areas, not a secret, many have spoke of it.

My spraybar is the only place I deal with it.
Not a high flow tank either.

LFS near me has gobs of it on everything.
Thinking of asking for something that is covered in it just to bring home and test.
Place it in my tank and just watch what happens.
But! , no more experiments for me, need to clean up things.

 

[Greggz]

BBA liking high flow areas, not a secret, many have spoke of it.

My spraybar is the only place I deal with it.
Not a high flow tank either.

LFS near me has gobs of it on everything.
Thinking of asking for something that is covered in it just to bring home and test.
Place it in my tank and just watch what happens.
But! , no more experiments for me, need to clean up things.

Agreed that too high of flow causing BBA has been discussed. Then again I've also seen more flow suggested as the solution to BBA. I think that there is a misconception as to what good flow is. It's not plants waving frantically around the tank. And poor flow can be an issue, as stagnant water with low oxygen is no good either.

And not to be lost in this discussion is that the number one cause of BBA is poor tank maintenance. Dirty filters, lack of water changes, too much light, not enough CO2, poor plant management (pruning/trimming/etc.), starving plants, lack of vacuuming, poor flow (stagnant water) over feeding fish, over stocked tank, etc. are all far more likely to cause BBA than too much flow or anything else. I'm guessing one or more these issues might be the problem at your LFS.

But even with good tank maintenance, the beast can arise. And when it does, it gets my full attention.

And I like the idea of bringing home something covered in BBA. Would be very, very interesting to see what would happen. My guess is that it would just sit there and survive for quite a long time. Seems to me that preventing it is one thing, but getting rid of it when it's already there is another. Personally I trim liberally to get it out of the tank as quickly as possible.

 

[ipkiss]

..
Agreed that too high of flow causing BBA has been discussed.
..

And I like the idea of bringing home something covered in BBA. Would be very, very interesting to see what would happen. My guess is that it would just sit there and survive for quite a long time.

Yea, I think I had a variant that was all too happy to hang around the outflow Lucky it wasn't too interested in taking over the tank.

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/12-tank-journals/936906-10-years-stumbling-2.html#post10044922 (outflow on top just left of middle)

 

[Maryland Guppy]

Plants making it or melting?

 

[Greggz]

Plants making it or melting?

No melting, so that is good news! And only two days in the tank, so a bit too early to say anything for sure.

But so far, the Polycarpa, Ranunculus, and Didiplis look like they are faring well. The Polycarpa especially looks very happy, and I'm looking forward to seeing what color it becomes. Should be interesting.

Now the Rotala Vietnam is a 50/50 bet right now. Not really doing anything, just sitting there. I've never had much luck with Wallichii, and this looks pretty similar. So we'll see, maybe it will surprise me and perk up. Just got to give it a bit of time.

Once they get going a bit more and I find a good spot for them I'll get some pictures.

 

[Maryland Guppy]

Polycarpa can be a beautiful orange color!
Ranunculus, trim runners, main plant will get many leaves.
Didiplis looks cool with seed pods and can be a prolific grower, trim and it will branch.

 

[houseofcards]

BBA liking high flow areas, not a secret, many have spoke of it.

My spraybar is the only place I deal with it.
Not a high flow tank either.

LFS near me has gobs of it on everything.
Thinking of asking for something that is covered in it just to bring home and test.
Place it in my tank and just watch what happens.
But! , no more experiments for me, need to clean up things.

That is so true about many LFS. They've almost taking BBA to an art form as I've seen it completely cover ornaments and other hardscape in the tank. LFS tank are a good example of accumulated organics that don't get cleaned so the BBA runs wild.

BBA to me accumulates in areas where the organics settle. In crevices of rock and wood especially. The spraybars also have pores in the plastic that are large enough to house the organics. This location in particular could be flow rated as the flow is the delivery system and slowing it down slows down the accumulation of organics which could also affect rocks, wood, etc.

 

[Greggz]

Well good news no return of any BBA so far. Could be the combination of lower flow and higher P, as I've noticed plants all seem happier since I upped my P dosing again.

And last few days I have been messing around with my pH drop to see how far I could take it. Usually have it at 1.35, which is already pretty high. Bumped it up to 1.45 for a few hours today, then went up to 1.5. At that point the fish started stressing pretty quickly. Really an almost immediate reaction.

But the interesting thing is how the tank can pearl like mad when you bump it up like that. I am used to seeing some pearling everyday, but it seemed like in just minutes at the higher rate some plants just exploded with bubbles. Gotta say it looks pretty cool, but I couldn't keep it up that high for the sake of the Bows. Too bad as I bet the plants would love it. Does show there is fine line you can walk getting the CO2 just right.

And of course, why not a Bow pic.

 

[Discusluv]

This tank is spectacular and those Rainbow's are amazing!

 

[Grobbins48]

The pearling is great! Nice pictures!

 

[Immortal1]

Oh wow - amazing pearling! May have to do some experimenting next weekend with my various settings (co2/par).

 

[Greggz]

Oh wow - amazing pearling! May have to do some experimenting next weekend with my various settings (co2/par).

Yeah the key thing there is the weekend......or a time when you will be there to observe.

I had a rainy Saturday, so perfect for me.

And do keep an eye on the fish, as I could see quickly when I had gone over the line. I think like me, you are pushing it pretty hard already, so might not take much to see effects.

 

[Greggz]

Here's a follow up for @Immortal1. A while back we were discussing various colors of Mermaid Weed (Proserpinaca Palustris). I posted a pic then of some young plants, and was going to let them grow up to the light. So below are the before and after. Once they get closer to the light, the tops can turn a very nice kind of burnt orange color.

Now I've seen pics of this plant blood red, but that is result of Nitrogen starvation. I can assure you these are not deprived of anything, it's only the effect of stronger more intense lighting. And this plant can change into a wide range of shapes of colors depending on the tank. Interesting to see the different variations sometimes.

 

[Nlewis]

That is so true about many LFS. They've almost taking BBA to an art form as I've seen it completely cover ornaments and other hardscape in the tank. LFS tank are a good example of accumulated organics that don't get cleaned so the BBA runs wild.

BBA to me accumulates in areas where the organics settle. In crevices of rock and wood especially. The spraybars also have pores in the plastic that are large enough to house the organics. This location in particular could be flow rated as the flow is the delivery system and slowing it down slows down the accumulation of organics which could also affect rocks, wood, etc.

I to believe organics is the key and excessive light just accelerates it. Whenever it creeps up in my tank it’s a sign that my filter needs a good cleaning. After it’s been done the BBA fades away on its own.