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Discussion Starter #1
now that i got your attention, can u tell me what gender these are? i bought them thinking one was a male and the other a female, now im not so sure, they seem to be both flattening the top of their dorsal fin like the one on the right is in the picture, I could not see pink on any of the fish in the tank so i tried to sex them by body shape and the first few rays on the dorsal fin.


also, what is GBR mating behavior, i cannot tell if they are trying to "flirt" or pissed off at each other, the one keeps chasing the other around and they do loops on the back wall then they leave each other alone for a while and try again, they did flair at each other when i first stuck them in but have stopped
 

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The one in front is a male, I'm almost positive. Can you get a closer picture of the one following? The dorsal fins do look a little different, and the black is less defined on the one in the rear. It might be a female whose pink belly hasn't developed yet.

Edit: missed your second question. The female's pink belly should color up a lot around mating time. You might see them twirling or nudging each other. They'll also find a smooth rock, or a smooth piece of driftwood to clean for laying the eggs on. Some will dig a pit too I think, if there are no stones or wood available. I had a pair of GBR's for a while, and they had several batches of fry, usually about once a month.
 

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I've read around and the most certain way to sex a ram is to see if there's any blue in the black spot. A male's spot is black in the very center of it with some blue "spangling" around the edge, while a female will have "spangling" throughout the spot.
 

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Are those stress bars? Both my rams have bars like that all the time. I always just thought they were natural markings. When my fish are stressed they usually lose most of their color.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
thanks guys, from the behavior i have witnessed i would guess they are both males, im gonna take one back adn exchange it today
 

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Fresh Fish Freak
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Are those stress bars? Both my rams have bars like that all the time. I always just thought they were natural markings. When my fish are stressed they usually lose most of their color.
IME rams usually stripe up like that due to stress, submission, illness... it's rarely a good sign if they look like that absolutely all the time.

What temperature do you keep their tank? They do like 82-84F...
 

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Fresh Fish Freak
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Just keep an eye on their behavior.

If something is wrong they'll show in some other way as well, I wouldn't go just on that. If they start fighting all the time, or go off their food, or just hang around in one spot breathing really quickly... then there's a problem.
 

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I agree they are both males. What size tank are they in? They are going to need room to hide if both are to coexist

When sexing rams I look for all three items mentioned. The red belly is a definite. Without that I check to see relationship of the anal fin to the tail fin. As fish dork stated with the male it should extend past the begining of the tail fin. The blue spangling on the black spot is not a definite but is a pretty good indicator.
 
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