[eser21]

Hi all, what will happen if i dont do a weekly water change to re set the tank with EI Ferts??

 

[PinoyBoy]

The purpose of the water change at the end of the week in an EI routine is to 'reset' the available nutrients in the water that wasn't consumed by the plants. Please correct me if I'm wrong; that's how I understand it.

 

[eser21]

erm, thanks but i did kinda say that, im wondering what happens if you dont do it weekly...?
Does it cause algae or become toxic...???

 

[PinoyBoy]

Sorry :icon_neut didn't fully read it.

One of my 2.5 has an EI style routine, but within the last month, I haven't changed the water. GSA and GDA on the glass. My conclusion is excess nutrients = algae bloom. Doesn't seem to be toxic because my cherries are still alive and acting normal.

 

[wkndracer]

Following the full EI dosing schedule as it's presented in basic format I'd think the excess would become very high in even 2 weeks but I've yet to read any reports of a fish kill. If your not able to do the scheduled change why not just cut back a bit on the dosing?

 

[eser21]

Its not that i cant do the change its more that i would like the knowledge. If im running a routine i would like to know in advance what the consequences of failing to complete the routine would be.
Fore warned is fore armed!!!

 

[OverStocked]

Eventually you'll reach toxic levels. The water change is essential to the EI method.

 

[eser21]

Hmm, this hasnt scratched my itch... has anyone tried only bi weekly changes to see if it changes how EI works??
I know it sounds stupid but when i get things in my head i have to poke it till it bleeds and i have a definitive answer.. lol
I know that EI is a proven method and Tom Barr took what im sure was a long time to refine the process im just curious....

 

[kamikazi]

Hmm, this hasnt scratched my itch... has anyone tried only bi weekly changes to see if it changes how EI works??
I know it sounds stupid but when i get things in my head i have to poke it till it bleeds and i have a definitive answer.. lol
I know that EI is a proven method and Tom Barr took what im sure was a long time to refine the process im just curious....

sounds like an experiment....you should get on that and let us know what happens.roud:

 

[eser21]

sounds like an experiment....you should get on that and let us know what happens.roud:

Hahaha, maybe. Im not so sure im ready to risk my tank right now, i just got to a point im happy...ish. Still got plans lol

 

[plantbrain]

You can see what will occur ppm's wise...............:

DIY ferts for dry and solutions:
http://calc.petalphile.com/

Graphing:
http://ei.petalphile.com/

Plug some no#'s into the graphing and see.

You'd still need to relate this data to toxicity, of which we simply do not know what the toxic ranges are for virtually all species, we know what they are not..........which is well within manageable levels.

Even if you dose 2-3x a week and do a water change once a month.

My Example:

 

[mistergreen]

you can skip a few day of dosing if you're too lazy to change the water. My jungle tank consume quite a bit of nutrients. If I don't dose for a few days it would exhaust all of the nutrients.

 

[kamikazi]

Even if you dose 2-3x a week and do a water change once a month.

My Example:

When I start EI dosing I'm hoping to do 2-3 a week and water change 1-2 times a month.

Beautiful tank Tom

 

[HD Blazingwolf]

the way i understand. EI is relative to your needs. its adjustable. estimative. "oh i think i need more calcium ill just throw more in..." highern utrients dont seem to cause algae problems, its unhealthy plants IMO.. will you eventually build up toxic levels??? maybe, depends on ur plant load i would imagine. however... if ur have a PERFECTLY balanced setup it could take months before u need to do a change.. start testing your water and see what happens.. 2-3 x the recommended dosage levels dont hurt anyone

 

[eser21]

You can see what will occur ppm's wise...............:

DIY ferts for dry and solutions:
http://calc.petalphile.com/

Graphing:
http://ei.petalphile.com/

Plug some no#'s into the graphing and see.

You'd still need to relate this data to toxicity, of which we simply do not know what the toxic ranges are for virtually all species, we know what they are not..........which is well within manageable levels.

Even if you dose 2-3x a week and do a water change once a month.

My Example:

First off that is an amazing looking tank!!
Thanks for the calculators, i will have fun with that over the coming days....
Hope you dont think a noob aquarist from a little island is questioning your well thought out and proven fert program
Im thinking i might reduce my dosing to 3-4 days just because i find it difficult to do the change on the same day each week.

Now Tom if you can just write down a program to creating a tank like this then we will all be happy!!

How is it soo LUSH? Puts my feet firmly back on the ground!

Thanks again

 

[jhunt]

So in theory, if you had a planted tank with no fish and were EI dosing you could get away with never doing a water change as long as your lighting and CO2 were in balance?

 

[plantbrain]

So in theory, if you had a planted tank with no fish and were EI dosing you could get away with never doing a water change as long as your lighting and CO2 were in balance?

Well, till you started hitting upper bounds of salt stress with the plants, which might take a long time..........

Plants=> Fish => Shrimp is the flow for increasing sensitivity to nutrients.

Plants are very tough.

I'd still suggest a WC every 3-6 months.

Or you could test if you have some adverse reaction and break in hives anytime anyone suggest a Water change. Likewise, you could do a water change if you know you will not do any test kits.

Water change is par for this Hobby regardless, test kits can be optional, but useful if used correctly and consistently, which tends to be rare IME with hobbyists and clients.

The NON CO2 is non CO2 with good reason, slow things down like LABOR, which is a good reason to have slower plant growth in a non CO2 tank to begin, you want to avoid BOTH test kits and Water changes, eg.....labor.....but still have it look good.

I get all sorts of bone headed arguments trying parlay the CO2 and pull off no water changes/no testing etc...........if that is the goal, non CO2 is the simply put: the BEST method available.

I really do not understand the ignorance folks often have towards non CO2, it's right in front of them, but they avoid it(not you, but folks in general).
It is without any doubt, the most sustainable method there is. And it can look quite nice for the lazier among us or the time strapped. CO2 is the single largest killer of fish and cause of algae, and too much light a close second for algae.

 

[plantbrain]

When I start EI dosing I'm hoping to do 2-3 a week and water change 1-2 times a month.

Beautiful tank Tom

That's very easy to do.

The key, use less, not more light, then CO2 is easier, and then dosing is far more forgiving etc.

Another tank similar:

 

[plantbrain]

First off that is an amazing looking tank!!
Thanks for the calculators, i will have fun with that over the coming days....
Hope you dont think a noob aquarist from a little island is questioning your well thought out and proven fert program
Im thinking i might reduce my dosing to 3-4 days just because i find it difficult to do the change on the same day each week.

Now Tom if you can just write down a program to creating a tank like this then we will all be happy!!

How is it soo LUSH? Puts my feet firmly back on the ground!

Thanks again

UKAPS.org might help you out locally more, and put you in contact with resourcing various products and ferts etc.
Supercoley1 often post and he's a non CO2 and CO2 guy.
Clive is a EI zealot etc.
George is a great scaper and good all around aquarist
Most in the UK are privy to using the right lower range of lighting fortunately, they do not have HLD, high light disease, it's very common in the States.

Generally, very so.........I use about 1.5W per Gal, or about .4W per liter.
With LEd lighting, you can cut this by 1/2 if you DIY a Cree 3 watt system

Most opt for the T5's, least right now.

I have larger and deeper tanks, in smaller tanks, under 60cm -90 cm depth, the light will be quite high even at this lower end.

 

[kamikazi]

Another tank similar:

OOO ok now you are just showing off