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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey guys, I got a few plants that look like they're on the brink of death, mostly my amazon sword and jungle val.

I picked up flourish excel yesterday to see if that would help and I planted with root tabs in gravel substrate.

Lighting is aquatic life dual t5HO





Think they will make it with the flourish?

Note, the pics make them look greener then they actually are
 

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As long as there are some healthy roots, white ones, those plants should do very well. You may have so much light that you will need to use at least Flourish Excel to avoid lots of algae problems.
 

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From the photos the plants do not look close to death, in fact, they look fairly good for new plants.

The swords look like they still have emersed grown leaves on them. They haven't fully converted to submersed form. You will likely lose some of the older leaves.

You mentioned the plants aren't as green as the photo shows? The new growth looks a little pale, is that just from the camera or are they actually growing in white/pale?

Also, flourish excel is known to damage and kill vals. I wouldn't use it with vals in the tank.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Oh, good to know. I think the vals might be vetting taken out soon then. Was hoping to put some kind of grass in instead

There is no white growth, that is just the camera.

Haha JJ he's been doing a lot of hiding in the cabomba lately. Comes out every now and then, so I'm keeping a close eye on him cause I know GBRs are tough to keep.
 

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From the photos the plants do not look close to death, in fact, they look fairly good for new plants.

The swords look like they still have emersed grown leaves on them. They haven't fully converted to submersed form. You will likely lose some of the older leaves.

You mentioned the plants aren't as green as the photo shows? The new growth looks a little pale, is that just from the camera or are they actually growing in white/pale?

Also, flourish excel is known to damage and kill vals. I wouldn't use it with vals in the tank.
Zapins, I agree with the emersed leaf comment, I made a similiar one to the OP in a local aquarium facebook group.

I would slightly disagree with the Excel comment regarding vals. Vals are sensitive to excel, yes I agree there, but if you slowly condition them to excel over a few weeks, they thrive with it. I used a method, by halving the recommended initial dosing of excel in my lowtech tank, spending a week and a half at the recommended daily dosing and since then overdosing excel at about 2ml per 10 gallon and the vals are doing amazing.

In conclusion, I agree vals are sensitive to excel, BUT can do well with excel if acclimated slower to glut. Large, weekly doses of excel, or a large initial dosing, can kill the plant though.
 

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True enough, they do seem to be able to tolerate it to some degree. Just passing along the general advice for good plant health.

Personally I also don't see the benefit in dosing a tank with vals since it is a substance known to hurt them, just because they can tolerate it and not die doesn't necessarily mean it is doing them any good!
 

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True enough, they do seem to be able to tolerate it to some degree. Just passing along the general advice for good plant health.

Personally I also don't see the benefit in dosing a tank with vals since it is a substance known to hurt them, just because they can tolerate it and not die doesn't necessarily mean it is doing them any good!
Its a bit of a leap to say they are just tolerating it and that it isn't doing them any good.

I think much of the anecdotal issues with excel and certain plants comes from infrequent large or initial dosing, vs. slowly ramped up acclimatizing, and then daily dosing.

Not trying to come off argumentative. Just pointing out that inherent initial sensitivity should not be construed as harmful, and sensitivity may not indicate a lack of benefit.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·


Not much of a difference since the last post.

After looking back on old pics the excel didn't seem to do much good or bad. Then again I was using carbon filter therefore in kind of held of on the dosing.

What do you guys think?

I am taking my carbon out today and want to get these suckers growing nicely
 

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Not much of a difference since the last post.

After looking back on old pics the excel didn't seem to do much good or bad. Then again I was using carbon filter therefore in kind of held of on the dosing.

What do you guys think?

I am taking my carbon out today and want to get these suckers growing nicely
From a distance, those plants look healthy. I think that removing the carbon should help because I believe it neutralizes any ferts you may have been using. The Excel by itself wouldn't have done much to help your plants (other than keep algae at bay) without at least some fertilization.
 

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Its a bit of a leap to say they are just tolerating it and that it isn't doing them any good.

I think much of the anecdotal issues with excel and certain plants comes from infrequent large or initial dosing, vs. slowly ramped up acclimatizing, and then daily dosing.

Not trying to come off argumentative. Just pointing out that inherent initial sensitivity should not be construed as harmful, and sensitivity may not indicate a lack of benefit.
I'm using Excel in my 2g nano that has some jungle val in it, and the Excel hasn't melted my vals. I do a .25mL daily dosage (4 drops), which is slightly higher than the recommended daily dosage. However, it is definitely good to know that I can use the recommended daily dosage (or higher) for my large tanks. I plan on buying a gallon of metricide soon so that I can dose my 10g and 20g tanks daily. Both will have plenty of vals.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
From a distance, those plants look healthy. I think that removing the carbon should help because I believe it neutralizes any ferts you may have been using. The Excel by itself wouldn't have done much to help your plants (other than keep algae at bay) without at least some fertilization.
Yea I just found out that excel isn't even a fertilizer. I should probably get some flourish comp? BTW the naming of that product is confusing to me. The bottle that just says 'Flourish' is Flourish Comprehensive right? Or are they 2 different products?
 

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Are you sure it's jungle Val in your nano? They'll quickly outgrow a 2 gallon tank.
I definitely have jungle val. It grows really slowly though. I re-did my scape in the nano a few weeks ago and stuck root tabs along the back wall. I planted 4 or 5 jungle vals in the back, and they've been growing and sending out runners ever so slowly. I think it will be quite a while before the leaves ever reach the surface, and as slowly as it grows, it won't be difficult at all to trim the leaves.
 
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