The Planted Tank Forum banner

Crystal and Bee shrimp dying despite ideal water parameters, what can be cause?

5622 21
I've been trying to keep shrimp but they always keep dying.
The shrimp simply stops moving, and then is dead. Happens very gradually over the course of a day. I know the shrimp is dead because it literally just falls on its side or up side down. After some time, if they are well hidden and I cannot find them, they turn pink.

The shrimp species is a mixed collection of crystals and bees and other cf. cardinia species
The tank setup is currently a 10 gallon tank, that's definitely cycled, as it's been running for almost 3 months now.
Water parameters are consistently
ammonia 0
nitrite 0
nitrate 0 (yes, it is 0, other tanks show above 0 nitrate using the same test kit)
pH between 6.0 and 6.4
GH 6
KH 0-1
TDS 160-180
Temp 74 degrees F
Using API freshwater kit plus API GH and KH
I run an array of LEDs from Nicrew that's on in the morning and in the evening when I get home using a timer. The light has full brightness for about 2 hours with half brightness the rest of the time.

I do 10-20% water changes about once a month, and test weekly, sometimes twice a week, so water parameters remain consistent.
I feed a variety of food, includes Shrimp King sample pack, PlecoWafers from Tetra, frozen worms, BacterAE, GlasGarden BetaGlucan, rotating between the collection of food.
There are a few mini Indian almond leaves in the tank which are occasionally eaten.

The tank has three kinds of filters running, I have one air pump running two sponge filters, one a small filter and another a Mattenberg style sponge filter, and a Aqueron 10 gallon HOB with a sponge intake filter cover.

The tank has Anubias, frogbit, java mass, Marimo balls, and dwarf baby tears planted on a thin layer of fluval shrimp stratum with a centerpiece of a large piece of driftwood.

The only significant change I've done is
- Treat tank with 125 mg of Fish Bendazole, which was about 2 weeks ago. I replaced the carbon filter in the tank once the treatment had killed off the hydra in the tan.

Of note however, I do have three amano shrimp, Caridina cf. babaulti numerous bladder snails, and three microrasboras, none of which have shown any signs of stress or illness. The amano shrimp, babaulti shrimp along with the snails do end up eating a lot of the dead shrimps, as I have the tank almostly entirely covered with plants which makes it inaccessible for me to locate and remove dead shrimps.

I'm beginning to think that crystal and bee shrimp are not worth keeping, as there must be some mysterious secret trick to keeping them, as I am at the end of my rope and followed every advice I found on keeping the shrimp, besides keeping them in a species only bare bottom tank, which is not something I'm looking for in a community display tank.
1 - 20 of 22 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
5 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Substrate is about 1/2 inch of Fluval shrimp stratum
Shrimp appeared to be dying about 2 weeks after treatment with Fenbedazole, I used 125 mg of the medicine in the 10 gallon tank

I did a small water change and replaced the carbon filter after 3 days

No fertilizers or CO2

I drip accliamated them three weeks ago for about four hours
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
86 Posts
How long ago did you add the substrate? Did you cycle the substrate?
I had a similar situation with fish dying using Fluval Stratum. The ammonia spikes were the cause of the fish dying. I just waited 1 more month until everything stabilized. (finish cycling)

Now that tank is my shrimp tank and is very healthy.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,697 Posts
From my understanding, the Fishbendazole is 10x stronger than the dog version of it that's often recommended. The dog version you use .1 gram per 10 gallons. Therefore, if the Fenbendazole is 10x stronger, then you want an even weaker solution... about .01 gram, or 10 mg.


My best suggestion would be to trash the tank and the substrate and start over. Also would not recommend Fluval for Crystals and Bees.


Sorry!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,697 Posts
I feel like I've seen more complaints against Fluval than for it, from the people who actually know how to use it.

Most people I see that are for it are often new to using a buffering substrate and often don't know how to properly use it to get the best benefits from it.



Many people that are new to buffering substrates often use tap water on the substrate, which can cause unstable water parameters, especially each time they do a water change.

Fluval *usually* only buffers to 6.8 pH (not so for OP) and many of the fancy shrimp that people raise may be raised in tanks with a pH anywhere from 5.4 to 6.5 at the highest. If the pH is too high, then the shrimp may not do as well as if they had been in lower pH.

Fluval substrate may only last 6-8 months. Not too many people have it lasting 12 months or longer and continue to buffer. There are other substrates out there that can easily last 1-5 years and continue to buffer to the same levels! That said, it's still recommended to change the substrate out around the 1 year mark as anything beyond that isn't exactly guaranteed. That is, if it's being used *correctly*.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
45 Posts
That’s good to know. I definitely fall in the latter category. I’m running a fluval 305 and 405 in two different tanks, I got them for cheap on Craigslist. That being said, I would fall in the “know enough to be dangerous” category. I guess I’ll have to keep a closer eye on my ph levels. Thanks for the info, this is my first shrimp/planted tank, so the learning curve has been steep.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
45 Posts
I was afraid of over feeding them, so I’ve cut back on the shrimp wafers. I have tried adding some veggies, My nerite snail loved it but the shrimp never even went near it.
I added all of those taller plants to try and break up the flow a little, why do you say that’s a problem?
I tested the water this morning;
Nitrate- ~20
Nitrite- 0
GH- ~25
Chlorine- 0
KH- 40
Ph- 6.8


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,697 Posts
That's a scary thought.... I could potentially forgive the KH, but GH should really be 3-5 dGH/GH°, which equals out to 54-90 ppm. This is assuming that you have Crystal shrimp.

If you have Neos, then you want 6-8 GH° minimum, or 108-145 ppm.

NY - guessing New York? If yes, well, soft water... which may technically work in your favor, but you do need to add minerals to it for whatever shrimp you keep. It's recommended to go with RO water and minerals just to rule out anything bad that might be in tap, or from fluctuations in tap water based on season and whatever the city might add to it. (even non-municipal water could be contaminated).

Would highly recommend having liquid test kits. Minimum being API Freshwater Master Test Kit and the GH/KH kit sold separately. That said, I've heard that Nutrafin and Sera are better, although they tend to cost more.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
45 Posts
I alternate every other test between the API strips and liquid.
I’m actually in the Fl panhandle. I typically use ro, however my last water change may have been tap. I’m planning on adding a cuddle bone in the tank, that should suffice for a mineral stone, correct?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,697 Posts
Florida... also soft water... I would highly recommend getting a remineralizer. I don't think the cuttlebone will suffice unless you grind it up and dissolve it into the water. It might not dissolve very well... Seachem Equilibrium would work in a pinch, but something specifically for shrimp would be recommended - and depending on type of shrimp and substrate would depend on if you need GH only or GH and KH remineralizers. Never a good idea to use straight RO.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5 Posts
Discussion Starter · #19 · (Edited)
How long ago did you add the substrate? Did you cycle the substrate?
I had a similar situation with fish dying using Fluval Stratum. The ammonia spikes were the cause of the fish dying. I just waited 1 more month until everything stabilized. (finish cycling)

Now that tank is my shrimp tank and is very healthy.
I added the substrate about 2 months ago. I'm not sure how to cycle the substrate, but I simply added it to the aquarium. the water was cloudy for a while and then it was fine. The current residents at the time were a little shocked but otherwise did fine and went on their way after a couple days of hiding

Bump: I am keeping the tank for now since the plants, microrasboras and amano shrimp are doing fine. I'll avoid any crystals and bees until I see what the problem is

Not sure why the quotes aren't transferred when I replied, but wanted to add one more thing

I've been using RO water, but my GH seems to stay steady at 6 degrees, which I feel is odd. Is it possible the API GH kit can be inaccurate? I would normally use salty shrimp but since my GH doesn't lower I never needed to add it for any water changes

Bump: I see, it could be your soil is helping. In the future I'll keep that in mind

Bump: i see, I've only been using RO water from the RO machine at my local grocery, which has helped to keep the pH low. On occasion the pH drops below 6.0, the lowest reading possible for the API kit. What are good ways to measure pH below 6.0? I see some things on amazon but would like a standard kit that other people are familiar with
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,697 Posts
You can get a digital pH reader (from something cheap to something that monitors the pH at all times and may cost upwards of $80+) or use the Sera or Nutrafin test kits. They have a broader range of pH levels than API does, although it's a little less specific? Still should be good enough. I have API and a cheap/simple Sera kit, which I don't use very often...

Any chance that you have rocks or coral in the tank that's increasing the GH? Either something in the tank is raising the GH or your RO water isn't RO... which should be easy to confirm with the GH kit and/or the TDS meter.

You can use the multi-quote option if you want to quote multiple messages in one response. Easiest way I think to do that is to Multi-Quote all the messages you want to quote, except the last one, just press Quote on that and it should put them all together?



If you want to try Crystals and Bees again, then I would recommend setting up a new tank just for them with RO water and some remineralizer to get the GH to around 3-5ish? (or match what the breeder has) Would not recommend even attempting putting them back in the tank where they died...
 
1 - 20 of 22 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top