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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I am not sure what I have and thought just maybe someone here at TPT might be able to tell me? What do you say? My guess is the Koi is a female and the other one...a male? There is a difference in their head shape and I thought because the blueish Angels head is more rounded meant it is a male and the Koi has a sloping head, so I assumed that meant girl.
 

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sure fire way is to examine the genital openings. other than that, cichlids in general look almost sexually identical. aside from a few species with obvious differing characteristics like color and , almost impossible to figure out until they pair up. and even then, both may end up being females! when fully mature, dominant males tend to crate a nuchal hump on their foreheads. with anglefish, this is slightly more difficult to see since they are already deep bodied fish.

this is a male angel:
 

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I that blue is as blue as the picture shows then it is amazing! where did he come from?
 

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sure fire way is to examine the genital openings. other than that, cichlids in general look almost sexually identical. aside from a few species with obvious differing characteristics like color and , almost impossible to figure out until they pair up. and even then, both may end up being females! when fully mature, dominant males tend to crate a nuchal hump on their foreheads. with anglefish, this is slightly more difficult to see since they are already deep bodied fish.

this is a male angel:
+1 to this. Sometimes you can also sex a female by body width. If they are straight on females will often have a bulge around their abdomen.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
sure fire way is to examine the genital openings. other than that, cichlids in general look almost sexually identical. aside from a few species with obvious differing characteristics like color and , almost impossible to figure out until they pair up. and even then, both may end up being females! when fully mature, dominant males tend to crate a nuchal hump on their foreheads. with anglefish, this is slightly more difficult to see since they are already deep bodied fish.

this is a male angel:
Your Angel is beautiful! I love the eye!!! Question...how do I go about examining the genital area on my Angels? Or, what am I looking for? This is probably a silly question, but I really don't know what kind of tools fish have!
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I that blue is as blue as the picture shows then it is amazing! where did he come from?
Pretty close. S/he is awesome looking, changing shade throughtout the day getting deeper and more colorful as the day go on. Come evening there is some pinkish hue under the tail and along the back but it didn't show up in this picture. I got him/her at my LFS...my LFS got the fish from a couple here in town who breeds them.
 

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Pretty close. S/he is awesome looking, changing shade throughtout the day getting deeper and more colorful as the day go on. Come evening there is some pinkish hue under the tail and along the back but it didn't show up in this picture. I got him/her at my LFS...my LFS got the fish from a couple here in town who breeds them.
Well Alaska is a little too far to drive for a fish, to answer your question (maybe) your koi looks as though it has lived a rough life, maybe cramped in a small tank with too many other angels and the fins became perm. bent etc, if the angel was kept in poor conditions it may never express the typical shape of a certain gender.
I had a partial wild with a bent dorsal fin so even though it was a 'long fin' it only had the height of standard.
Discus are notorius for having different eye:body ratios depending how they were raised.
 

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I never try to decide sex on the shape. It is just really iffy. For fish the size of angels, it is easier to do the vent thing. Sometimes it is obvious without close looking. The koi appears to be female from here but that is not very firm from looking at pictures alone. It looks like there are two tubes sticking down.
The best way is to hold them upside down in a wet hand and look. Two small vents of same size is male. One vent larger than the other is female. The egg tube requires a larger opening than the male sperm. Small cichlids will be much harder and less reliable. I use a magnifier to try to judge better. Good luck!
 

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I never try to decide sex on the shape. It is just really iffy. For fish the size of angels, it is easier to do the vent thing. Sometimes it is obvious without close looking. The koi appears to be female from here but that is not very firm from looking at pictures alone. It looks like there are two tubes sticking down.
The best way is to hold them upside down in a wet hand and look. Two small vents of same size is male. One vent larger than the other is female. The egg tube requires a larger opening than the male sperm. Small cichlids will be much harder and less reliable. I use a magnifier to try to judge better. Good luck!
Well that's a better answer than I could ever give:icon_sad:
 

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Wow beautiful Blue Angel! The really good way to tell seems to be when they pair up but like others said it can be done by looking at body features and shape
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Well Alaska is a little too far to drive for a fish, to answer your question (maybe) your koi looks as though it has lived a rough life, maybe cramped in a small tank with too many other angels and the fins became perm. bent etc, if the angel was kept in poor conditions it may never express the typical shape of a certain gender.
I had a partial wild with a bent dorsal fin so even though it was a 'long fin' it only had the height of standard.
Discus are notorius for having different eye:body ratios depending how they were raised.
Oh that's sad! I wondered why the Koi Angels dorsal fin was so weird looking. It just so happens, this poor fish has spent 8 years of it's like in a cramped 55 gallon at my husbands place of work. It shared this tank with African Cichlids, Koi, Common Goldfish, Tetra varieties, common plecos and a single Red Rainbowfish. There was constant overturn of fish because, of course, they would not live long, being replaced constantly. The Red Rainbow and the Koi Angel somehow survived for 8 years! They both moved into my tank when the 55 broke. There were some other fish too, but I took them to the LFS because I did not have space for them nor did they belong in the same tank! Unfortunately the Red Rainbow died a month after moving to my tank. The poor thing had a missing fin, barely any scales (covered in scars instead) and could barely swim a straight line. I had just found a home for it that was a 180 gallon red rainbow species tank! He had never schooled with his own kind. It would have been great for him.

Soon after, they got a 30 gallon and stuffed it full of Koi, Common Goldfish, a common pleco and a ton of Black Skirt tetras. Months later they decided they wanted the Angel back and as wrong as this may sound to some, I refused. My husband was mad as hell, but I did not care. This poor Angel had been with us for 5 months and was really settling in with it's Blue Angel buddy. When I agreed to take the fish, they never said anything about returning them in several months, so that was the leg I used to stand on.
I strongly feel this poor Angel deserves to retire from a stuffed, chaotic tank. So, it's been 2 months since they wanted him back, and finally it has been excepted the Angel stays here.

Anyway, sorry for the long read. Thank you for pointing out why his body is shaped funny. I always wondered why s/he looked this way.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I never try to decide sex on the shape. It is just really iffy. For fish the size of angels, it is easier to do the vent thing. Sometimes it is obvious without close looking. The koi appears to be female from here but that is not very firm from looking at pictures alone. It looks like there are two tubes sticking down.
The best way is to hold them upside down in a wet hand and look. Two small vents of same size is male. One vent larger than the other is female. The egg tube requires a larger opening than the male sperm. Small cichlids will be much harder and less reliable. I use a magnifier to try to judge better. Good luck!
Hmmmm, great! Thank you! Now I just need to catch them. I feed them by hand, but I don't know how they'll feel if I grab them HaHa!

If they are the same sex, when both are mature, will that be bad? The only reason I was wondering sex is because the juvenile is getting older now, and I don't want him/her kicking the older Angels butt. If they are same sex, and this would be a problem, I would move the betta out and get more Angels to help out with the f/m ratio and conflicts.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Wow beautiful Blue Angel! The really good way to tell seems to be when they pair up but like others said it can be done by looking at body features and shape
I picked the blue Angel when s/he was the size of a quarter (counting finnage) The two of them took to eachother immediatly without any aggression (my LFS owner told me to watch closely because they would either hate eacother or love eachother) A month passed, and until recently the juvenile was off on it's own, but recently it has started sticking to the mature angel like glue until feeding time. I have noticed a bit of awneryness coming from "blue" too swimming up under the Koi Angel and slightly nipping at the area just infront of the anus. So, this got me wondering if the Blue is concidering the Koi competition or mate.
 

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I picked the blue Angel when s/he was the size of a quarter (counting finnage) The two of them took to eachother immediatly without any aggression (my LFS owner told me to watch closely because they would either hate eacother or love eachother) A month passed, and until recently the juvenile was off on it's own, but recently it has started sticking to the mature angel like glue until feeding time. I have noticed a bit of awneryness coming from "blue" too swimming up under the Koi Angel and slightly nipping at the area just infront of the anus. So, this got me wondering if the Blue is concidering the Koi competition or mate.
Hmmm, it could be either showing agression or it could be trying to find a potential mate, Make sure to keep an eye out for eggs
 

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I never bother to handle my fish just to sex them.
As they mature they will identify themselves in due time by deed. Sounds like the blue is a male trying to coax the Koi with the belly nipping. (imo) Males tend to play better unpaired in groups than females. Without a female in the tank males for the most part just hang around without hassle but drop a girl in and all bets are off LOL. (just like High School)

With a female only tank one will be dominant and once that's settled the fighting stops. The girls will get a little crazy at times and the dominant female will false spawn. Two females will 'team up', lay a clutch, defend it and I think wonder why the eggs don't hatch LOL, it's the nature of the fish, seen it several times.

very nice blue zebra
 

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angels are iffy to sex unless you really know what your doing. I have two pairs and I wasn't sure about one pair until last night. And that's only because I have a fresh hatched clutch of eggs. The only true difference I've seen is the females start to get a swollen abdomen at about eight months old, due to eggs. The males are usually a little more trim. Good luck wth them. And +1 on standng your ground with the rescued angel. Sounds like your husands workplace doesn't know much about stocking fish. That angel probably would have died shortly after being crammed into a smaller tank.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Thank you Dastowers :) Congratulations on you Phillippine Blues. It looks like that's what I have. Hmmm...the breeders claim they collected their breeding Angels from the wild on a trip. I thought my little blue had to be something else because the wilds do not look like him. I still would have choosen him anyway. I find him/her gorgeous!

Looking forward to seeing yours! hint hint :)
 
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