Burning Seawater

we'll see.
sounds like a hoax.
Or the energy needed to burn the salt water would equal the energy release. So it could be a waste of time.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6vSxR6UKFM

I'll try to read more about it to see if it's any good... But seriously this is amazing. The world's most abundant substance burning. No electrolysis either!

It's not a hoax. I seriously hope not.

Ok so far it's not efficient enough... BTW, does it being 76 percent of Faraday's Theoretical Limit mean that it is almost there or not?
Quoted from PESWiki

Efficiency-wise, they are presently at around 76 percent of Faraday's theoretical limit. (Other Hydrogen-from-Water methods, such as the one being pursued by Bob Boyce (http://freeenergynews.com/Directory/Transportation/Bob_Boyce/), are approaching 7x).

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This is simply one more perpetual motion machine in a long history of duped media and investors. You simply cannot split water into H2 and O2, then burn it and get more energy than you spent splitting it. That's fundamental thermodynamics. Lock this thread already, please.

swylie said:

Oh, christ. This is simply one more perpetual motion machine in a long history of duped media and investors. You simply cannot split water into H2 and O2, then burn it and get more energy than you spent splitting it. That's fundamental thermodynamics. Lock this thread already, please.

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1st Law of Thermodynamics.

Correct. What might work, however, is using the sun to do this. Basically, it all comes down to how can we harness the sun to create a useful and easily portable fuel source.

Why must you flame swylie?

And if it's so obvious, then why are there scientists trying to make it work? ?!?!?! BTW, this is not considered a form of electrolysis, at least according to peswiki.com


I do understand the first law of thermodynamics...

sandiegoryu said:

And if it's so obvious, then why are there scientists trying to make it work?

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Why do people spend money on figuring out the men like hot women? Great research there! That's about as obvious as being smashed in the face with a brick.

"Scientist" research a lot of goofy stuff, it's not always right.

well, we'll see.
This is the same hype cold fusion got in the 90's. And we know where that is.

The key is using salt water. Seems like the radio waves excites the sodium atom to the point of burning.. The explanation of splitting hydrogen from water was made up.

ps. you can easily split the hydrogen from water with an electrode btw.

sandiegoryu said:

I do understand the first law of thermodynamics...

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No, you really don't. This "discovery" violates thermodynamics. Nobody's ever observed a violation of the laws of thermodynamics. Even the cold fusion guys didn't suggest that they'd created energy from nothing, those scientists were just claiming they'd found a mechanism to reduce the energetic barrier to fusion, and that's not the same thing.

Dollars to doughnuts that this guy's "fire" and "radio-frequency generator" are more commonly known as plasma and a microwave. I was a pyro as a kid; I've already done this stinkin' experiment, and you can too.

It is interesting though.

My question is how much energy the machine uses, and if it could be refined so its more efficient would it be better than gass.

Either way its cool to see salt water burn,
-Andrew

Bunk bunk bunk. This enrages the scientists out there. </enragement>

So this is all a stupid little thing then.... I wonder wtf these "scientists" are thinking then.

No it does not break the law of thermodynamics! How so?!

"It does take much sodium to discolor the flame. We have measured the before and after burns and very little sodium has been expended."

Well it's not sodium...


Why aren't people like you doing all this research than people like them. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This world sickens me!!

from the movie clip you linked, I don't think there were any scientists in it.. It was just the guy and maybe his buddies.

like swylie mentioned, it's just a microwave exciting atoms and the atoms releasing energy in form of light and heat. Kinda like how a flouresent bulb works... The neon or whatever noble gas doesn't get 'burnt' up when electricity is introduced. It excited the electron of the atom and it shifts energy level and thus releasing energy. That's how I understand it.

In this case, the salt/sodium is excited. It wouldn't work with regular fresh water. Like I said, we'll see. A true scientist shouldn't make some claim without experimenting and redoing the experiment. I personally think that guy is pulling your leg.

sandiegoryu said:

So this is all a stupid little thing then.... I wonder wtf these "scientists" are thinking then.

No it does not break the law of thermodynamics! How so?!

"It does take much sodium to discolor the flame. We have measured the before and after burns and very little sodium has been expended."

Well it's not sodium...


Why aren't people like you doing all this research than people like them. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This world sickens me!!

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Point one. Yes, it is a stupid little thing. A scam, snake oil, fake, or any way you want to say it.

Point two. It does violate thermodynamics, you cannot create energy from nothing essentially.

Point three. I am an environmental geologist, cleaning up oil spills and the like so you can drink water. I'd say that I'm doing a little something for humanity.

Point four. The only thing that should sicken you is that you dont have the knowledge to see crap for crap. But that's ok, you're young. Just go to college, it will get clearer I promise.

I shall educate myself in college to see crap for crap.

And I don't really see why people would fake this thing. All they will get is attention. Maybe the guy wanted the attention to send his idea for the cure for cancer out?

No I was thinking about how you guys are very intelligent people doing very intelligent things and not doing all this bullcrap, and these very stupid people trying to do this stupid bullcrap. Nevermind I'm confusing myself.. I just recovered from a freakin migraine. (the real kind)

Why does it violate thermodynamics? It's burning saltwater. Supposedly the hydrogen or the sodium. It's not spontaneously creating fire from nothing. The radiowaves supposedly weakens the bond of the saltwater. Isn't that like saying burning oil is violating thermodynamics? Please educate me!

hey, scientists are human too. They too are prone to making inaccurate claims and sometime down right lies, like that south korean scientist claiming to clone human stem cells last year. But what's great about science is that every claim is scrutinize for the Truth or the closest thing the the Truth.

Well, we know this much, his machine isn't going to work for treating cancer. haha.

We are made of mostly salt water. 80% or something like that.



pps.... oil has potential chemical energy that needs a little kick start it to start burning..

Sea water doesn't burn. It doesn't have that potential chemical energy. Large amount of energy is require to get it to 'burn'.

Look up Perpetual Motion Machine.

It takes more energy to break the Oxygen Hydrogen bond than it gives up when it is created.

TANSTAAFL = There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch.
You can't get something for nothing.

The amount of energy he is putting into the system exceeds the amount he is getting out.

Yah I understand that Rex, but people are saying it defies the law of thermodynamics. I was confused on that. But now I'm not.

Just thought it was interesting. Wonder what my ocean science teacher has to say about it... He's the one who sent me the linky.