[driftwoodhunter]

I'm hoping to set up another 55 this fall, and I've always wanted angelfish, but I don't know if they are difficult or not. If I'm able to do this 55, it will be butted up, end-to-end, with another 55 that is a blackwater tank (mostly tetras). I hope to keep the tannin look to this 1st 55 tank, and I'd ideally like both tanks to have a similar tannin look as they will be considered a "pair". I've been looking at the wild crosses & the Peruvians at AngelsPlus, that's the look I seem to strongly prefer...
So, tall "grasses" like vals, and driftwood - all ok to use?

 

[night9eyes]

How many are you planning to keep? Are you looking to breed?

 

[kamikazi]

sounds alright to me. Tannin look is good for angelfish biotope setups.

 

[The Dude]

My tanks are pretty heavily planted and way over filtered. I was only able to keep 1 adult Pinoy Angel in my 46g (bully), but I've got 6 in my 75g. There is a little chasing, but it's spread out and they are all doing well. I only do water changes every few months, but keep them topped off and each tank is running 2 Rena XP3's. They haven't been hard to keep at all. They've only laid eggs once though.

 

[driftwoodhunter]

I haven't thought as far ahead as to plan on how many - one of my coworkers who used to have angels in a 90g said they fought constantly. Of course, I don''t know how many she had or what the tank conditions were. Since I'd only be using HOB filtration (one ot two) I was planning on 2 - 3 and a school of rasboras or tetras. Perhaps rummy-nosed or eyespot, etc. However, I want to get the eyespots now for the existing 55. I want the two tanks to have completely different stock.
I don't plan on breeding - yet. lol Maybe someday, when I learn more about optimum conditions for the fish. I have no desire to breed fish just for the fun of it. My blue rams keep spawning but they eat the eggs every time. If I were serious about it, I set up fry tanks. It's fun to see them living as naturally as is possible right now though!
I'm waiting to hear some test results on Thursday (medical), so this may all be put on hold anyhow, depending on what I hear. ($$ might have to be spent on things other than fish equipment) But it's fun to plan!

 

[flwrbed]

angelfish are very forgiving in my opinion.
i usually keep 6 adult in a 55 with no problems. i have had them in soft water and very hard water and they have spawned with ease in both. i think the key to angels is keeping the temps around 80-82. if you have rams spawning you will have no trouble with angels. just keep the water clean and feed them well.

 

[driftwoodhunter]

Thanks for all the good news - I've wanted angelfish since I was a kid! Back in the day, they had a rep for being difficult - at least according to my parents, who probably just didn't want any...lol.
I really love the look of the silvery ones with distinct stripes - that's what attracts me the the wild crosses & Peruvian ones I've seen. I don't like the rounded fins, either.

 

[snafuspyramid]

I'd be interested to learn how many angelfish your co-worker was keeping.

The magic number is 5 (or maybe it's six, can't remember). With this number of angels, not only does the aggression get spread out, but it tends to be reduced in absolute terms as well; they just don't seem to be as willing to pick a fight when they're in a shoal. However, they will still take a bit of time to sort out a hierarchy - and while you should keep an eye on your fish while this happens, it's relatively rare for injury to occur.

If you keep fewer than this, things tend to get nasty - especially once you get a bonded pair! I started out with seven in my 90 gallon, and a year or two later, have only a single very large (and sort of fat) pair.

I advise you to do something similar; buy a bunch of small angels (they're cheap when they're little), feed them well and perform plenty of water changes, and then remove the others once you have a bonded pair you like.

55 will be a perfect size for a pair.

And they'll be fine in black water. This more or less approximates the conditions in much of their native range. Plus, subdued lighting and darker substrate will cause them to show their best colours (the difference can be very striking).

 

[snafuspyramid]

Oh, and I should add something about getting baby angelfish. Like discus, they are very, very susceptible to stunting, particularly when young. If you get small fish from a poorly maintained fish store's tanks (i.e. almost all) it's likely to have suffered "ammonia burn" to its gills, and will have little chance of becoming an impressive specimen when mature.

Choose carefully. Try and get fish which have just arrived from the breeder within the last few days - or better still, go straight to the breeder if you can. Avoid fish with tattered fins (often a sign of bad water conditions), disproportionately large eyes or missing ventral fins (if the damage extends to the base of the fin, it won't grow back).

Vallisneria is an excellent choice, but any plant tall enough for them to lurk in - grass-like or not - will be just fine.

 

[driftwoodhunter]

The ones I've been looking at are about $13.00 ea. for .50 cent size Manacapuru Wild angelfish. The wild crosses are about $17.00 ea, they are 2" plus body size (I guess that means 2" body plus fins?) I haven't looked around much yet, AngelsPlus seems to be highly recommended...
Once in a while I see angelfish at petsmart for $6.00, but I wonder how healthy they are...also, they're always calico in color (not sure what the correct color is called).

 

[night9eyes]

The reason I asked about # is because the general rule of thumb for adult angels is 1 per 10 gallons. I'm not familiarized with Peruvians, but if they have a similar body type to Altums, they will need a tall tank to maximize their growing potential. And if by any chance you get a pair, depending on how territorial they are when breeding, you may need to separate them in another tank or put up a divider.

I currently have 7 young angels that I've raised since pea size in my 90 gallon-- and they have room now but I am willing to add more tanks if I need to take a pair out. My tank choice for angels is a minimum of 24" deep, and although not a requirement, I know they appreciate and use all the upper levels.

In a 55 I personally wouldn't have more than 4. Some angels can get as large as small plates (body size-- I've seen firsthand) And there is something about angels having room to grow out to their full potential. HTH

 

[wkndracer]

1adult/15g of tank size :smile:

55g or 75g 4 full grown adults w/6max in a 75g having mild mannered fish.

All males in a 75g I've been up to eight for a short period (about 4 months).
Males only = no false spawns less BS, add one female all bets are off LOL.

 

[kamikazi]

I have a pair in my 29, the male bickers with my Bolivian Ram, and we he is irritable from that I have seen him chase the female a little. They get along great 95% of the time. Spawned a few weeks back, but I think they ended up eating the eggs.

I agree with wkndracer about the 1 per 15. I'm probably going to be pushing the limits when they get full size.