[Crazyjayb]

Oh boy, here we go again. This time hopefully scud free.

I'm making a new journal so hopefully some shrimp folk can help me out with some advice.

My plan is to make a tank designated to breeding fancy shrimp.

I'm currently in the buying phase and need some opinions.

My tap water comes out at 25 tds, 2 gh, 2kh, and a ph of 7.4.

I plan to have the tank divided into either 3 or 4 different sections by a tight foam barrier with each of these sections having a small sponge filter. I have considered siliconing glass walls instead, however have decided against that because the foam will be tight against the glass top and the water level will be a few inches below it.

Now for my questions:

1. What would a good fancy shrimp be for my water? I can of course remineralize.

2. Does anyone have an opinion on how I should heat the tank? Because of the dividers I am unsure how to evenly heat it.

3. Anyone have any favorite active shrimp substrates?

4. Anyone have a favorite sponge filter that would work for this scenario?

5. I have had to wait an incredibly long time for bio film to grow? Is there any way to speed up cycling a tank as well as biofilm growth? I won't be using seeded media from my other tanks for fear of scuds.

Thanks in advance for any responses.

 

[Sam the Slayer]

Are you willing to use ro water? If not, I would go with tigers or Neos and use gh booster for tigers and gh/kh booster for Neos. If yes to ro water than any shrimp will work as you can make the water whatever you wish. Any active substrate will strip the kh with every water change and just run out too fast. Unless you’re willing to use bagged active substrate that you keep adding I wouldn’t use it without ro water.

Caridina ro water (remin)
Caridina and tigers ro water (remin)
Tigers and Neos tap (remin)
Neos tap (remin)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Blue Ridge Reef]

My tap water comes out at 25 tds, 2 gh, 2kh, and a ph of 7.4.

Get that GH to around 5-8 with a remineralizer and you should be set. My own tap comes out at 2 dKH and Neos have done well in it for many years. As Sam said, you'll want KH closer to 0 for fancy bees and such.

I plan to have the tank divided into either 3 or 4 different sections by a tight foam barrier with each of these sections having a small sponge filter. I have considered siliconing glass walls instead, however have decided against that because the foam will be tight against the glass top and the water level will be a few inches below it.

I'm not certain foam is going to keep tiny shrimp fry in the section they were born into, but I'm not 100% clear on what you're using. Newly hatched shrimp are like specks of dust though. If there's an opening, they are getting through it. Just something to be mindful of.

1. What would a good fancy shrimp be for my water? I can of course remineralize.

If using tap, I'd stick with Neos and tigers. Of which there are tons of colors and petterns.

2. Does anyone have an opinion on how I should heat the tank? Because of the dividers I am unsure how to evenly heat it.

How cool does your room get? I rarely heat a shrimp tank, even my pond that drops to the 40's in the winter months keeps a population going. Glass isn't a great insulator, but I'd think it would create warmer and cooler zones to use a traditional heater in one section. Something like a reptile heat pad under the tank on a thermostat might be an option. If your room will stay above 60 in the winter months, I would forgo it, personally.

3. Anyone have any favorite active shrimp substrates?

Not if using tap water with much KH at all. They're ideal for bee tanks and RO, but I'd be hesitant to use them with your 7.4 pH water, seeing as this would create parameter swings when changing water.

4. Anyone have a favorite sponge filter that would work for this scenario?

I'm not aware of a brand that sets itself apart from others, they're pretty basic.

5. I have had to wait an incredibly long time for bio film to grow? Is there any way to speed up cycling a tank as well as biofilm growth? I won't be using seeded media from my other tanks for fear of scuds.

It's the bane of this hobby, see my signature line. Patience is a virtue in life, and the key to success in this hobby. Any suggestion I would have would involve adding from an outside established aquarium. Good luck and looking forward to seeing it!

 

[Crazyjayb]

Get that GH to around 5-8 with a remineralizer and you should be set. My own tap comes out at 2 dKH and Neos have done well in it for many years. As Sam said, you'll want KH closer to 0 for fancy bees and such.

I'm not certain foam is going to keep tiny shrimp fry in the section they were born into, but I'm not 100% clear on what you're using. Newly hatched shrimp are like specks of dust though. If there's an opening, they are getting through it. Just something to be mindful of.



If using tap, I'd stick with Neos and tigers. Of which there are tons of colors and petterns.

How cool does your room get? I rarely heat a shrimp tank, even my pond that drops to the 40's in the winter months keeps a population going. Glass isn't a great insulator, but I'd think it would create warmer and cooler zones to use a traditional heater in one section. Something like a reptile heat pad under the tank on a thermostat might be an option. If your room will stay above 60 in the winter months, I would forgo it, personally.

Not if using tap water with much KH at all. They're ideal for bee tanks and RO, but I'd be hesitant to use them with your 7.4 pH water, seeing as this would create parameter swings when changing water.

I'm not aware of a brand that sets itself apart from others, they're pretty basic.

It's the bane of this hobby, see my signature line. Patience is a virtue in life, and the key to success in this hobby. Any suggestion I would have would involve adding from an outside established aquarium. Good luck and looking forward to seeing it!

That is good to know. I was just asking because I was wondering if I could get away with it bc it is still very low... Would tap water at 1kh work? The place I am moving into next year has 1kh tap. I do however have an R/O unit, last time I was trying to use it I was just having problems with it. I'll have to pull it out again and figure it out soon.

I have not ordered yet but have been looking at this. It would be as snug as it gets https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01ESXXBO6/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=A39G1UAOFK1OOE&psc=1

It would be a huge PITA to lift up the tank as it is under my filled 40g but it is doable and I really like the idea of a reptile pad. Would the reptile pad be able to sustain being on 24/7? The temp when I had it filled up a week ago with no heater was at 67 degrees, are there large enough pads to cover the entire bottom? However, that was summer months and I don't think it would be good for the shrimp to be so cold especially coming the winter months and the fact I want this to be a for-profit tank and that will slow breeding a lot. I also would worry about temp swings as I like to leave my window open a lot.

I know I said I couldn't add from one of my tanks because the fear of scuds however I do have a few friends tanks... what would your suggestions be given that?

Thank you for your advice I strongly appreciate it!

Bump:

Are you willing to use ro water? If not, I would go with tigers or Neos and use gh booster for tigers and gh/kh booster for Neos. If yes to ro water than any shrimp will work as you can make the water whatever you wish. Any active substrate will strip the kh with every water change and just run out too fast. Unless you’re willing to use bagged active substrate that you keep adding I wouldn’t use it without ro water.

Caridina ro water (remin)
Caridina and tigers ro water (remin)
Tigers and Neos tap (remin)
Neos tap (remin)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I was hopeful I could get away without using RO water but I do have a filter I just have to work out a few kinks with it. Thank you for your response, btw given RO water at 1kh how long could you estimate substrate to last? I am planning on only adding enough to cover the top of the glass, perhaps use more?

 

[en7jos]

My tap water comes out at 25 tds, 2 gh, 2kh, and a ph of 7.4.

Just to note that something doesn't add up here with TDS. One degree hardness (KH or GH) is about 18ppm, so 4 degrees hardness total (2KH + 2GH) must give a TDS of at least 4 x 18ppm = 72ppm. TDS must be more than GH and KH ppm's combined.

btw given RO water at 1kh how long could you estimate substrate to last? I am planning on only adding enough to cover the top of the glass, perhaps use more?

I'd guess about 6 - 12 months for a decent layer of Amazonia, but depends massively on how much and how often you change water. I'm basing this guess on having depleted my Amazonia in about 4 months doing 20% weekly w/c's with 2 KH tap water, before I relented to buying an RO unit.

 

[Crazyjayb]

My tap water comes out at 25 tds, 2 gh, 2kh, and a ph of 7.4.

Just to note that something doesn't add up here with TDS. One degree hardness (KH or GH) is about 18ppm, so 4 degrees hardness total (2KH + 2GH) must give a TDS of at least 4 x 18ppm = 72ppm. TDS must be more than GH and KH ppm's combined.

btw given RO water at 1kh how long could you estimate substrate to last? I am planning on only adding enough to cover the top of the glass, perhaps use more?

I'd guess about 6 - 12 months for a decent layer of Amazonia, but depends massively on how much and how often you change water. I'm basing this guess on having depleted my Amazonia in about 4 months doing 20% weekly w/c's with 2 KH tap water, before I relented to buying an RO unit.

Yes!! That is exactly what I thought before with the tds and gh/kh. It's all funky and I asked about that a couple days ago and didn't get a response so put it on the back burner. Getting a new tds meter asap, any suggestions on ones that people know work well? And yes I calibrated the meter as precisely as possible.

Damn definitely going with R/O. I had the original intention of if going with R/o water to boost kh to 1 to prevent big ph swings but from what your saying I should keep it at zero? Or does substrate just run out super fast?

 

[en7jos]

Getting a new tds meter asap, any suggestions on ones that people know work well? And yes I calibrated the meter as precisely as possible.

HM Digital new AP-1 model:
https://www.amazon.com/HM-Digital-Dissolved-Resolution-Accuracy/dp/B007KDYOMU/
Works well, retains calibration, repeatable results, clear display, easy to use, not expensive, reliable, includes temperature calibration. Basically, it has /does everything you need.

Damn definitely going with R/O. I had the original intention of if going with R/o water to boost kh to 1 to prevent big ph swings but from what your saying I should keep it at zero? Or does substrate just run out super fast?

If you're going with active soil substrate and want to retain the buffering capacity, then RO water with 0 KH is best. Can't remember if you said what shrimp you wanted to breed though. Active substrates will generally hold pH somewhere between about 5.8 and 6.5, possibly even lower initially. So best for shrimp that like lower pH; if you want to breed neo's, then inactive substrate is easier (or else add KH to quickly deplete buffering, but that seems a bit of a waste!).

With enough active soil, you do not need KH to stabilise the pH, the soil's buffering will do that for you. KH only shortens the life of the soil (although some people like to keep a slight KH level (less than 1KH) for "shrimp health").

 

[Crazyjayb]

Getting a new tds meter asap, any suggestions on ones that people know work well? And yes I calibrated the meter as precisely as possible.

HM Digital new AP-1 model:
https://www.amazon.com/HM-Digital-Dissolved-Resolution-Accuracy/dp/B007KDYOMU/
Works well, retains calibration, repeatable results, clear display, easy to use, not expensive, reliable, includes temperature calibration. Basically, it has /does everything you need.

Damn definitely going with R/O. I had the original intention of if going with R/o water to boost kh to 1 to prevent big ph swings but from what your saying I should keep it at zero? Or does substrate just run out super fast?

If you're going with active soil substrate and want to retain the buffering capacity, then RO water with 0 KH is best. Can't remember if you said what shrimp you wanted to breed though. Active substrates will generally hold pH somewhere between about 5.8 and 6.5, possibly even lower initially. So best for shrimp that like lower pH; if you want to breed neo's, then inactive substrate is easier (or else add KH to quickly deplete buffering, but that seems a bit of a waste!).

With enough active soil, you do not need KH to stabilise the pH, the soil's buffering will do that for you. KH only shortens the life of the soil (although some people like to keep a slight KH level (less than 1KH) for "shrimp health").

Thank you, I just went ahead and ordered that tds meter after looking at the reviews, is this the one you use? Any suggestions on active substrate? I'm looking to breed some fancier species that require low ph.

 

[en7jos]

Yep, this is the TDS meter I now use. I also have the AP-2 EC meter that I use for my hydroponics (same meter but without the conversion factor that converts measured EC into a TDS guesstimate, but don't get me started on how mad we all are to even be talking about TDS!). Both seem to work well and I think are about as best you can get for sensible money.

So the question is: did you also order some calibration solution too? If not, then add this to your basket too:
https://www.amazon.com/HM-Digital-C342-Calibration-Solution/dp/B001VE99X8/

I know that the meters are allegedly factory calibrated, but both of mine were out. Not too much, but enough. Def worth calibrating as soon as you get a new meter and then checking every few months.

I've only ever used ADA Amazonia soil which works well once you understand it, but is probably not the best / easiest for a breeding tank. Maybe check out the Flipp Aquatics videos on YouTube, particularly the tank setup ones. He gives some pretty specific recommendations for which substrates to use for which shrimp. And sure others will post their recommendations here too. What "fancy" species in particular do you have in mind?

 

[Crazyjayb]

Yep, this is the TDS meter I now use. I also have the AP-2 EC meter that I use for my hydroponics (same meter but without the conversion factor that converts measured EC into a TDS guesstimate, but don't get me started on how mad we all are to even be talking about TDS!). Both seem to work well and I think are about as best you can get for sensible money.

So the question is: did you also order some calibration solution too? If not, then add this to your basket too:
https://www.amazon.com/HM-Digital-C342-Calibration-Solution/dp/B001VE99X8/

I know that the meters are allegedly factory calibrated, but both of mine were out. Not too much, but enough. Def worth calibrating as soon as you get a new meter and then checking every few months.

I've only ever used ADA Amazonia soil which works well once you understand it, but is probably not the best / easiest for a breeding tank. Maybe check out the Flipp Aquatics videos on YouTube, particularly the tank setup ones. He gives some pretty specific recommendations for which substrates to use for which shrimp. And sure others will post their recommendations here too. What "fancy" species in particular do you have in mind?

Oh thank you for suggestions that, I figured for the price it would probably include calibration fluid.. excited to see how far off my other meter was as well.

I actually had watched flip aquatics video on shrimp substrate but he pretty much just crapped on everything except for the company he was sponsored with and when taking a look at the rio escuaro substrate on amazon by bright well it had very few reviews and did not seem to be tried and true.

I am looking to breed pbls(prls), bees, tigers, and crystals. So about anything and everything. Really I just want to see what I can breed while hopefully making some side money.