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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So my tank is current 29gal and all I have is guppies and blue velvet shrimp. I've had the same family of guppies for 2 to 3 years now and I think the interbreeding is starting to get to them, they aren't as hardy as they used to be and the colors are starting to get bland.

I thought about taking out all of the males and replacing them with 2 or 3 new fancy male guppies. (Will the long tail guppies be okay in a tank with more guppies and shrimp?).
I also thought about taking out some of the bland looking females and replacing them with new colorful ones as well.

This tank started out as a tank to raise feeder fish for my turtles that's why there are only live bearers in it. It is planted and my turtles also get all the plants they can handle out of it.

Any fish suggestions that I could add safely with guppies and blue velvet shrimp?
I thought about mollies or platys.
I read the black mollies also ate algae so thats a plus if its true.

My only fear about Mollies and Platys are that they might be big enough to eat the shrimp and from what you can see in the picture I don't have that many places the shrimp can go that a fish cannot. I'm trying to increase plant mass for the shrimp so I can start seeing some more of their babies make it to adulthood.
 

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You can make enough money/credit out of that tank to expand.
You can grow, guppies, shrimp and java moss in the same tank.
That gives you 3 items to sell regularly. Being small scale you may get a little less, but at the end of the day it will pay for itself.

Been doing quite a bit of research lately. I'm in the process of turning my fish breeding into a farm as opposed to fish rooms.
Looking at doing about 5000 swordtails per month from October, so scales of economy add up a bit.
 

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Even the guppies are potential shrimp predators (speaking from personal experience here!), mollies and platies would definitely be large enough to make a meal out of your shrimp. Basically, the only truly shrimp-safe fish is an oto, that said, the smaller the fish's mouth and the more peaceful it's disposition, the less likely they are to actually make a meal of them. If you want something besides guppies, look at nano fish like ember tetras or some of the small rainbows (furcatas, threadfins, etc.). The threadfins are a bit larger, but they have tiny mouths and stay towards the top of the tank, and (at least ime) tend to not mess with the shrimp too much.
 

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Many people are doing guppies, shrimp and moss together. Those 3 items are always in demand, even more so when you can say; I grew those guppies and those shrimp in that moss.
There will be minor predation, but as long as you feed well, they should eat no more than needed to make up for your diet. With enough moss, this is not even an issue
 

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Have you looked into endlers (might want to look at the endler-guppy hybridization debate first). They might be something to replace or add to your collection (depending on what side of the argument you fall)
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Alright. I picked up 3 ottos and 1 female guppy, they said 3 should be fine in a 29 gallon is that too many? I have the option to bring 1 or 2 back if needed.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Many people are doing guppies, shrimp and moss together. Those 3 items are always in demand, even more so when you can say; I grew those guppies and those shrimp in that moss.
There will be minor predation, but as long as you feed well, they should eat no more than needed to make up for your diet. With enough moss, this is not even an issue
Haha I don't think I'll ever have enough extra moss to sell mine doesn't seem to be growing too quickly but I like the way it looks.

When you say feed well what do you mean? Right now I feed 1 algae wafer broken in half to about 10 small guppies, about 10 shrimp, and now 3 ottos and sometimes I'll give them a 2nd wafer at night time but that doesn't happen daily.

Have you looked into endlers (might want to look at the endler-guppy hybridization debate first). They might be something to replace or add to your collection (depending on what side of the argument you fall)
I looked into them now and they are pretty cool. If I would've seen them in stores I would think they were just guppies. I don't know if I can find them locally, I'll look next time I go to the aquarium shop.

After reading about them I kind of want to remove all my guppies and put them in a temporary 20 gallon as I feed them off to the turtles and start over with endlers. They're smaller than guppies so that actually helps me out a bit, they're less likely to prey on my shrimp, they'll be harder for my turtles to catch, and they got some cool color variations.


I think you would be fairly safe with Panda Cories. They stay quite small and are usually busy cruising the substrate.
From a quick google I read that panda cories like being in groups of 6 or more. I just added 3 ottos, would I still be able to add 6 Panda Cories? or would I be overstocking?
If I could add 6 more would they all have to be Panda Cories for them to happily school together or could I add different ones from the Corie family? (If there are any more that stay relatively small)

Thanks for the help everyone. So far I'm liking the Ottos, they stick together and are happily going from surface to surface searching for food. I dropped in an algae wafer but they didn't go after it so I'm guessing they aren't hungry or they're finding plenty of algae in the tank.
 

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Fish needs more than one type of food to avoid nutrient/mineral deficiencies.
Animals are very good at self medicating and finding what they need if it is readily available.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
They also get a small variety of other foods like carrot, koi pond pellets, and premium flake food. I just give the algae wafers daily. I used to give them a pellet higher in protein but it started giving me a weird coat of oil at the top of the tank.

Maybe I'll work it into the rotation again, they were a lot more colorful when they were getting the extra protein.
 

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Try some nori sheets, only like a finger nail's size piece at a time.
It is quite good for fish that need a bit of veg. Also, if it is not a display tank, don't be shy to grow a bit of algae.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Nori sheets, the seaweed stuff? Ill give it a shot, hopefully they like it. I do try and grow some algae on the sides, but only the nerites seem to be going after it.
 

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I first read about the nori on here. I asked the chef that makes the shushi at the local supermarket for a piece to try.
All my fish seem to love it. But on has to take care not to overfeed, as uneaten bits are nearly invisible and you will only notice in in a glass bottom tank.
So just take care or you will add to the mulm in your tank. Stick with putting in a fingernail's size pieces at a time. You can always ad more if the fishes eat it fast.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
I had a friend that makes homemade Sushi and she gave me a small piece to try and it seems like they loved it. I'll have to buy some more since I only had enough for 2 feedings (fingernail size like you suggested).
The 3 ottos are doing amazing. They still ignore algae pellets but I see them actively eating algae off the walls, plants, and they seem to love the sponge filter.

For now I'm off to the aquarium store since my order of assassin snails just came in for a different tank, gonna try and breed them in my 20 gallon since I basically have a never ending supply of snails for them. I'll also look and see if they have endlers and cories. Any backup suggestions to look at if my lfs doesn't have cories?
 

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I have seen a guy keep a large tub of water with round rocks in, outside in the sun.
As the rocks green over with algae he puts them into his tank on a rotational basis.
His ottos clean a fist sized rock in no time.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Cool. With the speed they're working on my algae I'll might have to supplement their diet like that.

I took out all of my male guppies and added 2 male endlers. My LFS only carries males so I'll have to find females somewhere else. Until then I'll keep removing males and start putting all new fry in their own tanks so I don't accidentally mix a guppy in with my endlers. When I find somewhere to get them I'll remove all my female guppies.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 · (Edited)
Any suggestions on where to get female endlers?
I'm not sure where to get them since I can't find them locally and I haven't ordered a fish online before. Anyone want to list some places they trust? I'm just worried about getting fish DOA.

I'm also going to add some Neon Tetras and/or Cardinal Tetras (I read they will school together so could I get 3 and 3 for a school of 6 or would I need 6 each?).
If I have to get just 1 species I think I'll go for Cardinals since I read they are less likely to get
I thought about Panda Cories but from what I read they don't like gravel because of their easily damaged barbels and I have sand and gravel.

EDIT: I used AqAdvisor to see if adding 6 Tetras to my current stock would be to many but it said it would put me at exactly 99%. When I replaced the guppies to endlers it went down to about 70% which is weird, are they that much smaller that they have half the bio load? I didn't add my filtration or anything to the advisor and you can't add plants so I guess I could add more if I wanted but I'll leave that uncalculated space for guppy fry and shrimplets.
 

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You can make enough money/credit out of that tank to expand.
You can grow, guppies, shrimp and java moss in the same tank.
That gives you 3 items to sell regularly. Being small scale you may get a little less, but at the end of the day it will pay for itself.

Been doing quite a bit of research lately. I'm in the process of turning my fish breeding into a farm as opposed to fish rooms.
Looking at doing about 5000 swordtails per month from October, so scales of economy add up a bit.
keep me posted on how that goes :p
 

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Cool. With the speed they're working on my algae I'll might have to supplement their diet like that.

I took out all of my male guppies and added 2 male endlers. My LFS only carries males so I'll have to find females somewhere else. Until then I'll keep removing males and start putting all new fry in their own tanks so I don't accidentally mix a guppy in with my endlers. When I find somewhere to get them I'll remove all my female guppies.
I wouldn't think you'd have much trouble finding any kind of fish in the bay area. I drive 2 hours to purchase fish there! I just did a quick search on Craigslist SF. Someone has "pure strain" endlers for sale. 10 for $10.
 

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Ideally you'd get your starter fish from several sources to prevent starting off your crop with brothers and sisters mating.
Yes, it may lock down some of the visual features you'd like, but it may also produce lots of deformed or weakened fish.
 
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