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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I think I am going to make an ecosphere, not any ecosphere though. It is going to have fish, invertebrates, plants, Microfauna algae denitrification and and NO feeding (except for the beginning) it will be lit by the sun, I might add a cheap light for night time viewing. It will be a 20 long and every fish I will keep will breed and reporoduce and make a balanced ecosyste. I still have to make the food web

A fish ecosphere is definitely possible. One of the key elements is outdoor floating plants enriched with microfauna populations. My start is going to be a dry plant start, I am going to use emersed plants and fully terrestrial plants then flood the tank very slowly. Over time, it will enrich the substrate and then start to form an ecosystem, I will introduce all sorts of microfauna and shrimp at the start for a food base

My friend bred Dario in a 2.5 gallon bowl that he never fed so it’s definitely possible.
 

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Is at possible, yes, it very much is. The thing it requires is a vast understanding of cultivation of microfauna, usually using a sump and partial terrestrial habitat, usually located in racks submerged on the top hidden by hardscaping. You're going to need to do some entomology research as well because you're going to need the terrestrial soil turned over. I suggest doing vast research and try out culturing blackworms and springers and do some research into bog plants as they are crucial to biological filtration. Please understand the vast limitations on stocking and aquatic plant species available and understand that you'll need to be fully dedicated for about a year while you work through balancing both land and water ecosystems.

If you want an enclosed ecosystem reef systems are actually a lot easier to do thus with than planted tanks, but it's a heck of a lot more expensive at start up.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Here is my food web it is going to be more complex than this tho I’m just boiling it down to the simplest stuff (the co2 looks like it is spontaneously generated but I put life in parentheses because it is coming from all the life forms and bacteria if an arrow goes out to something it means that the thing it is pointing at is consuming it. The sun goes to the algae/mulm category and the plants/algae category. The mulm/algae is like the detritus and diatoms and stuff and green algae for the plant stuff. I am going to show it to Diana walstad in a different forum and ask her if I have any missing links inside of it
1028422


Here is my food web it is going to be more complex than this tho I’m just boiling it down to the simplest stuff (the co2 looks like it is spontaneously generated but I put life in parentheses because it is coming from all the life forms and bacteria if an arrow goes out to something it means that the thing it is pointing at is consuming it. The sun goes to the algae/mulm category and the plants/algae category. The mulm/algae is like the detritus and diatoms and stuff and green algae for the plant stuff. I am going to show it to Diana walstad in a different forum and ask her if I have any missing links inside of it
1028422
I am not concerned about turning the soil because all I am doing is getting grass and Emersed plants in it then I’m flooding it it’s going to be simple and complex at the same time. The difficult part is finding fish that don’t reproduce ridiculously fast and are hardy at the same time and won’t exhaust the whole food supply. One fish I’m thinking of doing is pygmy cories or aspidoras because they are hardy. Can feed in detritus so they won’t damage the shrimp population too much, also they will keep the substrate turned which will be important to help release trace elements from the bacteria and dirt into the full water colum. im Debating on wether to go filtered or no filter.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I have the tank in my room just not set up. I might check with my mom and see when I can start setting up the plants and dry start. im thinking taking about a month on that, so when I build a cabinet for my tank in shop class for my final, I can have the tank ready for said cabinet. After the cabinet is installed I will flood the tank 1/4” a day for the 1st week (2” of water at end of week) then at second week I will do 1/2” of water so 6” of water by 2nd week then I will finish flooding and get filled to about 10” before I go on my school conservation Trip to costs Rica. (Pray it happens still). After that I will acquire My unquarntined microfauna floaters. what temperature does water lettuce need to survive? I might see if I can grow it outdoors so I don’t have to pay for it. then, I need to start the food chain. After a week or 2 the mulm should be accumulated enough(I’m taking dirty siphon mulm and making mulm from it I might use other methods too) I will get the shrimp, any thoughts on what shrimp is easiest to breed and Most sustainable for my size tank and hard water (~350 ppm). When I get around 50 shrimp I should be alright to introduce my herbivores then soon after I can get the micro predators. This includes fish such as tetras. Then finally I can find a predatory fish. Definitely not anything that will slaughter everything in the tank but I was thinking something that would lower fry and shrimp fry population. Maybe a pair of kribensis or some African butterfly fish because they won’t slaughter everything in their path but If like a fry or shrimp gets close to the surface and the butterfly strikes them. I don’t know what else to say for now so I will let some people make thoughts on my plan.

Is at possible, yes, it very much is. The thing it requires is a vast understanding of cultivation of microfauna, usually using a sump and partial terrestrial habitat, usually located in racks submerged on the top hidden by hardscaping. You're going to need to do some entomology research as well because you're going to need the terrestrial soil turned over. I suggest doing vast research and try out culturing blackworms and springers and do some research into bog plants as they are crucial to biological filtration. Please understand the vast limitations on stocking and aquatic plant species available and understand that you'll need to be fully dedicated for about a year while you work through balancing both land and water ecosystems.

If you want an enclosed ecosystem reef systems are actually a lot easier to do thus with than planted tanks, but it's a heck of a lot more expensive at start up.
I agree with the reef tank thing. My reef friends talk about not feeding their tank for months just being sunlit and stuff. my friend has a beautiful cuttlefish ecosphere that’s like 100 gallons and is sunlit. I think he feeds it but idk

should I add flow though? I was thinking of using a naturalized matten filter (a sponge filter mixed with a internal filter) and covering it in like planrs And things just to give it a subtle flow to help circulate nutrients and do biological filtration because of how rivers work there isn’t just this 1 little pool in a river. Like you can have blackwater in a hill stream because there is a swamp on the river releasing tannins

I plan to feed the tank for the first few months so I can speed things up a little bit.

The stocking I think I will want could be like 1 colony of corydoryas Pygmy 1 colony of lampeye killis, 6 dwarf psudomugil then a predator of some type

I’m skimming over research tonight and then I’m going to bed, so plants wise I am thinking of going with in the emersed section, peace lily, pothos, emersed cryptocoryne, maybe a little carnivore plant but idk also Sagittaria and Echinodorus can be used

In the aquatic section I most likely will go with dwarf sag, wild collected water plants, I’m not scared of some kind of super virus coming into my tank because most likely it will be unheated Outside of the winter when the window can get cold. Also I will do Echinodorus crypts pearlweed hornwort and some obligate aquatic plants. I hope that I can make a natural setup where the obligate aquatic plants are underwater and the non obligates like swords, crypts, pearlweed, and other things will be growing outside of the water, even if it is a tiny bit.

this explains what I wanna do basically

Anyone have ideas?

I talked to my My ap bio teacher about it, they said it would be definitley possible. He keeps bio active vivariums and bio active aquariums (what I’m making) and he said that I just have to make sure that for Every bit of food produced, there has to be something to eat said food, and produce waste for the producers and nitrify and denitrifying bacteria to consume making a full ecosystem. he did recommend micro predators mostly, I am thinking of doing it a bit different but currently I think I will do darter characin and corydoryas hasbrosus a bn plec pair and then like some kind of schooling fish that could lower the fry population or a predator.

ok my plan now is 12 darter characin (one of the chunkier looking kinds) m/f L15 candy pleco a pair of some kind of dwarf chiclid, then 12 corydoryas hasbrosus. I do expect some die off in the fish so I am planning to get extra. which is the numbers above, all the fish wil, hopefully breed and sustain themselves. I am going to do a no lid tank and I will do a rain season most likely and rare water changes and also probably feed once a week for my sanity
 

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I do expect some die off in the fish
The goal in this hobby should never be to expect die off. Yes fish die sometimes, but by choosing to keep fish in a glass box we have the ability to prevent that, natural ecosystem or not.

Also, what happened to not liking nano fish and dwarf cichlids? You are contradicting yourself in all these threads and it is making it much harder for members to help you.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
By die off I mean like 1 fish doesn’t get enough food and dies and I hate nano dwarf African chiclids and I hate fish like celestial Pearl danios because they are too small to be enjoyable for me
 
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