Shrimp dying after rescape, please help! - The Planted Tank Forum
 1Likes
  • 1 Post By Blue Ridge Reef
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 8 (permalink) Old 11-26-2019, 06:37 PM Thread Starter
Algae Grower
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: East Brunswick, NJ
Posts: 5
Shrimp dying after rescape, please help!

I removed a moss tree from my fish tank along with a large quantity of moss and plants and my blue dream shrimp are rapidly dying and the water is cloudy/smelly. There is also this weird white stuff on the plants that is growing. The shrimp are all hanging as close to the surface as possible but the 4 oto catfish in the tank seem fine. Whats weird about these deaths compared to the usual shrimp death where their bodies normally turn white, here their bodies are staying blue but the back of their heads is turning a bright pink/red. All the inhabitants of the tank were fine before I removed the tree/plants.
Additional details and images are below. Any help you can give would be greatly appreciated since they are actively struggling as we speak and idk what to do.

Additional details:
Fish tank is 7.9 Gal Fluval EBI Ė substrate is black diamond abhrasive sand ( Inert ), driftwood was manzanita, fully cycled tank for over 5-6 months.
I panicked after noticing the shrimp at the top and dieing and did a ~40% water change incase there was anything in the soil that got released, but that didnít seem to help.
The water was cloudy, so I though maybe I removed too much of the beneficial bacteria or kicked off a new cycle, so I went and got a new bottle of safe start and dumped it in, that didnít seem to help.
The shrimp were grouped at the surface so I thought it might be a flow/oxygen thing, I cleaned out my filter aswell with fish tank water to remove some excess waste and increase the flow and pointed it in a way which the surface water is definitely flowing down to the bottom. I shut off my c02 aswell.
0 Ammonia
0 Nitrite
Less than 5 ppm nitrate as of yesterday and today.
KH 4-5
GH 9
Prior to the re-scape I had been dosing ich-x to treat one oto, when I did the rescape it was the last day and I did not add anymore since.

Images:
1: Fish tank before rescape: https://i.imgur.com/EQ2pmXg.jpg
2: Fish tank after rescape: https://imgur.com/Yc6Lg3V
3: weird white stuff 1 day after rescape: https://imgur.com/qkFmCiQ
4: Dead shrimp: https://imgur.com/tv73UIg
senyk is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 8 (permalink) Old 11-26-2019, 07:07 PM
snails are your friend
 
Blue Ridge Reef's Avatar
 
PTrader: (12/100%)
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Asheville, NC
Posts: 1,631
First, I'm very sorry this happened to your beautiful collection. Shrimp are so sensitive to outside toxins that it's very difficult to guess after the fact what might have caused a wipe out. My guess would be the Ich-x. It's supposed to be a safer form of malachite green and "shrimp safe" but malachite green lowers oxygen levels in the aquarium and just a little too much can have adverse effects. Really, I'm wary of any medications when shrimp are in the tank, but particularly so with meds for parasites. Alternately, it could be poisoning from your hands/etc. from the rescape. Water changes and anything that could increase gas exchange would seem the route to go for now. For what its worth when I've lost blue shrimp, they seem to frequently take on orange coloration postmortem so not sure that's a clue one way or the other.
Discusluv likes this.

Nothing good happens fast in an ecosystem.
Blue Ridge Reef is offline  
post #3 of 8 (permalink) Old 11-26-2019, 07:51 PM
Obsessed? Maybe
 
somewhatshocked's Avatar
 
PTrader: (492/100%)
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Middle America
Posts: 14,542
Likely occurring because of a combination of issues.

When you removed a ton of plant mass, you removed a ton of waste-using/processing. That could have caused an ammonia spike strong enough to harm shrimp but not strong enough to harm fish. May have been so small that you couldn't detect it with your test kit. (Are you using a liquid test kit?) Or it's possible it didn't last long enough for you to detect it.

Ich-X is definitely of concern. That alone is enough to harm your shrimp.

Dosing an entire bottle of Safe Start is... not a good idea, generally, with sensitive shrimp. That likely reduced the immediate oxygen levels in the tank, included an ammonia source and a ton of bacteria that started dying off when there wasn't a food source for them.

Stability is key with shrimp. So stop dosing things. Do small water changes. Don't put your hands in the tank - use tools when you can. Take care when removing plants - do it slowly over an extended period of time.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

somewhatshocked is offline  
 
post #4 of 8 (permalink) Old 11-26-2019, 09:16 PM Thread Starter
Algae Grower
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: East Brunswick, NJ
Posts: 5
Whats weird is i had been dosing ich x for 4 days prior and nothing really suffered. Now its like the shrimp want to jump out of the tank. Thank you for the empathy though. I'll try to get a bubbler tonight and see if i can increase oxygen in the tank


Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Ridge Reef View Post
First, I'm very sorry this happened to your beautiful collection. Shrimp are so sensitive to outside toxins that it's very difficult to guess after the fact what might have caused a wipe out. My guess would be the Ich-x. It's supposed to be a safer form of malachite green and "shrimp safe" but malachite green lowers oxygen levels in the aquarium and just a little too much can have adverse effects. Really, I'm wary of any medications when shrimp are in the tank, but particularly so with meds for parasites. Alternately, it could be poisoning from your hands/etc. from the rescape. Water changes and anything that could increase gas exchange would seem the route to go for now. For what its worth when I've lost blue shrimp, they seem to frequently take on orange coloration postmortem so not sure that's a clue one way or the other.
Bump: Im using the api liquid test kit.

with ich x i dosed it 4 days prior and it actually cured ich off the oto but it didnt seem to effect the shrimp. you could be right but idk.

Thats interesting, your probably right here because if i think about it logically the bacteria in the bottle have to survive off something and they are probably keeping ammonia in there with it. The part about their oxygen usage also makes sense. Dang it, will have to keep that in mind next time.

I appreciate your brevity and directness here, ill take your advice. Do you think 20% water changes daily would be too much for the shrimp? My tank had alot of stone in it so the kh/gh would always increase as compared to my tap water which doesnt have much. or should i just wait it out for a week then do a water change and pray the shrimp last that long? Your right about the plant removal, learning that the hard way right now


Quote:
Originally Posted by somewhatshocked View Post
Likely occurring because of a combination of issues.

When you removed a ton of plant mass, you removed a ton of waste-using/processing. That could have caused an ammonia spike strong enough to harm shrimp but not strong enough to harm fish. May have been so small that you couldn't detect it with your test kit. (Are you using a liquid test kit?) Or it's possible it didn't last long enough for you to detect it.

Ich-X is definitely of concern. That alone is enough to harm your shrimp.

Dosing an entire bottle of Safe Start is... not a good idea, generally, with sensitive shrimp. That likely reduced the immediate oxygen levels in the tank, included an ammonia source and a ton of bacteria that started dying off when there wasn't a food source for them.

Stability is key with shrimp. So stop dosing things. Do small water changes. Don't put your hands in the tank - use tools when you can. Take care when removing plants - do it slowly over an extended period of time.
senyk is offline  
post #5 of 8 (permalink) Old 11-26-2019, 11:43 PM
Obsessed? Maybe
 
somewhatshocked's Avatar
 
PTrader: (492/100%)
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Middle America
Posts: 14,542
I try to be as direct as possible here because so many members don't speak English as their mother tongue. So hopefully it doesn't come across as too snotty!

Your kH and gH are good for Neo shrimp. So if they remain stable and don't increase too much, I'd leave the rock.

As far as Ich-X goes... I think it likely impacts shrimp because it builds up over a period of time. Rather, they're exposed to it over a period of time. Ich treatments are known to kill most dwarf shrimp in the hobby, so it unfortunately didn't help on the shrimp front. But many of us have used it in small doses - sometimes directly on food - to treat issues with shrimp. Sometimes it helps them. But only sometimes.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

somewhatshocked is offline  
post #6 of 8 (permalink) Old 12-02-2019, 06:23 PM Thread Starter
Algae Grower
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: East Brunswick, NJ
Posts: 5
Hi Everyone,

Making this update for everyone who helped by commenting and for anyone who may come across this post in the future with a similar issue. The issue resolved it self after 2 days, thanks to the help of fellow commentors above and aswell as passionate redditors in this hobby, the believed cause was due to a hydrogen sulfide buildup that was released frin the substrate upon uprooting the plants and removing the tree. If you come across the same issue, do water changes if you can and add a bubbler to try to get as much oxygen and surface gas exchange a possible. Hydrogen sulfide diffuses into the air and the goal is to get it out as fast as possible.

MTS snails ( they mix the substrate ) or regular deep-substrate cleanings can avoid this problem. If you need to remove things from deep substrate try to do minimal amounts of removal at a time.

Thanks everyone for this help and hope this post helps someone else one day!
senyk is offline  
post #7 of 8 (permalink) Old 12-04-2019, 02:03 AM
Wannabe Guru
 
Raith's Avatar
 
PTrader: (33/100%)
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Edison, New Jersey
Posts: 1,467
This has happened to my amanos before as well, gas pockets can be dangerous. Was your otocinclus hurt? They're fragile (at least to me) to water parameter changes.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
20 Gallon jungle tank
2.8 Gallon Fluval Spec
2.5 Gallon DHG shrimp tank
2 Gallon Sparkling Gourami underworld

RAOK CLUB #0
Raith is offline  
post #8 of 8 (permalink) Old 12-04-2019, 08:41 PM
Wannabe Guru
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: 67212
Posts: 1,399
Quote:
Originally Posted by senyk View Post
Hi Everyone,

Making this update for everyone who helped by commenting and for anyone who may come across this post in the future with a similar issue. The issue resolved it self after 2 days, thanks to the help of fellow commentors above and aswell as passionate redditors in this hobby, the believed cause was due to a hydrogen sulfide buildup that was released frin the substrate upon uprooting the plants and removing the tree. If you come across the same issue, do water changes if you can and add a bubbler to try to get as much oxygen and surface gas exchange a possible. Hydrogen sulfide diffuses into the air and the goal is to get it out as fast as possible.

MTS snails ( they mix the substrate ) or regular deep-substrate cleanings can avoid this problem. If you need to remove things from deep substrate try to do minimal amounts of removal at a time.

Thanks everyone for this help and hope this post helps someone else one day!
Simply pointing some of the water circulation at the substrate would have prevented this whole disaster. The substrate will actually clean itself and avoid anoxic pockets if you had simply set up a mild current flushing down side wall pushing micro-currents of oxygenated water into substrate.
DaveKS is online now  
Reply

Tags
None

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the The Planted Tank Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome