I'm interested in keeping invertabrates... but can I? - The Planted Tank Forum
 8Likes
  • 1 Post By brianp603
  • 3 Post By DaveKS
  • 1 Post By Zoidburg
  • 1 Post By Saurapod
  • 1 Post By Zoidburg
  • 1 Post By Saurapod
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 12 (permalink) Old 09-12-2019, 02:03 AM Thread Starter
Algae Grower
 
Saurapod's Avatar
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: South Texas
Posts: 11
Question I'm interested in keeping invertabrates... but can I?

I don't really want any fish, but I'm open to suggestions if there's something that would love my parameters...
I did want a betta once upon a time, but I don't think I can properly care for one (because of the water)...
I've been wanting shrimps (especially cherry) for a couple of years now.
Disclaimer: I'm a poor college student so I can't really afford to do anything too expensive to support my interests.

At the moment, I have a 20-gallon high aquarium.
It has a 40-gal sponge filter, this substrate, and a chunk and a half of Mopani wood.
I've kept 3 nerite snails in it for about a year now along with 6 marimo moss balls, 4 of which are still super bright green.
I had an Anubias sp. but I moved it into a terrarium. I had some other stem plant's but they all died after a while.

I've added some plants above the water. Pothos, dracaena, and a sweet potato. Just so the roots will grow into the water (it's only been a few weeks now).
I have some duckweed, amazon frogbit, and a few moneywort floating about as well.
I want to add ground covering plants but I still have to research them a bit.
I was warned that too many plants would not do well without an appropriate amount of bioload, so things might change.

Now, the water here is very hard, but it's stable.
For a quick estimate, I used some swabs I had handy (I know they're not a favorite).
I tested 2 weeks ago and again a few days ago, the results were similar:

nitrite: 0
nitrate: 0-20 (not quite 0 but not nearly dark enough for 20)
"Total Hardness": 300 (maxed out) (is this the same as 18+ GH?)
"Total Alkalinity": 300 (maxed out)
pH: 8.5 (maxed out)
Water temp: 70°F +/-2 degrees (I don't have a heater, I'm open to getting one)

(I have a water test kit, and I can get more accurate readings if you think it'll help).

I had some questions regarding this though,
  • Is this at all salvageable for any freshwater shrimp (or other inverts)?
  • Should I resign myself to keeping only snails?
  • Would a faucet filter/water softener attachment thing lower pH?
  • Also, what is alkalinity?
I am a complete novice when it comes to water parameters, but
Thanks for any help!
Saurapod is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 12 (permalink) Old 09-12-2019, 05:54 AM
Algae Grower
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 41
Not sure what 300 means on the test strips. If the Kh and gh are very high. As well as the ph, I dont think youd be able to keep neos or caradina shrimp in that water. If you know someone that has a test kit, I'd have them test your water with something else to compare. Can get the liquid api gh/kh tests on amazon around $10 too.
Otherwise you may be best getting ro water if you really want shrimp
Saurapod likes this.
brianp603 is offline  
post #3 of 12 (permalink) Old 09-12-2019, 06:59 AM
Planted Tank Guru
 
Zoidburg's Avatar
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Nevada
Posts: 2,794
You live in Texas.... nuff said! Basically, it's liquid rock....

Now, that doesn't mean you can't keep shrimp.... just that, you may have some difficulties... if you can find someone local raising them in the same water, you may be able to get away with keeping shrimp without any major difficulties.

1 °GH = 17.86 ppm

300 / 17.86 = ~16.8

Your water could very well be 20+ GH...


You don't need a heater to keep *most* shrimp species.

If you ever struggle with Neos, you could always look into keeping amanos or false amanos... they aren't colorful but they can be entertaining!

A filter/softener might lower pH.... but depending on unit, it could also raise pH...

"Total alkalinity" - this is referring to the KH, or carbonates and bicaronates in the water... which help to control/stabilize the pH. Lower KH doesn't necessarily mean lower pH, since there are a variety of things that can contribute to pH values.



If you are willing and "cheap", then you could buy RO water/distilled from a store (20-50 cents a gallon) and cut your water with that.... or rather, remineralize the RO/distilled with your tap.

Since tap water can fluctuate and you don't know what all is in it, if you are capable of going straight RO/distilled (either buying it by the gallon or getting a unit to install at home - would recommend BRS since you have liquid rock... potentially looking at spending $100-$250 for a good unit...), then just get some shrimp GH/KH minerals and remineralize the water.

You would of course also need a liquid GH/KH test kit and a TDS meter (with calibration solution) would also be recommended.
Zoidburg is offline  
 
post #4 of 12 (permalink) Old 09-12-2019, 07:59 AM
Wannabe Guru
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: 67212
Posts: 1,594
Or you could just get fish that likes your water conditions.

Knight Goby, a pair in 20gal. Add about .5tsp/gal aquarium salt to your hard water and they’ll be very happy. Usually about $7-8 each. Easy to keep, easy to feed, they eat anything and a real eye catcher under your floating plants when light hits fins and glow pearly blue/white. Who wouldn’t like a fish with polka dots. Easy to sex also.



https://www.seriouslyfish.com/specie...us-sadanundio/

Last edited by DaveKS; 09-15-2019 at 03:08 AM. Reason: Typo
DaveKS is offline  
post #5 of 12 (permalink) Old 09-12-2019, 09:48 AM
Algae Grower
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Bengaluru, India
Posts: 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by brianp603 View Post
Not sure what 300 means on the test strips. If the Kh and gh are very high. As well as the ph, I dont think youd be able to keep neos or caradina shrimp in that water. If you know someone that has a test kit, I'd have them test your water with something else to compare. Can get the liquid api gh/kh tests on amazon around $10 too.
Otherwise you may be best getting ro water if you really want shrimp
Hardness of 300, are you measuring the TDS? You should be able to keep Neocardinias in this TDS.
sudhirr is online now  
post #6 of 12 (permalink) Old 09-12-2019, 08:35 PM
Planted Tank Guru
 
Zoidburg's Avatar
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Nevada
Posts: 2,794
Quote:
Originally Posted by sudhirr View Post
Hardness of 300, are you measuring the TDS? You should be able to keep Neocardinias in this TDS.
300 ppm.... which equals under 17 on the German Hardness Scale.... aka GH/Kh

Which means that water could be over 17 GH/KH....
Zoidburg is offline  
post #7 of 12 (permalink) Old 09-13-2019, 02:00 AM Thread Starter
Algae Grower
 
Saurapod's Avatar
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: South Texas
Posts: 11
Thanks for the advice guys!
I have a liquid test kit, but it doesn't test GH or KH. I'll look into finding something for that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoidburg View Post
You live in Texas.... nuff said! Basically, it's liquid rock....

Now, that doesn't mean you can't keep shrimp.... just that, you may have some difficulties... if you can find someone local raising them in the same water, you may be able to get away with keeping shrimp without any major difficulties.
................
If you are willing and "cheap", then you could buy RO water/distilled from a store (20-50 cents a gallon) and cut your water with that.... or rather, remineralize the RO/distilled with your tap.

Since tap water can fluctuate and you don't know what all is in it, if you are capable of going straight RO/distilled (either buying it by the gallon or getting a unit to install at home - would recommend BRS since you have liquid rock... potentially looking at spending $100-$250 for a good unit...), then just get some shrimp GH/KH minerals and remineralize the water.

You would of course also need a liquid GH/KH test kit and a TDS meter (with calibration solution) would also be recommended.
Thanks, I will keep this in mind!
And yeah, the water just keeps getting harder and harder the further north I go, but it's also tasting better, so there's that.


Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveKS View Post
Or you could just get fish that likes your water conditions.

Knight Goby, a pair in 20gal. Add about .5tsp aquarium salt to your hard water and they’ll be very happy. Usually about $7-8 each. Easy to keep, easy to feed, they eat anything and a real eye catcher under your floating plants when light hits fins and glow pearly blue/white. Who wouldn’t like a fish with polka dots. Easy to sex also.



https://www.seriouslyfish.com/specie...us-sadanundio/
They look pretty nice!
Saurapod is offline  
post #8 of 12 (permalink) Old 09-13-2019, 09:33 PM Thread Starter
Algae Grower
 
Saurapod's Avatar
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: South Texas
Posts: 11
A little update:
I got ahold of a GH/KH liquid test kit.
I'd like to rely on the tap for water changes. I don't think I can invest in a RO system just yet.


My tank water was:
GH: 16
KH: 13
pH: 8.1

My tap water (after conditioning) was:
GH: 19
KH: 15
pH: 7.4


The water is a bit amber from tannins. Would that explain the difference in GH/KH?
I think the substrate is raising the pH in the tank.
Saurapod is offline  
post #9 of 12 (permalink) Old 09-14-2019, 05:26 AM
Planted Tank Guru
 
Zoidburg's Avatar
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Nevada
Posts: 2,794
The pH in tank could be higher because there's less CO2 in the water. If you want to test it out, then get some tap water and let it sit overnight. If you can aerate it, even better! Test the pH again the next morning and/or in 24 hours. That will give you a better pH reading.

Sounds like something in the tank might be lowering your GH and KH values just a tad.
aquanerd13 likes this.
Zoidburg is offline  
post #10 of 12 (permalink) Old 09-15-2019, 06:42 PM Thread Starter
Algae Grower
 
Saurapod's Avatar
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: South Texas
Posts: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoidburg View Post
The pH in tank could be higher because there's less CO2 in the water. If you want to test it out, then get some tap water and let it sit overnight. If you can aerate it, even better! Test the pH again the next morning and/or in 24 hours. That will give you a better pH reading.

Sounds like something in the tank might be lowering your GH and KH values just a tad.
Thanks Zoidberg,

I let an airstone run through a gallon of tap water for 24 hours (I hope this is what you mean by aerating it!)
the pH looks to be about 8.1-8.2.


Do you think white cloud minnows could be happy in this?
Zoidburg likes this.
Saurapod is offline  
post #11 of 12 (permalink) Old 09-15-2019, 07:58 PM
Planted Tank Guru
 
Zoidburg's Avatar
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Nevada
Posts: 2,794
I know far more about shrimp keeping than I do fish keeping... and I don't know a whole lot about shrimp keeping.... so I couldn't say! LOL

But I would trust this source...

Tanichthys albonubes ? White Cloud Mountain Minnow (Aphyocypris pooni) ? Seriously Fish


Based on that, it sounds like the answer is 'yes'?
Saurapod likes this.
Zoidburg is offline  
post #12 of 12 (permalink) Old 09-16-2019, 12:52 AM Thread Starter
Algae Grower
 
Saurapod's Avatar
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: South Texas
Posts: 11
Thanks again lol.
Looks like it could work.

I appreciate all your help with this!
Zoidburg likes this.
Saurapod is offline  
Reply

Tags
hard water, high ph

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the The Planted Tank Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome