Light or Nutrient Deficient? - The Planted Tank Forum
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 11 (permalink) Old 12-15-2014, 04:29 AM Thread Starter
Wannabe Guru
 
tylergvolk's Avatar
 
PTrader: (14/100%)
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Saint Paul
Posts: 1,730
Light or Nutrient Deficient?

Very simply, what's the difference between light deficiency and nutrient deficiency?

I've got a heavily planted 125g with x4 36" Finnex planted+ fixtures on it. Sometimes I think that the light doesn't penetrate far enought to get the growth I'd like, but most of the time the growth is perfect for my lifestyle.

My plants grow nice and slow but sometimes older leaves die off. My R. Roundifilo exhibites this. Anything I can do to maintain lush growth in aged leafs?
tylergvolk is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 11 (permalink) Old 12-15-2014, 08:29 AM
Planted Tank Guru
 
roadmaster's Avatar
 
PTrader: (1/100%)
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Missouri united states
Posts: 5,576
Quote:
Originally Posted by tylergvolk View Post
Very simply, what's the difference between light deficiency and nutrient deficiency?

I've got a heavily planted 125g with x4 36" Finnex planted+ fixtures on it. Sometimes I think that the light doesn't penetrate far enought to get the growth I'd like, but most of the time the growth is perfect for my lifestyle.

My plants grow nice and slow but sometimes older leaves die off. My R. Roundifilo exhibites this. Anything I can do to maintain lush growth in aged leafs?

If you are using EI dosing,the nutrient deficiencies are rare.
Even rarer in my view,are those suffering from light deficiency.
Older leaves are often discarded by plant's in my tanks to make way for new growth /leaves.
roadmaster is offline  
post #3 of 11 (permalink) Old 12-15-2014, 09:15 AM
Plant Whisperer
 
Zapins's Avatar
 
PTrader: (28/100%)
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Norton, VA
Posts: 2,544
If you are having problems with your plants then post as many close up photos of the issues as you can along with fertilizer and any water test kit results as you have and we can likely help you fix the issue.

The differences can be subtle but when the light deficiency has progressed far enough the lower leaves are completely lost and fall off the plant leaving only the upper leaves. Also, the distance between nodes along the stems of stem plants will increase. Plants become "leggy" looking. It is common to find a large amount of decaying leaf matter on the floor of the aquarium with insufficient light.

There are many more nutrient deficiencies to worry about and the symptoms can vary drastically. Some symptoms show up only in new growth (pale new leaves), other symptoms show up first in old leaves then travel towards the new leaves and finally involve them as well. Probably the most similar nutrient deficiency to light deficiency is a lack of nitrogen. Old leaves will deteriorate from the tips and edges of the leaves back towards the stem. They will remain attached to the plant as it sucks out the nutrients from it. Eventually new growth will grow smaller and smaller causing the distance between nodes/leaf pairs to get smaller.

From: http://deficiencyfinder.com/
Light Deficiency in rotala rotundifolia:


Nitrate deficiency in rotala macrandra 'green':


Zapins
Zapins is offline  
 
post #4 of 11 (permalink) Old 12-15-2014, 10:25 AM
Planted Tank Guru
 
roadmaster's Avatar
 
PTrader: (1/100%)
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Missouri united states
Posts: 5,576
To be honest,,if the tank in question is the 125 gal in OP's signature,then I doubt light deficiency. And judging from the nutrient's you are adding according to info presented with tank info in signature,I also doubt nutrient deficiency.
Judging from photos of this tank,,I see nothing that would cause me concern.
Sometimes old leaves just die off.
roadmaster is offline  
post #5 of 11 (permalink) Old 12-15-2014, 10:33 AM
Wannabe Guru
 
Xiaozhuang's Avatar
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: South east asia
Posts: 1,247
Plants are affected by more variables than just light and nutrients... Other variables such as Temperature, KH, CO2, flow, substrate quality, pruning methods, planting density matter also.

Regards, Dennis
47g Journal of sorts
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Xiaozhuang is offline  
post #6 of 11 (permalink) Old 12-15-2014, 11:40 AM
Wannabe Guru
 
Django's Avatar
 
PTrader: (1/100%)
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: MA
Posts: 1,090
This is tylergvolk's 125g. (the same one I think, but taken at an earlier time). The lighting is ok. I hesitate to say but there can be too much light, or just that it's something else.


MY TANK: Planted 10g; 2 x 10W CFL; Fluval U2 internal filter; MGOCPM/black sand cap

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
started April 18, 2012
Django is offline  
post #7 of 11 (permalink) Old 12-15-2014, 02:57 PM
Plant Whisperer
 
Zapins's Avatar
 
PTrader: (28/100%)
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Norton, VA
Posts: 2,544
Close up recent pictures of the plants are needed to tell what is wrong. But by the looks of it that tank has enough light.

Zapins
Zapins is offline  
post #8 of 11 (permalink) Old 12-16-2014, 12:12 AM Thread Starter
Wannabe Guru
 
tylergvolk's Avatar
 
PTrader: (14/100%)
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Saint Paul
Posts: 1,730
Thank you everyone.

Maybe im just criticizing my tank to much. I see all these nice lush tanks and strive to achieve that look. Before, I had pinholes on rotala and tiger lotus awhile back which indicates potassium deficiency and I added more so4 to my dosing regime. After this, things started doing better. Also, I think my pruning maintinence needs work but I'm on top of it! =)

In addition to my question, I made a mistake this last Sunday. Did a major trim and forgot I had the co2 cranked up to compensate for my plant growth. A few fish died before I caught the problem. Is this a common mistake by hobbists? Should I bee scaling back my ei and co2 after large trims?

Another questions comes to mind. I dose ei. No3 is always in the safe high range but it seems I need more so4 possibly po4. I wonder how much is too much of so4 and po4. Anyone wanna weight in?
tylergvolk is offline  
post #9 of 11 (permalink) Old 12-16-2014, 12:25 AM
Planted Tank Guru
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Contra Costa CA
Posts: 11,721
The general guide that I have seen suggests the NO3:PO4 ratio of about 10:1 is pretty good. If you do not have a PO4 test, then just dose per EI ratios.

If you are having too-high NO3 (heavily stocked tank, lots of fish food) and need to reduce the KNO3 dosing, then reduce the KH2PO4, also. Fish food has both N and P.

If you are dosing the full level of EI, there is supposed to be enough K from KNO3. (The tiny amount from KH2PO4 is so small it almost does not count). But if you have seen pin holes and are dosing a bit of K2SO4 or other potassium source that is just fine.

Next... If you need to reduce the KNO3 and KH2PO4, then I use K2SO4 to replace the KNO3, at the same rate. I think the dose is not exactly the same, to make the potassium come out the same, but is close enough to target, then monitor the plants to fine tune it.
The current recipe I am using is about 50% of the EI rate for KNO3, and the same amount of K2SO4.
Diana is offline  
post #10 of 11 (permalink) Old 12-16-2014, 03:40 AM Thread Starter
Wannabe Guru
 
tylergvolk's Avatar
 
PTrader: (14/100%)
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Saint Paul
Posts: 1,730
I started with this dose regime:

Kno3 1tsp x3/wk
Po4 1/2tsp x3/wk
So4 1/2tsp x3/wk
CMS+B 1/2tsp x3/wk

In the past, added more so4 after signs of deficiency. Kno3 seemed kinda high but okay.

Now, I'm looking at https://www.plantedtank.net/forums/sh...ad.php?t=21944 and I'm wondering if my dosing regime could be better.

To reiterate what you were suggesting Diana. You cut your kno3 in half and replace that with and increase in so4.

So if I implimented this in the dosing regime I suggested above, it would look like this:

Kno3 1/2tsp x3/wk
Po4 1/2tsp x3/wk
So4 1tsp x3/wk
CMS+B 1/2tsp x3/wk

I'm have high stock and tank shows signs of low O2 and also gas is present.
tylergvolk is offline  
post #11 of 11 (permalink) Old 12-16-2014, 11:08 PM Thread Starter
Wannabe Guru
 
tylergvolk's Avatar
 
PTrader: (14/100%)
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Saint Paul
Posts: 1,730
Kno3 was high today, lost few more fish. Did partial water change. Sigh...
tylergvolk is offline  
Reply

Tags
None

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the The Planted Tank Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome