Fert Doseing. Make it simple for me please. - The Planted Tank Forum
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 18 (permalink) Old 09-14-2008, 01:03 AM Thread Starter
Guest
 
PTrader: (8/100%)
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,150
Fert Doseing. Make it simple for me please.

Ok i have a 55g tank. Right now it is VERY low Light less than 1 WPG (1-54 watt T5 10,000k bulb over the tank) The tank has a VERY heavy fish load(trust me i do mean VERY HEAVY) No CO2.

i have the following Ferts.

K2SO4

H2KPO4

CSM+B(does anyone know exactly whats in this?)

I would like to dose them dry to the tank, but i need an exact amount and how often i should Dose them.

For example should i dose 1/2 teaspoon daily, every other day, once per week? make it simple for me.

Trust and believe my fish provide all the nitrates i need(tank runs about 30 PPM Nitrates without dosing)

This is the Current fish load in the tank, this will change once the fry are big enough to sell.

About 15 adult mollys, about 40 molly fry prolly 20 guppys between fry and adults, a Pitcus Catfish, a skunk Botia, a HUGH placo(about 8 inches), a betta, 6 cory cats,and 3 neons. Their are also various snails, MTS,Ramshorn and Pond Snails. At least till the Skunk Botia gets hungry lol.
vance71975 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 18 (permalink) Old 09-14-2008, 04:06 AM
Guest
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 152
To make use of added ferts, I think you're going to have to add light and possibly CO2, though with that fish load you might have a fair amount of CO2 in the water just from respiration.

As far as ferts go, I think what you are looking for is Tom Barr's EI method... And with that insane fish load you're going to need the water changes.

Have you thought about putting together a grow-out tank for your fry? That can't be a good situation for all those fish crammed together in a 55...
wschalle is offline  
post #3 of 18 (permalink) Old 09-14-2008, 04:53 AM Thread Starter
Guest
 
PTrader: (8/100%)
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,150
Quote:
Originally Posted by wschalle View Post
To make use of added ferts, I think you're going to have to add light and possibly CO2, though with that fish load you might have a fair amount of CO2 in the water just from respiration.

As far as ferts go, I think what you are looking for is Tom Barr's EI method... And with that insane fish load you're going to need the water changes.

Have you thought about putting together a grow-out tank for your fry? That can't be a good situation for all those fish crammed together in a 55...
The fry only stay in the tank until they are big enough to trade in at the pet store for a store credit.With the amount of fry my mollys produce i would need another 55g just for a fry tank! which isn't cost effective for me at this point.As far as the fish go they are happy lil guys and gals.

Normal Fish load(without fry explosion) is much more inline with the tank. 15 molly's, 6 guppy's,6 cory cats,1 Pictus Cat, 1 Skunk Botia, 1 Placo,1 betta and 3 neons.

Where can i find Tom Barr's EI method? i used search cant seem to find it?
vance71975 is offline  
 
post #4 of 18 (permalink) Old 09-14-2008, 06:17 AM
Guest
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 39
help him out guys, I need the info too
ivgonmad is offline  
post #5 of 18 (permalink) Old 09-14-2008, 12:33 PM
Wannabe Guru
 
Overfloater's Avatar
 
PTrader: (87/100%)
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Columbus, OH
Posts: 1,985
You have plenty of fish and low light. Most likely, adding fertilizers will not be necessary.

Regards,
Robert

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

48G Rimless Mr Aqua
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

37G Oceanic "Cube"
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Overfloater is offline  
post #6 of 18 (permalink) Old 09-14-2008, 03:27 PM
Wannabe Guru
 
ColeMan's Avatar
 
PTrader: (14/100%)
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Tulsa, OK
Posts: 1,739
I would say that not only is dosing not necessary, but is actually poses some potential for problems with your particular situation.
ColeMan is offline  
post #7 of 18 (permalink) Old 09-14-2008, 05:07 PM
Guest
 
PTrader: (1/100%)
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 329
You may very well not need any dosing, like others have said. It depends on how many plants are in there also, besides fish so that you can tell the load.

Now here is a good page with info:
http://www.barrreport.com/articles/4...light=low+tech


Personally 1 time every 2-3 weeks I would add this:
1/8 teaspoon K2SO4
1/16 teaspoon CSM+B

You need to test your nitrates, if they are low then you will need to dose KNO3. This is a good measure of how your plants are growing compared to fishload. If its stays between 10-20ppm or rises then you dont need to dose N or P IMO since it will come from fish food.
SpeedEuphoria is offline  
post #8 of 18 (permalink) Old 09-15-2008, 12:15 AM Thread Starter
Guest
 
PTrader: (8/100%)
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,150
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpeedEuphoria View Post
You may very well not need any dosing, like others have said. It depends on how many plants are in there also, besides fish so that you can tell the load.

Now here is a good page with info:
http://www.barrreport.com/articles/4...light=low+tech


Personally 1 time every 2-3 weeks I would add this:
1/8 teaspoon K2SO4
1/16 teaspoon CSM+B

You need to test your nitrates, if they are low then you will need to dose KNO3. This is a good measure of how your plants are growing compared to fishload. If its stays between 10-20ppm or rises then you dont need to dose N or P IMO since it will come from fish food.
Nitrates stay around 30ppm all the time, so looks like all i need to dose is CSM+B. but the plants are struggling to say the least. Some are yellowing,and browning. Maybe since the other bulb burnt out the tank is just plain too low light.
vance71975 is offline  
post #9 of 18 (permalink) Old 09-15-2008, 02:05 AM
Algae Grower
 
White Worm's Avatar
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Washougal Wa
Posts: 91
http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/f...ing-guide.html


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
White Worm is offline  
post #10 of 18 (permalink) Old 09-15-2008, 02:11 AM
Algae Grower
 
White Worm's Avatar
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Washougal Wa
Posts: 91
http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/f...fertilator.php
You are going to need better light and pressurized Co2 eventually.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
White Worm is offline  
post #11 of 18 (permalink) Old 09-15-2008, 02:12 AM
Planted Tank Obsessed
 
Kolkri's Avatar
 
PTrader: (2/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 342
I would try to at least get up to 1.5 watts per gallon. Might help your plants. Or if the tank is near a window give it some window light.

My planted tank. 55 gallon fluorite substrate over soil, 64 watts of light, excel twice a week. Weekly water changes. Angelfish pair, guppies, BN plecos and otos. Redone 11/13/2012
One non planted tanks. 75 gallon.
Kolkri is offline  
post #12 of 18 (permalink) Old 09-15-2008, 03:10 AM
Wannabe Guru
 
Overfloater's Avatar
 
PTrader: (87/100%)
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Columbus, OH
Posts: 1,985
You need light to grow plants. Nutrients are not an issue in this case. I recommend not dosing anything at this point.

Regards,
Robert

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

48G Rimless Mr Aqua
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

37G Oceanic "Cube"
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Overfloater is offline  
post #13 of 18 (permalink) Old 09-15-2008, 04:13 AM Thread Starter
Guest
 
PTrader: (8/100%)
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,150
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolkri View Post
I would try to at least get up to 1.5 watts per gallon. Might help your plants. Or if the tank is near a window give it some window light.
Ya i just dont have the money to by a new bulb right now. wish i did.
vance71975 is offline  
post #14 of 18 (permalink) Old 09-16-2008, 12:18 AM
Guest
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 152
Bottom line: Plants need light. Don't waste ferts when the plants won't even be able to make use of them.
wschalle is offline  
post #15 of 18 (permalink) Old 09-16-2008, 03:17 PM
Planted Tank Guru
 
plantbrain's Avatar
 
PTrader: (267/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: The swamp
Posts: 13,609
I do not think the tank is able to run non CO2 methods.
Too many fish.

The "trick" with a good well run non CO2 tank is balancing the fish load to less than the plant demand or slightly less etc, then you can over feed or dose a tiny amount here and there.

You might not even "need" to do that, with good reason, need is rather subjective and the amount of nutrient stress at low light and under Non CO2 growth rates is very small, so issues will occur very slowly and perhaps not much at all, CO2 is more limiting generally.

As far as the fish load, you are not willing to remove the fish, then you need to one of two things here.

Add a bit more light, a pair of T5's would do great.
Add CO2 or go with dosing Excel,CO2 gas tanks will do FAR better over time for you and cost less. you can do the Excel in the meantime till you buy the lights and the CO2 gas tank.

Get the gas BEFORE you get the lights, other wise you will have lots of algae.

Now you can do water changes all the time and can use something like EI dosing etc. The dosing is simple then and you can tweak to suit.

In non CO2 methods, one of the main tenants is NOT doing water changes to maintain CO2 stability, plants are well adapted to low CO2, adding it weekly etc will cause the plants up and down regulate their CO2 uptake mechanisms slowing growth whereas algae will just bloom as CO2 acts a good signal to induce spores to germinate.

So you have to balance the fish waste and plant demand with this method. This is a balanced tank.

You are not going to have any balance with overloaded tanks, the only practical way there is to do water changes/dosing etc.
That's about the only way to keep it stable with high fish loading.

Why not be kind to the fish and give them a proper home and not over load the tank?

That's the real solution.... one that reduces the errors we make and prevents fish from dying due to our neglect and not remembering to care for the tank every now and then, like everyone of us at some point does.

So fix that, then you have far more choices of the method you wish to do and also a lot less work and cost involved.

Put this way, you could have 2 tanks and go non CO2 vs the one tank that's CO2/weekly water changes etc based on cost. This way you could keep the fish and have more planted tanks and less work.

Regards,
Tom Barr




Regards,
Tom Barr
plantbrain is offline  
Reply

Tags
None

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the The Planted Tank Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome