Waaay too much filtration / flow? Eheim 2080 with 55gal planted? - The Planted Tank Forum
 
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post #1 of 11 (permalink) Old 08-08-2014, 01:43 PM Thread Starter
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Question Waaay too much filtration / flow? Eheim 2080 with 55gal planted?

So I moved again and had to start over. Again! I purchased the 55gal AGA tank and wood stand used (in great shape), ordered a bunch of parts online, and also found a great deal on an Enheim Pro 3 canister filter. The seller (Craigslist) didn't mention the particular part number or size, and for the price ($100) I assumed it was the much smaller model.

Of course I bought it right away when I found out that he was selling the BIG Eheim 2080 for that price. It's only a year old and the only parts it is missing are the 'install kit' (whatever that is), the spray bar, and some tubing.

This thing is massive, and having read a few posts on here and other boards, I'm afraid that it's overkill. The plan for the tank is just a very basic planted 55gal with few fish. Will the flow and overfiltering actually remove some of the good stuff from the water? I know you can reduce the flow with a switch on the unit.

That said, should I try to just sell this monster and go out and get a little http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0002AQXTA/ref=s9_wish_co_d3_g199_i5?ie=UTF8&colid=12EEI9KSZWGWQ&coliid=I1ZFLKEYLP36HU&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=typ-top-left-1&pf_rd_r=06ZX4NZRA40Q7Y27XP94&pf_rd_t=3201&pf_rd_p=1827489602&pf_rd_i=typ01 for my simple setup? Undecided. You guys always have great advice here, so that's why I'm asking. Thanks in advance. I cannot wait to get the tank set up again!
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post #2 of 11 (permalink) Old 08-08-2014, 02:04 PM
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In my opinion, there is no such thing as too much filtration. When you ask about removing good stuff, to what are you referring?
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post #3 of 11 (permalink) Old 08-08-2014, 02:13 PM Thread Starter
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I guess I'm not sure - it was in uniformed comment about getting rid of the good stuff. I also don't want to stir up too much of the substrate or stress fish out too much. The whole thing just feels like overkill for a 55gal and setting myself up for some random set of unknown future problems with this tank. If it really is just fine I'll just throw it together and start using it!
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post #4 of 11 (permalink) Old 08-08-2014, 02:26 PM
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Fish and plants are just fine with water moving as much as 10 times the tank volume per hour, so a 55 gallon tank with something in the neighborhood of 550 gph is not a problem.

More surface movement can allow CO2 to off gas, but only if you are adding it. If you are not adding CO2, then surface movement generally replaces the CO2 as the plants use it.

The filter media itself does not remove fertilizers. Even activated carbon does not, with one minor exception. AC can remove chelated iron, but only for the first few days when the carbon is fresh. After that the iron remains available to the plants. While many people with planted tanks do not bother with carbon, some do keep it in the filter, where is does not hurt things.

Excess water movement can tear up the leaves. Plants directly in the flow of the filter will not do so well, but there are exceptions. The Bolbitis fern thrives in such a location.
A spray bar can be modified so the blast of water is not quite so strong. You can drill more holes, or enlarge the existing holes, or alter it in other ways to make a gentler flow while still using that much flow overall. Or, as you note, turn down the overall flow with the controls on the filter.

Remember, also that the flow will change as the filter fills with debris.
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post #5 of 11 (permalink) Old 08-08-2014, 02:28 PM
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If you can adjust the flow, I wouldn't be too worried about it. If you can't get the flow low enough, a trick we use in saltwater is putting a ball valve on the return line. I know removing detritus from the water will not be a problem. Canisters are generally frowned upon for saltwater use because they are nitrate factories. I'd go for it.
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post #6 of 11 (permalink) Old 08-08-2014, 08:23 PM
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You may need to do some price checking on the "install kit and tubing" before deciding. Some of the parts are really much more expensive when bought as stand alone items.

If it is the inlet and outlet plastic portions, they can be in the $35 range for each.
http://www.bigalspets.com/installati...ison+Shopping&
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post #7 of 11 (permalink) Old 08-15-2014, 08:29 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks for all the feedback. I've decided that I am not going to bother with the 2280 and just go out and buy an Eheim Classic 2217 for the 55gal.

This behemoth Pro 3 looks great but the eventual $$ outlay for parts and the sheer size of the filter (it won't fit in my stand!) make it just too much of a chore for me right now.

That said, anyone want a huge Pro 3 at a good price?! :-)

Can't wait to get the new tank set up, running, and planted soon-ish. The lights just arrived yesterday.
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post #8 of 11 (permalink) Old 08-15-2014, 08:52 PM
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The more flow and filtration the better. I have a fluval 306 canister and two HOB aqueon quiet flow 50s on my 55G and I would add more if I had the room.

I have seen some of the guru's with 20x filtration and they report no issues with their plants or fish.

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post #9 of 11 (permalink) Old 08-15-2014, 11:18 PM
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I put an ehiem pro 3 1200xl on my 55g tank (it has a 13.5" poop monster I mean leopard sailfin pleco) granted the canister hooked up to an aquaponic nft system (basically garden in a pvc pipe that tank water pushes through and instead of soil plant get nutrients from the water going over their roots) and dumps out straight down into he tank, so great aeration but I'm not taking full advantage of flow potential this way.
What "good stuff from the water" are you talking about? do you mean added ferts for plants or the fish's food?
I'd not be worried about flow unless you are keeping fish in the tank that need a gentler flow (gourami species for example) or if you keep anything small that can get sucked in through the slits of the intake (put a cut piece of sponge over it if you do). Unless the outflow is pummeling the substrate (in which case adjust it) I'd not worry about it having any effect on plants.

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post #10 of 11 (permalink) Old 08-16-2014, 12:41 AM
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There are always ways to reduce too much flow, but to get more you have to get more equipment.

I am using a ~500gal/hr filter on a 36gal tank. Why? because it is a bit overstocked, I had it that filter already, and I am looking for long maintenance intervals.

To reduce the flow, I am using a vertical spray bar, directed towards the back corner. That gives the most even flow I can imagine, the entire tank water is slowly moving. Once plants grow a bit more, I am going to rotate the various pieces that the spray bar is made out of, to direct some additional flow to overgrown low flow areas.

Anyhoo, seems like you already made up your mind. The only disadvantages I could see is the added wattage for the larger pump. Some of that is transferred to the water as heat, which reduces the need for a heater, but I will have to watch the temps in Summer.


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post #11 of 11 (permalink) Old 08-16-2014, 10:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by studda View Post
In my opinion, there is no such thing as too much filtration. When you ask about removing good stuff, to what are you referring?
Agreed. Don't confuse too much filtration with too much flow. I remember awhile back when I replaced my my 2 AC300's with 2 Eheim 2213's on my 55 and someone called me out and said it was overkill. I laughed it off. Two smaller units in opposite corners can be better than one. I am not saying that you need to replace your unit, but don't worry about over filtering. If your concerned about the filter taking away goodies, you can always swap your media to more mechanical media. But your plant load has to be able to handle the compensation.

Now if you have too much flow, then scaling back as mentioned is your answer. Also, if you don't want to modify your original equipment, you can do a diy spray bar and use bigger holes to exhaust more pressure pushing out the holes. Bigger holes will slow the flow instead of making jet sprays.

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