Flourish Excel question??? - The Planted Tank Forum
 
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post #1 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-15-2014, 04:06 AM Thread Starter
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Flourish Excel question???

Just curious. If I'm not mistaken, Excel is essentially a liquid CO2 substitute. Correct me if I'm wrong, please. Is it a waste of time and money to use it in conjunction with pressurized CO2?
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post #2 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-15-2014, 08:18 AM
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If you are injecting gaseous CO2, then there is really no need for Excel.

However, some people like to use it when spot treating problematic algae.

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post #3 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-15-2014, 09:03 AM
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Sea Chm makes no claims of it being an algacide...but it actually is one which breaks down into carbon in a short while in your tank.
According to them...the plant(s) are also capable of converting this form of carbon into other chemicals which the plant can use and supposedly it does this according to need.
People who use it instead of injected CO2(or DIY) report that it reduces the amount of algae in their tanks. I am one of those people. It works fair on GSA. I have (according to the thread on PAR by Hoppy and going by a T5 chart on there by brand of fixture)
a PAR level of light in my 10g tank of 100 PAR @ 12" from the sub.
It takes about three weeks for me to need to scrape the front glass off. Without the Excel, it takes about three to four days to need to srape it.
But if you are only using it for a carbon source...the injected is all you need.

The shortest distance between any two points is a straight line...in the opposite direction...
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post #4 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-15-2014, 12:59 PM
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CO2 gas is much more easily taken up by the plant's than the Excel.
Seems the Excel must first be absorbed through the leave's and then through process unknown to me within the plant,is converted to usable CO2.
Even injecting CO2 is a crude way of supplying plant's with CO2 for it being a gas, want's to leave the tank nearly as fast as it is injected.
Is why those that inject CO2 use fairly strong flow from filter's and powerhead's to try and disperse it throughout the tank so that all plant's are bathed in it before it escapes to the surface.They point their spraybar's from filter's and powerhead's downward's to help keep the gas from rising up and out too quickly, and good flow to distribute it to all area's.
Growth is said to be 10X faster with the gas than NON CO2 tank's and frequent trimming is needed to keep plant's from getting out of hand and more importantly from growing so well perhap's that growth block's the flow of CO2 across all area's of the tank.
These folk's are alway's tweaking,adjusting,flow,CO2 distribution.
Some folk's run their CO2 injected tank's right on the edge of gassing their fish to achieve desired growth.
CO2 injection also result's in plant's needing consistent Fertilizing routine for best result's.
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post #5 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-15-2014, 06:21 PM Thread Starter
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So, in a nutshell, you guys are saying if CO2, then no Excel needed. Fair enough. My next question. On my 90g tank, how many bubbles per second should I aim for. I'm using an inline reactor and seeing almost no micro bubbles.


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post #6 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-15-2014, 06:36 PM
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Hi Roadmaster, let me guess that you don't use pressurized CO2 as your narrative makes it sound very cumbersome. Once set up my system basically runs itself and all I do is check the tank pressure once in a while and glance at the drop checker daily.

I'm like Raymond in that after using Excel to combat BBA I've just kept using it to keep BBA away. If it helps give my plants a little extra CO2 then that is a bonus.
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post #7 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-15-2014, 07:43 PM
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Only use the bubbles per second to calibrate yourself. To determine your max CO2, slowly turn up the CO2 until you see negative signs from your fish, and then turn it down slightly. Now look at your bubble count, and that is where you want to be in the future.

By slowly, I mean a very slight (1/16-1/8 turn) adjustment in increased bps, and wait an hour or so. If no negative signs, adjust it up slightly more, and so on.

Your bps will depend on your flow, type of filtration, surface agitation, CO2 dilution, working pressure, and likely much more. Its not a reliable way to compare between tanks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by yobofofas View Post
So, in a nutshell, you guys are saying if CO2, then no Excel needed. Fair enough. My next question. On my 90g tank, how many bubbles per second should I aim for. I'm using an inline reactor and seeing almost no micro bubbles.
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post #8 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-16-2014, 08:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve002 View Post
Hi Roadmaster, let me guess that you don't use pressurized CO2 as your narrative makes it sound very cumbersome. Once set up my system basically runs itself and all I do is check the tank pressure once in a while and glance at the drop checker daily.

I'm like Raymond in that after using Excel to combat BBA I've just kept using it to keep BBA away. If it helps give my plants a little extra CO2 then that is a bonus.

Hi right back at cha.
No I do not yet use the gas, but have been researching and reading and speaking to those who do use it on another forum that is light year's ahead of the info on other planted forum's I also visit.
I do believe there is steep learning curve until such time as one can get the CO2 dialed in then,,thing's get easier.
I personally have no need at this time for CO2 enhancement to achieve the result's I desire, but am contemplating the gas at some point in the future.
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post #9 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-16-2014, 12:55 PM
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Reading car repair manuals and talking to mechanics does not necessary mean that I can explain to others how to repair cars. Given my knowledge of the cars, I would most likely get even the basics wrong. Even among mechanics, there are good ones, bad ones, and clueless. And some are so many light years ahead of the others that they can only fix spacecraft, if they could only find some.

Excel does not get converted to co2 by plants. Co2 and Excel are just some of the sources of carbon, the building block of all known life. All life needs carbon to grow. Extracting carbon from some sources requires less resources then from others.

During carbon cycle, plants use light energy and water to photosynthesize co2 into carbohydrates, o2 being the byproduct.

Concentration of co2 in atmosphere (air) is about 400 ppm. Under 5 ppm in water. Gas exchange.

Some basic concepts to look up.

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post #10 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-16-2014, 01:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OVT View Post
Reading car repair manuals and talking to mechanics does not necessary mean that I can explain to others how to repair cars. Given my knowledge of the cars, I would most likely get even the basics wrong. Even among mechanics, there are good ones, bad ones, and clueless. And some are so many light years ahead of the others that they can only fix spacecraft, if they could only find some.

Excel does not get converted to co2 by plants. Co2 and Excel are just some of the sources of carbon, the building block of all known life. All life needs carbon to grow. Extracting carbon from some sources requires less resources then from others.

During carbon cycle, plants use light energy and water to photosynthesize co2 into carbohydrates, o2 being the byproduct.

Concentration of co2 in atmosphere (air) is about 400 ppm. Under 5 ppm in water. Gas exchange.

Some basic concepts to look up.

v3
Yes,you are right .Excel,glut are taken up by plant's and carbon is rendered .
My mistake
.Will take my chances speaking to those Who have experience rather than following the masses.
Will try harder to explain in proper context in the future.
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