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post #1 of 16 (permalink) Old 01-31-2008, 12:40 AM Thread Starter
 
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What's missing?

I hope this is in the right spot, I took some pics of my plants to see if anyone might know whats missing in my ferts or what not, not alot of healthy growth, always problems with BBA, leaves turning yellow etc etc.....

90 Gallon
setup for about 9 months
co2 tank setup
coralife power compacts 260watt on for 9-10 hours per day
Rena XP3 x2
PH = 6.8
Ammonia =0
Nitrate=5.0
Nitrite=0


adding flourish x2 week
1/4Tsp-KN03 3x a week
1/4Tsp-KH2P04 3x aweek
1/4 tsp-K2S04 3x a week
1 Tsp-MgS04 3x week
50% water change a week

(I think that was how it was I threw the bags themselves out but I know 3 were 1/4 tsp and one was 1 tsp) I also just started adding calcium bicarb about 1/2 tbsp every week @ waterchange for the past few weeks....

I just went and bought these so I plan to start this:
+/- 1 1/2 tsp KN03 3x a week
+/- tsp KH2P04 3x a week
+/- tsp K2S04 3x a week
+/- tsp (30ml) Trace 3x a week
50% weekly water change

And they also sold me calcium nitrate, which I dont know how much or often to add.

Any ideas? I would love any help!! Here are the pics:






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post #2 of 16 (permalink) Old 01-31-2008, 03:20 AM
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Some of those pictures of the Java fern are plantlets, you can just pick those off, that not algae or anything bad, in fact that means they are somewhat healthy.

You have some serious GSA on some of those leaves.

the symptoms are along the lines of a potassium deficiency here, but it also looks like your nitrates are quite low which may cause the same chlorosis.

You could try some root tabs under the plants to see if they recover, but the older leaves are probably goners.

just my opinion.


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post #3 of 16 (permalink) Old 01-31-2008, 05:07 AM
 
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I thought GSA was often phosphate deficiency.
But I think you were deficient across the board. I think your new dosing regime should probably solve those problems. But you mention little about CO2... with that good amount of lighting and those ferts you need to have good CO2.
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post #4 of 16 (permalink) Old 01-31-2008, 07:23 AM Thread Starter
 
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What is the best way to measure how much co2 I've got in the tank? with the bubble counter we have its very hard to see the bubbles, and I heard that is not the best way to measure it?

Im starting the new dosing regimen tonight, so hopefully all will go well!
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post #5 of 16 (permalink) Old 01-31-2008, 07:29 AM
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the best is a drop checker, by using a 4dk standard solution mixed with ph regeant. you'll be able to reference your co2 levels via colour, green = good, yellow = bad and maybe dead fishies, blue = too little.

other than that:
the cup of water technique i prefer


courtesy of WfxXx's Dosing post in the water parameter section

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post #6 of 16 (permalink) Old 01-31-2008, 12:14 PM
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to expand on outcasts post, you can measure your pH and kH and use the chart also.

Crazy Loaches, I would normally agree with you here, but I have to tell you, recently, I have been adding a greater amount of PO4 and have still been getting GSA. If I recall correctly, I was somewhere around 3 ppm. So, that can't be the only cause...but I am sure its a culprit.

Yea, he probably is a bit low... but by looking at the growth on some of the swords, i would lean toward K and N, but again, I may be wrong accross the board on this.


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post #7 of 16 (permalink) Old 01-31-2008, 04:56 PM Thread Starter
 
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Thanks everyone - I do have the KH kit at home so I will test that way as soon as I get home! And where do I get the 4dk solution from?
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post #8 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-01-2008, 03:37 AM
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Well, you can make the 4dKH solution yourself if you feel like it, it is only a touch of baking soda in distilled/RODI water. There are a good number of guides on just how to do the dilutions.
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post #9 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-02-2008, 05:53 AM Thread Starter
 
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Seems I have an EXTREMELY high level of c02
I just reduced it and will monitor over the next few days, I am assuming I should gradually decrease? Weird thing is my fish seem to be doing really well.

But if I tested correctly (Im going to re-test right now)
PH = 6.6
KH = 11 it went green & 12 drops it went yellow which = 90.42ppm
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post #10 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-02-2008, 06:03 AM
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Which test kit did you use? The most commonly available API kit does yellow to green for GH, and KH is blue to yellow. I ask because it sort of seems like you may have tested for GH instead depending on the test kit used.
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post #11 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-02-2008, 04:59 PM Thread Starter
 
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It was API, and It went blue first, then said to keep adding one drop at a time until it turns yellow, counting the drops.....
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post #12 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-02-2008, 05:20 PM
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Okay, just making sure because you said it went green... then yellow.

Test your tap water by leaving it sit out in a bowl overnight, then do the KH & pH tests, if the chart shows you have anything but 3 or so ppm, then you have buffering issues that invalidate the chart for you. That's why we use drop checkers, they avoid that pitfall.
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post #13 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-02-2008, 06:58 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bristol View Post
Seems I have an EXTREMELY high level of c02
I just reduced it and will monitor over the next few days, I am assuming I should gradually decrease? Weird thing is my fish seem to be doing really well.

But if I tested correctly (Im going to re-test right now)
PH = 6.6
KH = 11 it went green & 12 drops it went yellow which = 90.42ppm
Ok, this is a bit confusing. Above we were talking about a drop checker and that you could make your own KH reference solution of 4dKH. Now your talking about your CO2 being sky high because your pH is 6.6 and KH11. This implies your testing your tank water but applying the pH/KH chart to it to determine your CO2 which you cannot do. The chart only works for pure water with only carbonates/bicarbonates in it, which is why we use baking soda and distilled water. Your tank can have all sorts of other stuff effecting pH. For example my pH lowered a few tenths when I placed driftwood in it (tannic acid). This would make you think the CO2 increased but of course putting driftwood in a tank wont create CO2... even when I add my daily ferts now to my 240g I get a .2 drop usually within a few minutes which appears mostly from the potassium phosphate. So get some 4dKH fluid or make some from distilled water and baking soda, and then read the pH of the fluid inside the drop checker. If your fish seem fine than chances are the CO2 isnt severely high.
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post #14 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-02-2008, 07:08 PM
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Do you actually have BBA or were you talking about the fuzzy roots on the java fern?

If your KH was really that high, I would imagine you have an extremely high pH when CO2 is off. Do you remember the average pH of your tank before you started adding CO2? A drop checker is the easiest solution, no guessing.


On the PO4 and GSA: I was steadily keeping over 2ppm PO4 but couldn't kick the GSA until I bumped NO3 up from 5 to 10ppm. Could have just been timing but that's one major change that happened when it disappeared, I also set PO4 back down near 1ppm. Also, some of the ugliest plant deficiencies I've personally seen was whenever my NO3 would drop down a bit from the 5ppm I used to keep it at, that and faltering CO2.


Also measure your GH, I wonder what that's like since you were constantly dosing Mg but no Ca. I personally don't dose any of that with ferts, at every water change I add a fixed amount of sodium bicarb and Tom Barr's GH booster (Ca & Mg) to the change water for my desired KH and GH (3/5). That's when I use RO/DI, I don't add any of that to my tap because the parameters are already 3/5.


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Last edited by jaidexl; 02-02-2008 at 11:33 PM.
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post #15 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-02-2008, 10:08 PM Thread Starter
 
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Crazy loached, I was usiong the co2 test that outkast posted above, then I went to the Link through the water paramaters thread to
.http://www.csd.net/~cgadd/aqua/art_plant_co2chart.htm
... I do have a drop checker but have never used it as it never came with instructions to make the KH Solution, but I think I will now make some and try that route.

Jaidexl, I dont remember my PH before adding co2 unfortunetly it's been quite a few months now.....But I do have BBA its all over a few other plants as well as on some driftwood I have in there....
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