Heavy fish load, heavy feeding verses EI. - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #1 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-09-2006, 07:04 PM Thread Starter
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Heavy fish load, heavy feeding verses EI.

This might make for an interesting discussion...

I have a 75G pressurized c02 tank with almost 3 wpg. The occupants include the following...

6 Wild Scalare.... 3.5-4"
11 congo tetras.. 2.5-3"
6 clown loaches...2.5"
16 black neons
4 ottos
2 sae's

I feed 3-4 times a day. Frozen blood worms, tetra color bits, flakes, an Omega one veggie rounds. (the clowns love these) It is a regular feeding frenzy when the food gets thrown in.

I change the water twice a week most of the time. About the only thing I need to dose with this regime is k2so4 an traces.

These are the tank specs now without dosing

N03 is arond 20 ppm
P04 is around 5 ppm
PH..............6.2
KH..............4 deg
Gh..............3 deg

I could probably do a lil better with the house keeping, but so far no real issues with the tank doing this. I have a lil bba on a few plants, but that was because of my photo period when I first set up the tank (12 hours) I went a couple a weeks an let the nitrate run out! I have since cut back the photo period to 9 hours, an things are looking better.

Anyone else basically skipping EI, an letting the fish an food feed the plants?

Anyone feeding heavy to a heavy fish load an still dosing EI?
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post #2 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-09-2006, 07:22 PM
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Mark, it sounds like you are right on it, though that is a tad high on the phosphates. IMO, don't dose unless you need to. I never had to dose macros until recently, with this new auto water change setup. I've always dosed lightly on traces due to high fish load. Now, my nitrates have become pretty low and so I'm starting to dose KNO3. But besides K and traces, that's about it for me. That said, I'm fighting and starting to win a bout with thread. But this ADA Aqua Soil is a whole new ball game. It definately has its challenges and I kind of miss my old easy to use Flourite substrate. I may go back to Flourite eventually.

It sounds like you are kind of doing the other method - PPS, sort of like Jason Baliban.





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post #3 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-09-2006, 07:57 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Betowess View Post
Mark, it sounds like you are right on it, though that is a tad high on the phosphates. IMO, don't dose unless you need to. I never had to dose macros until recently, with this new auto water change setup. I've always dosed lightly on traces due to high fish load. Now, my nitrates have become pretty low and so I'm starting to dose KNO3. But besides K and traces, that's about it for me. That said, I'm fighting and starting to win a bout with thread. But this ADA Aqua Soil is a whole new ball game. It definately has its challenges and I kind of miss my old easy to use Flourite substrate. I may go back to Flourite eventually.

It sounds like you are kind of doing the other method - PPS, sort of like Jason Baliban.
Hey Bob...

I hear ya about the aquasoil...I imagine with the nutients in it, it is definately a learnin curve. I am just usin soilmaster, so there isnt much there for nutrients.

I check the nitrates all the time just ta see if I am on the right track with out dosing. So far it is stayin pretty high. I am really dissapointed with the tek light though. The plants just dont seem to grao as fast. I will probably switch to 4x55 AHS here soon an build a canopy.

The phosphates are high I know. I dont keep house like I should. I very much need to clean the filter!! I havent it done it in some time now. With the feeding regime, I know it need it!

JB has it goin on! I dont know if I am doin the same as he is, but I have cut the lighting back for sure..He is probably doin the EI regime for sure. He doesnt have the fish load, an probably isn't feeding as heavy. Hope my tank looks half as good as his does!!
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post #4 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-09-2006, 08:12 PM
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I have 1500 fish in a 350 gallon tank, do EI, they fed 2x a day heavy.
Worms, flake, brine, veg tabs.

No issues.
Been that way, excellent fish health, growth, vitality, same with the plants.

Will EI hurt in conjuction with a large fish load? No.
Will it help? Perhaps, perhaps not.

At lower light intensities, there is a continious decline in the need for inorganic nutrient sources.

So a 2w/gal system can rely more of fish waste as the sole source than can the same with 5 w/gal.

It gets down one basic tenent: rate.

Are the plant's demand for nutrients supplied adequately(this part is debatble as to what is adequate also, it varies widely person to person) by the fish waste or not?

At some point you go beyond the ca[pacity of the system to break down NH4 into plant biomass/bacteria transformation and algae spore germination.

You also place a much greater strain on the O2 levels in a tank vs the inorganic NO3 source as well as inorganic nutrients in general.

Less O2 and more NH4 are not things that are better for the fish nor the system, although it might be simpler for aquarist in some respects.

So many aquarist balance the demands of the plants with some from the fish and top off the rest with ferts.

Fish waste and the PO4/NO3 readings have some issues, you may measure organic forms, or total PO4/total NO3, not bioavailable forms, inorganic forms are all the most bioavailable in general, and the GH (non specific, you might be low on Mg or Ca, but not both).

What is really at issues within your question is are higher leevls of these nutrients from inorganic source determinal to fish, oplants and do they encourage algae?

The answer appears to be no.
I've not found any evidence nor observation to suggest otherwise.

Many aquarist enjoy talking that it does.
But when you do the controls and test and make sure the CO2 is in good shape etc, then add these nutrients with a high bioload of critters, we do not find this to be true.

I do find algae if you progressively add more and more critters to a well run planted tank and the only to mitigate the issue is with more water changes or Zeolite additions.

That points to NH4 waste break down problems combined with high light.
The algae is not nearly as intense when this is done at low light.

I think the real arguement that many are enamoured with is that you do not need to add as much KNO3, KH2PO4 to such tanks with high bioloading.

That by itself is true. Plants will grow fine at 20ppm of NO3 as the will at 30-40ppm.

You can likely do it without any test kits also by watching your plants good.
Or simply do frequent water changes.

In the past, common tanks had 1.5-2w/gal of NO T12 lighting, there was less need for KNO3 etc, most of the ferts came from fish waste.

About 10 years ago folks thought that more light = better.
Boy were they wrong.

It means faster growth, thus more CO2/nutrient supply and a greater dependence on inorganic nutrients.

This is also true with argiculture, you cannot get nearly the same production from organic production and simply picking berries from the wild ecological reserves as you can from a farm.

Our tank/hobby is much more like argicultural fields than natural ecological aquatic systems.

So it gets back to growth rate and how best to supply the plants for a given light intensity.

I'm not sure why so many folks claim excesses are bad when they have not done the test to see if what they say is really true or not.
With fish/shrimp/critters/even bacteria, progressively adding more and more to supply more and more nutrients as you add more and more light .......I'd say that is a bad idea, but a logical one to most new folks.

Adding inorganic forms on the other hand allows much more safety and a wider margin, less influences on O2, and less danger from NH4 sources, the trade off is adding them.

Given that minor trade off, it seems that for the plants, the inorganic sources are better and more controllable than fish waste.

But I like fish too

So I do both.

I like fish and plants so I provide the best place for both.
Not "one or the other" type thinking.
Same with ferts and most things.




Regards,
Tom Barr

Last edited by plantbrain; 04-03-2007 at 03:57 AM.
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post #5 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-09-2006, 08:22 PM
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I am really dissapointed with the tek light though. The plants just dont seem to grao as fast. I will probably switch to 4x55 AHS here soon an build a canopy.
Wow, that's surprising. I would think a 4x54 watt would do you fine on a 75G. Maybe lower it 3-5 inches? Fast growth ain't always a great thing as you know. Have you tried mixing the GE6500 with say Current 10000K equal amounts. I like that combo.

BTW, pretty sure Jason is doing a modified PPS, not EI.





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post #6 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-09-2006, 08:36 PM
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Most in depth response ever! Im still lost on so many aspects of planted tanks. At first I thought that if I got a light, good substrate, and added ferts I'd be fine. I guess that would be like me putting a hair dryer attached to the intake manifold of my car and expect to beat vettes.

There are so many places where I get lost when it comes to planted tanks, mainly because when you break down the categories you end up with tons of subcategories. Say you need good lighting, substrate, water, etc well then you end up breaking lighting down into wattage, lumens, color temperature, mix of different temperature bulbs, penetration through the water, photo period and Im sure Im missing a few things too!

Im rather new to the actual "serious" side of keeping plants but, I know that like anything else in life it takes time and dedication to get good at it. I think I've already learned so much just from being a member here for the past few weeks.

Edit: Since you mentioned something about lowering the light I just wanted to throw this question in there. I raised my light up about 2'' so that I could open the glass tops with more ease but it seems like the plants aren't doing as well now. Could a 2'' lift of the light really affect growth that much? Im going to estimate that the light is about 6-7'' from the top of the tank and it's only a 2x40 on a 55G eek, I know I know I really need to upgrade. Im going to try that DIY ODNO thing this weekend with two new fixtures.

Another Edit: haha Im sorry for hijacking but, I also wanted to ask real quick if glass tops make a big difference in light penetration even if they're clean, the condensation on the glass blocks light Im sure.


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post #7 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-09-2006, 08:48 PM
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Edit: Since you mentioned something about lowering the light I just wanted to throw this question in there. I raised my light up about 2'' so that I could open the glass tops with more ease but it seems like the plants aren't doing as well now. Could a 2'' lift of the light really affect growth that much? Im going to estimate that the light is about 6-7'' from the top of the tank and it's only a 2x40 on a 55G eek, I know I know I really need to upgrade. Im going to try that DIY ODNO thing this weekend with two new fixtures.

Another Edit: haha Im sorry for hijacking but, I also wanted to ask real quick if glass tops make a big difference in light penetration even if they're clean, the condensation on the glass blocks light Im sure.

Well, you definately want more light, minimum of 2WPG. I think glass tops pull 10-15%, but thats a wild guess. Many of us go open top, except those with suicidal jumpers. And yes, raising it up will decrease a bit, but you are really low in the first place, as you have mentioned.





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post #8 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-09-2006, 09:06 PM
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I dont dose any of my tanks, and I have little/no algea in 55g and some algea on sides of tank for 10g. 55g I dont dose because I want it to be ready for CRS and they dont like ferts... and 10g I'm just too lazy lol. Lots of people feed their plants lots of diffrent ways. Just find one that works and stick with it!


Quote:
Originally Posted by Betowess View Post
Well, you definately want more light, minimum of 2WPG. I think glass tops pull 10-15%, but thats a wild guess. Many of us go open top, except those with suicidal jumpers. And yes, raising it up will decrease a bit, but you are really low in the first place, as you have mentioned.
I don't think it bothers much light at all, I keep acrylic tops on my 55g to cut down on evaperation so my room doesnt smell like a pond lol...... (parrents dont like that at all..) but that has 3 strip lights so it probably has a bit much light >,< the 10g has a single strip and when I clean the glass I always notice a big diffrence, for a few days or a week. then it gets durty again....

- Fish newb
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post #9 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-09-2006, 09:09 PM
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Thanks for the replies and sorry again for hijacking. I just figured that glass tops would kind of reflect some light and then dissipate the light that made it to the tank. Maybe I should just go topless for a week and see if I notice a difference.

haha I said topless.


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post #10 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-09-2006, 11:21 PM Thread Starter
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Tom...Thanx for the reply!

I think that you having a 350G tank with 1500 fish an dosing EI, an everything in check is amazing! But this is what you do! You know what to do if everything is way higher than the norm...A 350G tank is a lil more forgiving than the 55, or 75G.

When I started the 75G up, I had a moderate fish load, not very heavy at all. I was dosing EI religiously. The lighting all though was close to 3wpg, could have been better utilized if I was to place the tek closer to the water. Things were fine. I introduced 6 clown loaches. Still things were doing fine. I didn't really feed much, cause when I did, it was just wasted. The clowns were not eating at the time, just hiding. The only fish eating were the congo tetras, an the black neons. They were bein fed flakes a couple times a day. Things were great.

A few weeks later I purchased 6 Wild Scalare's. The feeding had not changed, I was feeding flakes a couple times a day. Again, the only fish that were eating were the congo's an the black neons.

A week later, I bought several different foods. Frozen BW, Color bits, veggie wafers, an started feeding. I can tell ya it was a feeding frenzy! I would break off a lil 1/2x1/2 chunk of FBW, an within seconds it was gone. The next gay was an 1"x1" chunk within 20 seconds it was all gone. All the fish in the tank were eating like pigs, whatever wasn't eatin immediately was inhaled by the clowns.

This eating frenzy was awsome to see, since I knew all the fish in my tank were doin great. I did this for a couple of weeks with no problems at all. Fish wise, or plant wise. I was dosing EI this whole time.

A week later I found BBA....I decided to test the parameters. This is what I found.

N03.....60 ppm
N03.....10 ppm or greater.

I immediately did a 60% wc, an brought the Nitrates down to 30 ppm, an brought the phosphates down to 5 ppm an stopped dosing EI.

I have not dosed N or P since then. (bout 3 weeks now) I have done 50% wc every week, an the N stays around 20, an the P stays around 5. BBA has slowed, and everything looks pretty good. The fish however are very fat an happy.

Now if I were to continue dosing EI...My N an P would be off the chart! Whether it be a good thing or a bad thing, a new member might not want to go thru this c02, lighting, feeding, fish load, EI dosing regime.

Tom... everyone knows you can address any situation that arises. Thats what makes your input so valuable. Put the new guys shoes on for a sec...

Might wanna just make it as easy as we can on them. Thats why I brought this up to begin with. If ya have alot of fish, an ya feed em alot...If you dont know what your doing, EI dosing on top of overfeeding might cause algae issues.
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post #11 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-09-2006, 11:34 PM Thread Starter
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Wow, that's surprising. I would think a 4x54 watt would do you fine on a 75G. Maybe lower it 3-5 inches? Fast growth ain't always a great thing as you know. Have you tried mixing the GE6500 with say Current 10000K equal amounts. I like that combo.

BTW, pretty sure Jason is doing a modified PPS, not EI.
Bob...I didnt have an option at the time I bought it. I had a choice of 10,0000k or actinic at the time of purchase...I do have the tek a lil high. I might lower it an inch or so an see what happens.

I agree with the fast growth thing!! I just hate when the BBA just starts growin with it. I didnt have this problem before with the AH Supply lights on the 55G...The plants just grew so quick algae never had a chance...

Although I have a tek...Aqua Medic might not have been the best choice for the 75G. It really only covers half the tank from front to back IMO. If I got the 4x55 AHS, It would cover the whole tank...I just know it would be night an day difference.

Matter a fact, I will take some pics of the tanks progress in the next few weeks, after I lower it down an inch or so. I will then put the 4x55 AHS in a canopy. Take pics for a few weeks, an let u be the judge. I am so confident that the difference will be night an day, I would put $50 up....

Then again, I havent lowered the tek yet...
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post #12 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-09-2006, 11:42 PM Thread Starter
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Edit: Since you mentioned something about lowering the light I just wanted to throw this question in there. I raised my light up about 2'' so that I could open the glass tops with more ease but it seems like the plants aren't doing as well now. Could a 2'' lift of the light really affect growth that much? Im going to estimate that the light is about 6-7'' from the top of the tank and it's only a 2x40 on a 55G eek, I know I know I really need to upgrade. I'm going to try that DIY ODNO thing this weekend with two new fixtures.

Another Edit: haha Im sorry for hijacking but, I also wanted to ask real quick if glass tops make a big difference in light penetration even if they're clean, the condensation on the glass blocks light Im sure.
As Bob mentioned. The higher you raise the light the less light yer gonna get in the tank. Tek stands are usually 3.5"-4". If you hang them, you should really try an achieve the same. I have mine a lil high at the moment, about 4.5", an will lower them to 3".

A glass top will reflect a lil light. I really cant say how much though. I have an open tank, no top
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post #13 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-10-2006, 01:53 AM
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No, I do not hide secrets from anyone and merely because I have experinece, does not imply I'm worth anything either
It's basic EI, lots of fish and great growth.

The tank is easy to maintain and 2 hours per week are all that have been spent on it. No special things, no secret snake oils, no testing needed, just good CO2, good dosing , good feeding etc.

A larger tank is actually less forgiving IME.


When folks have "issues" .....with EI, imagined or real... it's due to CO2, when the nutrients are no longer limiting in any way, the uptake of CO2 is dramatically increased.

This effect is not nearly as pronounced at lower light ranges, say 2 w/gal.

Folks think correlation = causation.

So when they add more NO3, PO4, K, traces etc and this causes the plant to spend more energy fixing carbon instead of chasing after a limiting nutrient, then the CO2 demand goes up.

When they adjust the nutrients to a richer than past level, often they do not adjust and scale the CO2 up appropiately as well.

I know this because when folks do have issues, I solve them.
I go to their homes or help them on line and every time it's the same old hat.
Every time.

Everytime I try to cause an issues with EI dosing, I never see the effects as claimed.

Everytime.

I can induce most of the issues folks supposely have with EI by altering the CO2.

Folks that have issues with PPS, they carry on and on about nutrients and gloss over the CO2.

Each one of the folks that had issues with PPS did not have some much nutrient issues, they all have CO2 issues.

I'm not sure why folks do not do routine weekly water changes.
If there is one piece of advice to give any FW fish keeper: do weekly 50% water changes.

PPS, for all carrying on Ed claims, is about reducing water changes, otherwise it becomes like the old version of testing and adding as things are removed, that's not new, something Ed never seemed to want to acknowledge.
New package, supposedly "new" but actually very old.
Many folks add nutrients and use test kits to monitor additions.
That method is very old.

It works, we did this in the bay area 8 years before Ed even posted.
But it's easier and more consistent to do a water change and it reduces the testing and calibration altogether, and makes the ranges of nutrients more stable. You can do PPS with weekly 50% water changes and not test, but now that's EI

EI is new because it argues that test kits are not needed to maintain good stable nutrient levels.

That ability allows me to focus on other things light intensity of lighting, CO2 effects and non CO2 effects, without spending so much time worrying about testing and adding each of some 10 or so nutrients.

Adding a non limiting nutrient solution and changign every few days/once a week like this is nothing new either, it's actually standard procudure for having a non limiting control in plant growth studies.



Your tank has high NO3/PO4 due to fish waste and lack of water changes, no amount of PPS is goign to solve that, you need to do water changes, no way around it.

If you add lots of food, that will add lots of NH4/PO4.

The issue with adding EI on top this will not have any effect.
Some might claim otherwise but having done it for well over a decade in many situations, many tap water types, it's rubbish.
They generally blame their on lack of mainteance or changes in the CO2 on EI, rather than assuming that the nutrient demands are being met, then looking at the other issues that are more likely to playing a much more significant role.

This is just something some hobbyists, not all, simply refuse to get and understand.

They have been engrained with this idea that excess NO3/PO4 are "bad" and should be kept low. I'm not saying it's good, but I am saying it does not matter till it starts to kill shrimp and fish which is very high levels.

First these folks whined and complained that it would lead to algae.
Next it was fish health.

In both cases(plants and fish/critters) and for PO4/K/NO3/Traces(TMG, Flourish at least) none of this has been shown and I've explored some rather high ranges, 2x what you measured assuming what you measured is even correct, I do not think you calibrated the test kit correct?

Your BBA slowed because the plants uptake of CO2 also slowed due to the nutrients being limiting. Have you calibrated the test kit and known reference and are sure about it?

I've never been able to once induce BBA in any isolated system with NO3, fish waste, NH4, PO4.

Neither have other folks.

I have, as well as others, been able to induce BBA with variations in the CO2.

Now as far as being new and not knowing what you are doing.
This is easy, the nutrient part that is.

Why folks want to make it complicated? I suppose hold overs from the past(I'm going to hunt you all down) and fear.

They should be focusing in on CO2, not arguing with me about my knowledge or ability, I already know what I am doing and tested all of this many years ago.

There is variation, but it's based on the CO2, not the nutrients.

Adding NH4, adding less CO2, these can cause algae, not NO3/not K, not excess Fe, not PO4.........

We tried to limit BBA years ago, we used calibrated Lamotte test kits.
Steve tried 6 months of zero PO4 ppm.
The BBA grew just fine.

I tried low NO3, less than 5 pmnm for 3 months, the BBA grew fine.
I changed the system and added more CO2.
I did not even check how much I added at the time, but the BBa went away.
So I repeated it, and the BBA came back.

Unlike Steve, I had high PO4.
So I added both high NO3 and PO4 + high CO2, no algae, lots of plant growth, Steve was very jealous

I'm not holding out here, there's no secret thing I do.
What people have issues with is believing too much in what they see and that corrleation => causation, that's not true and it does not explain the test and observations we can do to prove it's just mere correlation.

I know you are frustrated, there was no web when I had issues with BBA and I had it for 2 years.

It sucked.
And that was on a good day!
The issue with BBA is much more about CO2.

You can go back and add each nutirent one at a time and see for yourself once a tank is doing well and growth is good.

Look, I was having issues just like everybody else, I never forget those days.
But that does not mean I do not understand how you or other folks feel about the algae.

I know more than enough to address any algae issue now, but you may not, still, if you stick it out and keep after it, you can modify things and prove to yourself that adding more EI ferts etc in and of themselves(not other confounding issues), does not induce algae.

I don't need to argue that point, I don't need to prove anything to you either. I already know the answer.

You need to prove it to yourself.

I can help folks go down that path and can suggest issues that will give you troubles.

In general, folks that test more have more issues than folks that watch plants more.

I was a watcher before a tester.

Regards,
Tom Barr







Quote:
Originally Posted by bastalker View Post
Tom...Thanx for the reply!

I think that you having a 350G tank with 1500 fish an dosing EI, an everything in check is amazing! But this is what you do! You know what to do if everything is way higher than the norm...A 350G tank is a lil more forgiving than the 55, or 75G.

When I started the 75G up, I had a moderate fish load, not very heavy at all. I was dosing EI religiously. The lighting all though was close to 3wpg, could have been better utilized if I was to place the tek closer to the water. Things were fine. I introduced 6 clown loaches. Still things were doing fine. I didn't really feed much, cause when I did, it was just wasted. The clowns were not eating at the time, just hiding. The only fish eating were the congo tetras, an the black neons. They were bein fed flakes a couple times a day. Things were great.

A few weeks later I purchased 6 Wild Scalare's. The feeding had not changed, I was feeding flakes a couple times a day. Again, the only fish that were eating were the congo's an the black neons.

A week later, I bought several different foods. Frozen BW, Color bits, veggie wafers, an started feeding. I can tell ya it was a feeding frenzy! I would break off a lil 1/2x1/2 chunk of FBW, an within seconds it was gone. The next gay was an 1"x1" chunk within 20 seconds it was all gone. All the fish in the tank were eating like pigs, whatever wasn't eatin immediately was inhaled by the clowns.

This eating frenzy was awsome to see, since I knew all the fish in my tank were doin great. I did this for a couple of weeks with no problems at all. Fish wise, or plant wise. I was dosing EI this whole time.

A week later I found BBA....I decided to test the parameters. This is what I found.

N03.....60 ppm
N03.....10 ppm or greater.

I immediately did a 60% wc, an brought the Nitrates down to 30 ppm, an brought the phosphates down to 5 ppm an stopped dosing EI.

I have not dosed N or P since then. (bout 3 weeks now) I have done 50% wc every week, an the N stays around 20, an the P stays around 5. BBA has slowed, and everything looks pretty good. The fish however are very fat an happy.

Now if I were to continue dosing EI...My N an P would be off the chart! Whether it be a good thing or a bad thing, a new member might not want to go thru this c02, lighting, feeding, fish load, EI dosing regime.

Tom... everyone knows you can address any situation that arises. Thats what makes your input so valuable. Put the new guys shoes on for a sec...

Might wanna just make it as easy as we can on them. Thats why I brought this up to begin with. If ya have alot of fish, an ya feed em alot...If you dont know what your doing, EI dosing on top of overfeeding might cause algae issues.



Regards,
Tom Barr
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post #14 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-10-2006, 01:57 AM
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Originally Posted by bastalker View Post
.I do have the tek a lil high. I might lower it an inch or so an see what happens.

I agree with the fast growth thing!! I just hate when the BBA just starts growin with it. I didnt have this problem before with the AH Supply lights on the 55G...The plants just grew so quick algae never had a chance...

Although I have a tek...Aqua Medic might not have been the best choice for the 75G. It really only covers half the tank from front to back IMO. If I got the 4x55 AHS, It would cover the whole tank...I just know it would be night an day difference.

Matter a fact, I will take some pics of the tanks progress in the next few weeks, after I lower it down an inch or so. I will then put the 4x55 AHS in a canopy. Take pics for a few weeks, an let u be the judge. I am so confident that the difference will be night an day, I would put $50 up....

Then again, I havent lowered the tek yet...
If you increase the lighting intensity, you increase CO2 demand and uptake.
2x 54 w of T5 lighting does very well on 75 gal tank.
Maybe 3x 54 if you are really wanting a more higher light tank.

220w of PC 55w set up is more than enough for any type of scape and set up you might want.

If folks like algae, more issues dosing, faster growth, more pruning, knock yourselves out.

If you limit anything, limit the biomass of fish and limit the light intensity, that's where it all starts.

Regards,
Tom Barr




Regards,
Tom Barr
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post #15 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-10-2006, 02:27 AM
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Just to sneak in my pitch here: Having pressurized CO2 is not the same as having adequate CO2. Unless you set the bubble rate high enough to get 30-40 ppm of CO2 in the water, with a reliable test method, you may not have enough CO2, and that will result in the BBA you are seeing.

Now, for my pitch: Try an ADA style "drop checker" for measuring the amount of CO2 in the tank, then you don't have to just guess that you have enough. You will then know how much you have, more accurately than with any other method. See: DIY Drop Checker - Aquatic Plant Central- aquascaping...a living art for some more details.

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