How to prepare ro-water ??? - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #1 of 19 (permalink) Old 11-10-2005, 10:24 PM Thread Starter
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How to prepare ro-water ???

My friend say that!!!
"
Make soft water using ro.You need to have gh and kh 0 !
And then add to this water mgso4.. Add 5ppm Mg and that give you 1 Gh.
And then add to this water k2co3..Add 15ppm K and that give you 1,5 Kh.
And then add to this water CaCo3..Add to reach additionaly 4 Gh and 3,5 Kh.


That will be 5ppm mg and 15 ppm K and aproXimetly 5 Kh and 5 Gh.

What do you think?
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post #2 of 19 (permalink) Old 11-10-2005, 11:24 PM
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You need a reverse-osmosis system to make RO water

10gal / Bleeding heart tetras, angel & silver hatchets / Filstar XP2 / 8wpg PC / 2.5lbs of Co2 / Hydor inline
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post #3 of 19 (permalink) Old 11-10-2005, 11:56 PM
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Any specific reason why you want to use pure RO water and then reconsitute it? Alot of people over here use RO water and mix it with tap water to usually lower hardness. I'm not sure how the water is in sweden.
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post #4 of 19 (permalink) Old 11-11-2005, 12:32 AM
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The numbers are wrong as I recall. There is 17.9 ppm of hardness to one degree. So 5 ppm of magnesium is not going to give you a gH of 1. And most gH test kits don't measure potassium as part of the hardness.

If you think you must use RO water I would use MgSO4 and CaCl2 for gH and baking soda for kH. All of these have the advantage of dissolving almost instantly.
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post #5 of 19 (permalink) Old 11-11-2005, 01:04 AM
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I just went through a similar exercise, and Roger Miller helped out with this:

"Only calcium and magnesium are included in GH. No potassium.

Hardness is not measured by adding the ppm of calcium and magnesium. It is measured as the equivalent amount of calcium carbonate. The equivalent amount is the weight of calcium carbonate that would contain enough calcium to equal the electrical charge on the calcium and magnesium in the water. To calculate hardness from calcium and magnesium concentrations, divide the calcium concentration by 20 and the magnesium concentration by 12, then sum those two values together. Multiply the sum by 50 to get the ppm hardness and divide the ppm hardness by 17.9 to get the degrees of hardness.

(20 is the atomic weight of calcium per ionic charge, 12 it the atomic weight of magnesium per ionic charge, 50 is the molecular weight of calcium carbonate per ionic charge and 17.9 is the conversion from ppm hardness to degrees of hardness.)"

TW
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post #6 of 19 (permalink) Old 11-11-2005, 09:27 AM Thread Starter
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Ok.
Thx for intresting.I`m from Poland not sweeden. I`m not beginner in planted tank. Here my last fotos in hard water.
http://republika.pl/andkoni/akwarium6.jpg
http://republika.pl/andkoni/akwarium4.jpg

Now i want to have soft water and have plantas like fructata or walichsi.
My friend say that I must prepare only ro water ant i will be now witch water i have.He say that is the best method.
If the numbers are incerrect maybe we help me to careate correct numbere.
And one thing!!! I dont say that K give me Gh , onlt that the co3 give me kh when I add k2co3.And additionaly i reach 15 ppm K
I need in my water hardness aprokimetley 5(gh and kg), 20 ppm of K and MG.
But i dont now how much i need Mg ???? In my hard water are a lot of mg and i add only 5 ppm to change water.But i dont now how much a need to soft water.

I now that ca to mg must be as 4to 1.
Help me in this problem.
And i cannot measure for eXample K and i will only add K to change water. 20 ppm should be correct.

I change 33% of water.
I want to make this water with 20ppm K , ?? ppm mg and hardneses 5 and to this water add 20 ppm No3 and 1,5 ppm Po4. That give me when i will be change tank water to this constant value of K , Mg and Ca.The levels of Po4 and no3 are high because if i add 1/3 water with this ranges to 2/3 with 0po4 and 0 no3 that give me 0,5 ppm of po4 and about 7 ppm of no3.If the tank water will be have the levels hogher for example 20 ppm of no3 and 1,5 ppm of po4 nothing be changed because I drain off and add this same water I have low level of fish and I not that levels of nutrients and phosphorates will be come down and therefore the ranges in fres water are so high.But this no mater besause i do this for a 2 monts and its great method but i want you help me build water wit k, mg and ca.
I dont use k2so4 because the so4 can be to high if i add mgso4 and k2so4 therefore i use mgso4 ans k2co3 and i can to buy caco3 and soda too.
What do you advice me?
I want to have ideal water.Now I have 13 Gk and ( kh and i dont now the levels of Mg and K.This piss off me SRY

ps.For what i must add cl with cacl2 ????
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post #7 of 19 (permalink) Old 11-11-2005, 09:35 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TWood
I just went through a similar exercise, and Roger Miller helped out with this:

"Only calcium and magnesium are included in GH. No potassium.

Hardness is not measured by adding the ppm of calcium and magnesium. It is measured as the equivalent amount of calcium carbonate. The equivalent amount is the weight of calcium carbonate that would contain enough calcium to equal the electrical charge on the calcium and magnesium in the water. To calculate hardness from calcium and magnesium concentrations, divide the calcium concentration by 20 and the magnesium concentration by 12, then sum those two values together. Multiply the sum by 50 to get the ppm hardness and divide the ppm hardness by 17.9 to get the degrees of hardness.

(20 is the atomic weight of calcium per ionic charge, 12 it the atomic weight of magnesium per ionic charge, 50 is the molecular weight of calcium carbonate per ionic charge and 17.9 is the conversion from ppm hardness to degrees of hardness.)"

TW
Heh i dont know some words and i cannot understand in 100% this post.
Maybe you can write this more simply.Or maybe you give me advice how to make this having K2co3,Caco3 and mgso4. THX
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post #8 of 19 (permalink) Old 11-11-2005, 11:48 AM
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post #9 of 19 (permalink) Old 11-11-2005, 12:37 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TWood
This is only a calculator !
I have my own calc in Exel and i now how much for example mgso4x7h2o I must add to reach 5 ppm of Mg. But i dont now how will be the gh when i add mgso4x7h2o to reach 5 ppm mg.
heh ...

How are the proportions of ca to mg ??? 4 to 1 ???
If yes i will be add 2g of mgso4x7h2o to reach 5 ppm mg and 2 g of caCo3 to reach 20ppm Ca. And then i check gh and if gh will be ok (4-6) it`s will be done or if the gh will be to low(2-3) I multiply this portions of mg.... and ca... 2x and will be ok and k2co3 i add 0,7g to reach 20 ppm and will be ok or not ?
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post #10 of 19 (permalink) Old 11-11-2005, 01:03 PM
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I've seen recommendations of both 4:1 and 3:1 for Ca:Mg. Let's assume 4:1 is okay and let's use 20ppm Ca and 5ppm Mg. To requote: To calculate hardness from calcium and magnesium concentrations, divide the calcium concentration by 20 and the magnesium concentration by 12, then sum those two values together. Multiply the sum by 50 to get the ppm hardness and divide the ppm hardness by 17.9 to get the degrees of hardness.

20ppm Ca divided by 20 = 1
5ppm Mg divided by 12 = 0.42
Sum = 1.42
1.42 * 50 = 71
71 divided by 17.9 = 4 degrees GH

To requote again: Hardness is not measured by adding the ppm of calcium and magnesium. It is measured as the equivalent amount of calcium carbonate. The equivalent amount is the weight of calcium carbonate that would contain enough calcium to equal the electrical charge on the calcium and magnesium in the water.

So that calculation above is to arrive at the *equivalent* of calcium carbonate to get 4 degrees of GH. (Hey, it's a dumb system but I didn't make it up.)

I use baking soda to get KH, here's a calculator for that:

http://dataguru.org/misc/aquarium/calKH.asp

TW
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post #11 of 19 (permalink) Old 11-11-2005, 01:55 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TWood
I've seen recommendations of both 4:1 and 3:1 for Ca:Mg. Let's assume 4:1 is okay and let's use 20ppm Ca and 5ppm Mg. To requote: To calculate hardness from calcium and magnesium concentrations, divide the calcium concentration by 20 and the magnesium concentration by 12, then sum those two values together. Multiply the sum by 50 to get the ppm hardness and divide the ppm hardness by 17.9 to get the degrees of hardness.

20ppm Ca divided by 20 = 1
5ppm Mg divided by 12 = 0.42
Sum = 1.42
1.42 * 50 = 71
71 divided by 17.9 = 4 degrees GH

To requote again: Hardness is not measured by adding the ppm of calcium and magnesium. It is measured as the equivalent amount of calcium carbonate. The equivalent amount is the weight of calcium carbonate that would contain enough calcium to equal the electrical charge on the calcium and magnesium in the water.

So that calculation above is to arrive at the *equivalent* of calcium carbonate to get 4 degrees of GH. (Hey, it's a dumb system but I didn't make it up.)

I use baking soda to get KH, here's a calculator for that:

http://dataguru.org/misc/aquarium/calKH.asp

TW
Oh yes.Now i see the light ))
Thx You are very useful

Ok i take 3 to 1 .
20ppm Ca divided by 20 = 1
7ppm Mg divided by 12 = 0.58
Sum = 1.58
1.58 * 50 = 79
79 divided by 17.9 = 4,4 degrees GH

Good i calculate ?

Yes i now that soda make kh ,but for what ?
When i add k2co3 to reach 20 ppm K I increase kh.
When i add 20 ppm ca using caco3 I increase too kh.
I dont now how big will be kh because i dont now atomic weight of co3 ..and i dont now the %amont of co3 in caco3 and k2co3.
Do you know this and can You count this ???
Thx
Sry for my englisch .
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post #12 of 19 (permalink) Old 11-11-2005, 02:07 PM
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Sorry, I'm just doing it the way I was told, I don't know enough to do more. Maybe someone else can help out now?

TW
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post #13 of 19 (permalink) Old 11-12-2005, 03:06 AM
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I live in Southern CAlifornia, USA and I have very hard water here. I don't remember the kH and gH out of the tap but it was so high I decided to dilute my tap water with RO water.

All I did was to continue to add RO water until I got the kH and gH parameters that I wanted. I now have a kH and gH of 5ppm's. Just add RO water everytime you make a water change until you get the parameters that you want. All the other things will be added to your water everytime you add your Macro and Micros at regular dosing.

I add CSM+B; KNO3;K2SO4, PO4, and all is doing great!!!

BTW there is a product made spicifically to reconstitute RO water. It's called RO Right. I used to use this but not any more.


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post #14 of 19 (permalink) Old 11-12-2005, 03:32 AM
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I used to use Kent RO Right as well. Now, I use Seachem Equilibrium because I believe it does a much better job at adding the things plants need. I wonder which is cheaper in the long run, using 100% RO and adding Equilibrium or mixing RO with tap and testing until you hit your targets and using up test kits in the process? I honestly don't know which is cheaper, but I know which is easier

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post #15 of 19 (permalink) Old 11-12-2005, 05:13 PM
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Oddly enough, RO Right does RO wrong. It adds very little GH, maybe one degree when dosed to the average amount. And, since they don't tell you what is in it in what proportions, it's a shot in the dark. It adds total dissolved solids (TDS) and that's all.

TW
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