I have a weird problem - The Planted Tank Forum
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 9 (permalink) Old 03-20-2012, 04:08 PM Thread Starter
Planted Member
 
PTrader: (16/100%)
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 266
Question I have a weird problem

At least it is weird to me, I hope you can help me figure it out.

So I am cycling my tank Mr. Aqua 17.4, I had the filter up and running for a while, sorry not sure how long maybe 1-2 weeks, with an empty tank, (while I waited for my Aquasoil) dropped in some flake food a few times to get the cycle going. I never did any tests, figured it was pointless. Once I received the Aquasoil, I filled the tank with it and my driftwood on March 5th. I got the normal nasty stuff on the wood and the tannins, which have all cleared by now.

The problem is the tank looks great, except after I do a water change within 1-3 hours my water gets very cloudy, milky white. I know this is supposedly a bacteria bloom. After approx. 12-14 hours the water is crystal clear again and looking great. I am doing WC's every 2-3 days at this point to help get the ammonia out of the aquasoil and cycle the tank. It seems really weird to me that I am only getting the blooms right after a water change and they do not last very long. Any guesses as to whats going on here?

My parameters as of right now. March 20th, 15 days into cycle with Aquasoil.
Ph 6.6
Ammonia .25
Nitrite 0
Nitrate 5ish.

I am running 2x24 Catalina 1 6500k and 1 10k bulbs. About 22" above substrate and 10" above surface.

Co2 should be setup and running later this week.

After water changes I add 1/3 cap Flourish Comprehensive (this will change to Root Medic Liquids, as soon as I finish off this flourish in the next couple of WCs). I add ~1.5-2ml Prime, and equal amount of API Co2 Booster.

At my last WC I omitted the Co2 Booster to see if that could have been the issue. It was not.. Next time I will try it without the Flourish. I know its not the Prime as I just switched from an empty to a fresh new bottle.

Tank is lightly planted, 20ish stems and 1 anubias petite.

Sorry this is so long winded. I hope it helps though. Thanks in advance.
dunehole is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 9 (permalink) Old 03-20-2012, 04:34 PM
Planted Tank Obsessed
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: York, Pa
Posts: 355
My tank was also cloudy, not quite milky when I replanted it. I used flourite, but I would imagine its the same result. I would give it a few days with no water changes. Frequent water changes will prolong your cycle.
smokaah is offline  
post #3 of 9 (permalink) Old 03-20-2012, 07:16 PM Thread Starter
Planted Member
 
PTrader: (16/100%)
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 266
I guess I should state that this is a recurring problem, after every water change I've done over the last 1.5 weeks or so. It is definitely not from the substrate getting agitated. Also, I am doing water changes so frequently because that is what is recommended with Aquasoil, what frequency would you recommend?
dunehole is offline  
 
post #4 of 9 (permalink) Old 03-20-2012, 08:51 PM
Planted Tank Guru
 
GeToChKn's Avatar
 
PTrader: (1/100%)
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 5,116
The thing is aquasoils leech ammonia built in to them, you filter converts them to food, cycle goes on. Changing water doesn't make the soil leech any faster. It's still going to leech ammonia no matter how much water you change. Think of it as a dripping tap. Doesn't matter if you put a cup under it and empty the cup every 10mins or a 55gal drum and empty the drum once every 14days, the tap is still going to leak.

By constantly changing water, you're making your aquasoil buffer more and more and actually wearing it out faster.

As for the cloudy water, I think it's the fact that the soil is leeching ammonia (usually around 4ppm) is what it peaks at, your filter and bacteria are eating it, you change the water, suck out all their food source (ammonia), the bacteria die off and get out of wack as the load of bacteria you had in there was used to 4ppm of food, now they have 0ppm, no food, they can't attach to the filter and surface of the tank, become free floating and you have a bloom. Soil ammonia concentrations get back up in the water, bacteria has more food, bacteria balance settles down, water clears, you change the water on them again.

Short answer. Leave it alone. lol.

20g platy, , 2 x 10g shrimp, 3 x 20g shrimp, 7.5g shrimp and 1 great dane/mastiff puppy.

Sump Pimp #2


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
GeToChKn is offline  
post #5 of 9 (permalink) Old 03-20-2012, 09:04 PM
Planted Tank Guru
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Contra Costa CA
Posts: 11,721
Allow the ammonia to build up to 3 ppm and do enough water changes to maintain it about 2-3 ppm. This will grow the bacteria the fastest. If either the ammonia or the nitrite get near 5 ppm do a water change, the bacteria do not grow well if these get too high.

Cloudy water... might be from the minerals in the tap water combining with the low pH water in the tank. What are the tap water parameters (or whatever you are using to refill the tank)
Diana is offline  
post #6 of 9 (permalink) Old 03-20-2012, 09:23 PM Thread Starter
Planted Member
 
PTrader: (16/100%)
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 266
Ok..

@GeToChKn - that makes sense, I will quit water changing. But out of curiosity, why then are the instructions for Aquasoil, via ADA, to change water 1x/day for the first week, every other day for the 2nd week, every third day for the third week, then down to once a week... ?

@Diana - Tap water here is very hard, I do not have Kh or Gh readings, Ph is 8.8 from the tap.
dunehole is offline  
post #7 of 9 (permalink) Old 03-22-2012, 03:35 AM Thread Starter
Planted Member
 
PTrader: (16/100%)
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 266
Anyone have any ideas? If I'm killing the bacteria at every WC, why does ADA say to change the water so frequently at the start?
dunehole is offline  
post #8 of 9 (permalink) Old 03-22-2012, 04:06 PM
Planted Tank Enthusiast
 
chicken's Avatar
 
PTrader: (9/100%)
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Catonsville, Maryland USA
Posts: 559
I've always done frequent water changes when starting a tank with Aquasoil, and it works fine for me.

I think if the ammonia levels get crazy high, some plants can melt. I seem to recall reports about this a few years back (on a different forum), from people using Aquasoil.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Greater Washington Aquatic Plant Association
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
chicken is offline  
post #9 of 9 (permalink) Old 03-22-2012, 07:28 PM
Planted Tank Guru
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Contra Costa CA
Posts: 11,721
Yes, some plants are very sensitive to ammonia. 3 ppm is great for growing cycle bacteria, but can be too high for some plants. Other plants do not seem to care, and do well with this level of ammonia.

Probably the reason for the water change schedule is something like this:
Many plants are sensitive to ammonia.
The plants are growing to become the bio filter.
Who cares how much bacteria will grow. They will grow at almost any level of ammonia below 5 ppm, and they are not the main biofilter in a planted aquarium.
Grow the plants at the optimum rate, and for most plants that is lower ammonia.
So... do lots of water changes when the soil is producing the most ammonia, and gradually back off as the soil settles down.
At about the end of the first month there will be enough bacteria, and the plants will be well enough established that they can deal with the lower amount of ammonia the soil is still producing.
Diana is offline  
Reply

Tags
None

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the The Planted Tank Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome