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post #1 of 79 (permalink) Old 03-10-2012, 08:10 AM Thread Starter
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The gold fish game

Hello,

Well it happened, I was given an oppertunity and I want to run with it.

I have a new online aquarium products company starting but its not much fun yet. Currently its all dry product. I realy like holding and breeding livestock. Either way I think I figured out a neat plan.

Localy there is a monthly outdoor market. I was thinking about renting a booth and doing a Goldfish game just like the carnivals. Most of us remember this game, you throw a ball at the goldfish bowls filled with colored water.

Well with acess to retailer pricing on things like food, pumps, bowls, decor, etc I felt like this could be a good idea. I checked and I do need a permit from the USDA (US Department of agriculture) Under the animal welfar act.

So my question to all of you is how can I assure these poor donor fish get a good chance?

Can one gold fish live in a one gallon bowl with 20% water changes every week? Will it be okay without an airstone?


I want to send everyone home with a plastic sqaure tank with top and a care sheet.


I will also sell
Glass bowls
tanks 5.5 gal/10 gal
Gravel
Decor
Air Pumps
Air Stones
Food
de-chlorinator



The market im selling to is actually an upper end community so I think I could actually sell a few high end tanks such as the Fluval chi systems If I wanted to carry them.

Let me know your input.

Alex R.

P.S. Sorry mods.... (I like this group)


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post #2 of 79 (permalink) Old 03-10-2012, 01:43 PM
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Fancy goldfish need a minimum of 15 gallons each with VERY good filtration - Commons need a pond. Even if you gave away full 20g setups with each fish (unrealistic, of course) the chances of the recipient actually caring enough to properly take care of the fish are low. Most of us who remember this game from when we were kids probably also remember that the poor fish didn't last very long once we got them home.

I think your idea is a very poor one - any pet, including fish, should be a well thought out purchase and not the end result of someone playing a game on a whim. The chances of any of the fish being well taken care of are slim to none.

I personally wouldn't be selling small bowls and tanks at this kind of event either. People see these items and assume they are suitable for all fish and truth is they are not suitable for much. Nano tanks can be difficult to maintain and I can see plenty of disasters with these set ups.

Your question "Can one gold fish live in a one gallon bowl with 20% water changes every week? Will it be okay without an airstone?" leads me to believe that you really don't know that much about fishkeeping and need to do ALOT of research if you want to be a responsible business owner.
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post #3 of 79 (permalink) Old 03-10-2012, 01:53 PM
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Please don't do this goldfish game. I know you think it's a fun idea and a great way to promote your business, but it's not a good idea at all. As wendyjo pointed out, goldfish need more than a small tank or one gallon bowl, and should not be brought home on impulse. Far too many people already have no clue what goldfish need, and this game will simply perpetuate that problem.


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post #4 of 79 (permalink) Old 03-10-2012, 02:39 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by wendyjo View Post
Fancy goldfish need a minimum of 15 gallons each with VERY good filtration - Commons need a pond. Even if you gave away full 20g setups with each fish (unrealistic, of course) the chances of the recipient actually caring enough to properly take care of the fish are low. Most of us who remember this game from when we were kids probably also remember that the poor fish didn't last very long once we got them home.

I think your idea is a very poor one - any pet, including fish, should be a well thought out purchase and not the end result of someone playing a game on a whim. The chances of any of the fish being well taken care of are slim to none.

I personally wouldn't be selling small bowls and tanks at this kind of event either. People see these items and assume they are suitable for all fish and truth is they are not suitable for much. Nano tanks can be difficult to maintain and I can see plenty of disasters with these set ups.

Your question "Can one gold fish live in a one gallon bowl with 20% water changes every week? Will it be okay without an airstone?" leads me to believe that you really don't know that much about fishkeeping and need to do ALOT of research if you want to be a responsible business owner.
Quite the opposite actually……
I’ve never bothered with a fish in a bowl much less a gold fish. (Unless I got it at a fair) it was always a full tank or nothing. I’ve done everything from planted tanks to reef tanks to natural biotopes and dabbled in some breeding and coral fragging.

I used to play this game as a kid, it was my favorite. Many times it caused me to come back to the hobby or to get a larger tank. In the end all the goldfish died but the enjoyment I had made them much more then a simple feeder fish. They were spot, blacky, knight, goldy, etc, etc, etc. Now to me if I had a choice a bad life with love or dinner guess what I would pick?

This game has people all up in arms; I think I’m going to go through with it though. In the end its permitted by law with the permits and I like the feeling of the old days the game can add to an event. Sorry.

As far as responsible goes…..
I’m trying to equip each person as best as I can and I want them to leave with the information necessary to be responsible pet owners. Let’s not forget a goldfish from the fair was a lot more than a fish in a bowl for many children it was a first pet an opportunity to get a little responsibility at very little cost. I’m also trying to ask for input on how to do this the best way, I can take constructive criticism but lets concentrate on helping the fish if this situation is inevitable.

Alex R.


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post #5 of 79 (permalink) Old 03-10-2012, 02:55 PM
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You are getting feedback - the feedback is that there is NO WAY to do this responsibly. You cannot possibly send the winners home with everything they need to properly take care of a goldfish and regardless of your clientele base, most people are not gonna spend the money needed to properly take care of these "free" fish. If you plan to send them home with a goldfish and a little bowl/tank, then perhaps you should offer immediate on-site euthanasia services for these fish as well, as that would probably be the most humane thing for them.

Saying you "enjoyed" the fish you won when you played this game is irrelevant to the well being of the fish. Personally I think I would prefer a quick death over being slowly poisoned by my own waste.

It seems you are only in this to make some money and you have no real concern for the well being of the livestock. That's a shame.
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post #6 of 79 (permalink) Old 03-10-2012, 03:06 PM
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I'm going to add one more thing here - as an experienced fish keeper who actually cares about the well being of fish, if I saw you doing this there is no way I would spend one cent at your booth. You may get a few sales from people who don't know any better, but people who actually have a clue probably wouldn't be interested in doing business with you and many of them would probably ask you what on earth you thought you were doing . And giving away fish that will probably die in the near future isn't going to bring in much repeat business either.

You rarely see this type of game anymore, and there is a reason for that - it's just a bad idea, period, both from an ethical stand point and a business one.
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post #7 of 79 (permalink) Old 03-10-2012, 03:53 PM
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Quote:
lets concentrate on helping the fish if this situation is inevitable.
This situation need not be inevitable. Replace 'goldfish' with 'puppy' in this scenario. As mentioned, there is a reason people are "all up in arms", responsible pet owners don't view animals as disposable, responsible retailers don't send animals off to what is likely a miserable toxic death. If ethics don't factor into your decisions, I can only hope public shame will. You will likely get an earful from pet lovers when they see you doing this.

4/26/2012, lost the finest man. Rest easy Pops...
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post #8 of 79 (permalink) Old 03-10-2012, 04:06 PM
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Thumbs down

"Fish are friends."

Consider yourself boycotted.

sox


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post #9 of 79 (permalink) Old 03-10-2012, 04:36 PM
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FWIW, I have a common plec that I have had since 2002. I fully expect him to live until he dies of old age, because he is in an environment that allows him to remain healthy. A goldfish in a suitable environment can live for decades.
Fish lifespan.
Quote:
Long Lifespans
On the other end of the lifespan spectrum, are Goldfish. There are many documented cases of Goldfish living a quarter of a century. They are perhaps the best example of how poor habitat and care shortens the lifespan of aquarium fish. The majority of Goldfish are not properly cared for, and as a result live only a few years.
A one gallon bowl is the extreme of unsuitable. There are so many other ways to promote your business, enabling the rapid demise of fish is not one of them.

4/26/2012, lost the finest man. Rest easy Pops...
<--Great Danes are people too!
180g, Fluval FX5, 404, 128watts t-8, low tech, heavily planted, with Albino and reg bristlenose plecs, Congo tetras, Amanos, a herd of Corydoras Sterbai, Boesmanis, a big old common plec, & Otos.
32g tall eclipse3, fluval403, with a handful of bristlenose plecs.
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post #10 of 79 (permalink) Old 03-10-2012, 04:49 PM
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Did you really expect to get an answer in your favor on here? I'm sorry but if I saw your booth I'd come up to you and say what all these other people are saying to you now. I don't see or get how you could do this to a poor little creature. Breathing in your own waste while you're trapped in a little bowl with no way out besides dead on the floor.
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post #11 of 79 (permalink) Old 03-10-2012, 04:56 PM
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How bout instead of totally b.s.ing rbpwrb we give him advice
instead of changing the tank.....change the thing inside of it. I would suggest something like a guppy. Goldfish just are too much work for the in-experienced. I also would suggest not doing a bowl but like a 5g with good filtration. Another idea is to not do fish altogether but actually just a planted bowl, and then provide them with a care sheet on cherry shrimp. So once they feel comfortable they could add 1 shrimp and see how it goes.

-If anyone else has suggestions speak up. (I don't mean acting like a A-hole either cause obviously he's going through with it anyways you might as well give him advice to make this "game" better).

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post #12 of 79 (permalink) Old 03-10-2012, 05:03 PM
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What about instead of live fish you could do fish figurines or plushies? Plushy Nemos would be totally awesome. Or fishy keychains!

That said, goldfish really do need at least (AT LEAST) 10 gallons, really good filtration and frequent water changes - probably a bit much for an impulse win. I wouldn't do any live critters as a prize, personally.

I am a bit sad the OP is going to ignore our advice in favor of a feeling for the old days to kill some helpless animals. :/
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post #13 of 79 (permalink) Old 03-10-2012, 05:10 PM
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What about instead of live fish you could do fish figurines or plushies? Plushy Nemos would be totally awesome. Or fishy keychains!
Ya thats a pretty good idea, you don't need something living in order to spread the fish hobby.
You could always just have fish but have them off to the side were people have to dedicate some of their money for a fully functional system, because that raises the stakes for them cause they don't want all their money to go to waste.
But overall someone has to "discover" and do their own research before anything successful can come of it....

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post #14 of 79 (permalink) Old 03-10-2012, 05:21 PM
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Originally Posted by FisheriesOmen View Post
How bout instead of totally b.s.ing rbpwrb we give him advice
instead of changing the tank.....change the thing inside of it. I would suggest something like a guppy. Goldfish just are too much work for the in-experienced. I also would suggest not doing a bowl but like a 5g with good filtration. Another idea is to not do fish altogether but actually just a planted bowl, and then provide them with a care sheet on cherry shrimp. So once they feel comfortable they could add 1 shrimp and see how it goes.

-If anyone else has suggestions speak up. (I don't mean acting like a A-hole either cause obviously he's going through with it anyways you might as well give him advice to make this "game" better).
I agree with Omen lets not bag on rbpwrb but guide them in a better direction. No it is not humane to keep goldfish in tiny tanks but are there not several other things that do well in tiny tanks...You could do fluvial chis and betas or shimp or guppies. Come on tpt lets help!


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post #15 of 79 (permalink) Old 03-10-2012, 05:31 PM
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I agree with Omen lets not bag on rbpwrb but guide them in a better direction. No it is not humane to keep goldfish in tiny tanks but are there not several other things that do well in tiny tanks...You could do fluvial chis and betas or shimp or guppies. Come on tpt lets help!
Thank You. Ya with WCs and lots of plants, how could you possibly fail with 1 or 2 cherry shrimp? Or just low light, no co2 tanks, as long as you provide them with the lighting need(otherwise it's your own fault). and you did say this was a pretty wealthy neighborhood so any Fluval tank would work too.

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