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post #1 of 10 (permalink) Old 02-11-2012, 10:05 PM Thread Starter
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Cool First Tank, Tips?

Hello all,
Yes, I am new here. I am trying to set up my first planted tank. I've been researching like crazy, and I am determined not to have a catastrophic failure.
So, my tank will be a goldfish tank. 1 black moor and 1 telescope. It will be in a 20 long gallon tank, for now. I am aware that I need a bigger tank and I will be establishing a new 50-60 gallon tank in june or july. So now i need tips on the planting part. I was planning on using Eco Complete Planted Black Aquarium Substrate. Has anyone used this before? Also, how would you set up a CO2 system? Or, would I need to with the fish? Basically, what I need to know is how can I balance between the fish and the plants, and what are some things i would absolutely need? Do I need an air pump? Also, what are some plants that would fit in well with the bulgy eyed goldfish? I have seen a couple of people mention anubias nana, but they look kind of rough. I've used Anacharis in a platy tank, and it quickly spread out of control, overtook my tank, and then died. So what plants would some of you recommend?
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post #2 of 10 (permalink) Old 02-11-2012, 10:30 PM
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Well, lets start with the lighting, what kind of lighting do you plan on using? Then let's talk substrate, Eco-Complete for planted tanks is good, but make sure to get the Eco-Complete Planted substrate. Now I'm not going to talk you into a expensive Co2 system, for tank that small I recommend going with Flourish Excel which is a carbon based liquid supplement this way no need for a Co2 system.

Now with the Excel supplement, make sure to only add enough to tank as to not overdose the tank and kill your fish, follow the directions on the bottle. As for plants, this is where the lighting choice will come into play.

Do you want a high light setup, or a low light setup...... This is because different plants demand different types of lighting.

45g Long - High Light Planted Tank / 30g - Plant Grow Out Tank / 100g Tank - currently resealing
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post #3 of 10 (permalink) Old 02-11-2012, 10:43 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xxUnRaTeDxxRkOxx View Post
Well, lets start with the lighting, what kind of lighting do you plan on using? Then let's talk substrate, Eco-Complete for planted tanks is good, but make sure to get the Eco-Complete Planted substrate. Now I'm not going to talk you into a expensive Co2 system, for tank that small I recommend going with Flourish Excel which is a carbon based liquid supplement this way no need for a Co2 system.

Now with the Excel supplement, make sure to only add enough to tank as to not overdose the tank and kill your fish, follow the directions on the bottle. As for plants, this is where the lighting choice will come into play.

Do you want a high light setup, or a low light setup...... This is because different plants demand different types of lighting.

Im thinking a high light setup, as the goldies have poor eyesight. Where can I get the Excel supplement?
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post #4 of 10 (permalink) Old 02-11-2012, 11:21 PM
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1. If you go to a welding supply store you can buy a 5 or 10lb empty cannister for reasonable and then fill it with C02 at a fire safety store, or the Airgas company. A bottle this size should last 2 years. The only expensive part of a C02 set-up is the regulator for the tank which can be bought at most aquarium stores (~80-150 bucks). The best way to inject C02 is the melt a small hole into your filter intake sleeve and run the C02 line into that. A bubble counter attached into the line helps you with the C02 flow rate. You can buy inexpensive C02 indicators which are useful. Try running the C02 at 1 bubble every few seconds. If you notice that your fish are hanging out at the top of the tank and gasping for air - reduce the C02 flow rate. Don't be afraid to try out the real CO2 pathway - it's rather fun and rewarding.
2. Substrate is important. I really don't think it matters which one you use......but be aware that some substrates, such as the ADA amazonia and other brands may leach out copious amounts of ammonia upon first setup. It takes about a week and a half to 2 weeks for the ammonia to dissepate. It is normal to have to do 50-75% water changes every couple days with the ADA brand upon new setup. I cover my substrate with about an inch of finely crushed gravel (although not really necessary)
3. When you first start a new planted tank with a newly constructed aquascape - be sure that you plant right away and PLANT HEAVY! If possible, try to acquire Java moss and Java fern which are "nutrient sponges" and very hardy. Planting heavy will keep ammonia levels and nitrates down which will keep algae in check. Limit your light to a new set-up to 6-8 hrs - slowly increase to desired effect as the tank becomes established. As soon as the nitrates and ammonia are under control - buy a small little army of otocinclus fish or siamese algae eaters to keep algae in check. Algae eating shrimp are also AMAZING housekeepers but not sure if your goldfish will eat them.
4. Do your homework on lighting. Don't have a crappy, underpowered light - you will just grow algae (although Java moss grows OK with low light)
5. Just because you have a fancy substrate does not mean that you don't have to add liquid fertilizers to your tank. Expect to add a capful of iron every few days along with trace minerals. When your tank comes alive with plants and is fully established you may need to add macro nutrients if your growth becomes stunted. I do not recommend adding macronutrients (K, Nitrogen,P04) to new tanks - only older tanks experiencing stunted growth. The macronutrient thing is a controversial isssue in the aquaria world.
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post #5 of 10 (permalink) Old 02-12-2012, 03:57 AM
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I used to keep Orandas & Ryukins.

I'd offer a different way to approach this based on your keeping Goldfish.

1st Goldfish are POOP factories. What ever you do keep cleaning maine in mind. Maybe double the filtration you would plan for other community type fish.

2nd forget high/low light debates when deciding on plants, Picj what goldfish really don't like to eat and that list is small Jaca fern, thicker leaved Val & sag, Anubius, Onion plant
Good news almost all lower light.

3rd Do NOT bother CO2, those plants will do fine with out it, Save that $$$ for the bigger tank

4th don't worry about Ferts...See #1

5th watch the substrates size, Goldfish are little piggies and they will suck sand & small pebbles up with food.
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post #6 of 10 (permalink) Old 02-12-2012, 04:04 AM
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IIRC goldfish like cold water and eat plants. I don't think they would be the best choice for a planted tank.

Semper Fi
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post #7 of 10 (permalink) Old 02-12-2012, 04:34 AM
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Actually most of the fancy gold fish do a little better in warm water 72 and seenm to bennifit from a bit of salt in the water.

You are very correct they do love to eat their greens. Smashed frozen peas were always a favorite. Had a few that loved duck weed too.
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post #8 of 10 (permalink) Old 02-12-2012, 05:28 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DogFish View Post
Actually most of the fancy gold fish do a little better in warm water 72 and seenm to bennifit from a bit of salt in the water.

You are very correct they do love to eat their greens. Smashed frozen peas were always a favorite. Had a few that loved duck weed too.
So would it be safe to get a loach or cory cat for bottom feeding?
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post #9 of 10 (permalink) Old 02-12-2012, 01:45 PM
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Many loaches are from cooler water. I had a weather loach that shared the tank(55hex) with the gold fish had him for over 3 years. He & the Gold fish were large when I sold them and the tank.

Corys do a better in warmer water.
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post #10 of 10 (permalink) Old 02-12-2012, 09:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DogFish View Post
Many loaches are from cooler water. I had a weather loach that shared the tank(55hex) with the gold fish had him for over 3 years. He & the Gold fish were large when I sold them and the tank.

Corys do a better in warmer water.

Cories also do much better in groups of 3 or more, so if you get some make sure you are going to have room for them. I've a much larger group in my shrimp tank which is a 20L, but I'm not sure about with the "poop factories".
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