Micro and Macro Nutrients? - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #1 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-01-2005, 04:59 AM Thread Starter
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Micro and Macro Nutrients?

I bought a bottle of Flourish (micro) and was told that it is less important then Macros: Flourish Phosphorous, Potassium, and Nitrogen. How important are the macros and how often should they be dosed?

Also are there any product that's a "all-in-one" macro/micro nutrient supplement out there? Because I would have to buy a bottle of Phosp., a bottle Potass., and a bottle Nitrogen which can be cumbersome...such as Flourish Tabs?

THis is assuming that I have 2.8wpg and a Co2 system with Eco-Complete substrate.

Thanks!
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post #2 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-01-2005, 05:54 AM
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The barr method of fert dosing is worth checking out
http://www.barrreport.com/forums/sho...timative+index

I would also recommend Greg Watson to purchase all your ferts in powder form.
http://www.gregwatson.com

ernest

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post #3 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-01-2005, 03:04 PM Thread Starter
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Quite a lengthy and detailed read. I'm a bit confused though
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post #4 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-01-2005, 03:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sly
Quite a lengthy and detailed read. I'm a bit confused though
Macro dosing can be confusing at first, but Tom Barr's method makes perfect sense. And buy buying your ferts from gregwatson you will save a ton of money compared to buying the flourish line.
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post #5 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-01-2005, 03:18 PM
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I agree that you can save a bunch vs. commercial ferts. I would get the PMDD (Poor Mans Dosing Drops or Poor Mans Dupla Drops) pre-mix from gregwatson.com, it covers most of the basis for fertilization. Check out this article at theKrib.com as it gives good info on dosing and algee control:
http://www.thekrib.com/Plants/Fertil...rs-conlin.html
You will probably find some contradicting info now days as the above study was conducted over 10 years ago but the basics are still the same.

Raf
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post #6 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-01-2005, 03:28 PM Thread Starter
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Is the PMDD Pre-Mix the one you are speaking about? Since it is in powder form, do I need to liquidize it or do anything preparation before dosing it?

THanks for the comments so far, appreciated.

Sly
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post #7 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-01-2005, 03:35 PM Thread Starter
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I see, the recipe for the PPMD are separate items that need to put together. Or just buy the PPMD pre-mix.
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post #8 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-01-2005, 03:36 PM
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The PMDD lacks phosphate, but your tank might not need it since its only a 10 gallon. I think you will need to dilute it with water to make a solution. The pound of premix should last you a long time on a 10 gallon.
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post #9 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-01-2005, 03:40 PM Thread Starter
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PPMD = macronutriets
Plantex CSM = micronutrients

Took me a few minutes to figure that out. Correct me if I'm mistaken.

Since I already bought a bottle of Flourish for micro, I'll just purchase the PPMD pre-mix.
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post #10 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-01-2005, 03:58 PM
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The PMDD Pre-Mix from gregwatson.com already contains the CSM+B so you get the Macros and Micros all in one.
You just have to remember to do the water changes to dilute the unused elements as some can become toxic at high concentrations.

Raf
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post #11 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-01-2005, 04:01 PM Thread Starter
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Thank you for the clarification. Now I have to determine my tank's dosage.

According to the Barr article, it assumes that all ingredients are seperated but the PPMD are mixed so I'll have to find another method.

Has anybody used the PPMD for 10g and at what dosage?

The Krib: "If you have a "high tech", densely planted, CO2 injected, VHO lit tank, you might want to double the dose to 1/6 ml of PMDD per 10 gallons a day (roughly 4 drops)"

I think I'll go for 2-4 drops to start off and measure the parameters so they are in the following ranges:

CO2 range 20-30ppm
NO3 range 5-20ppm
K+ range 10-30ppm
PO4 range 0.4-1.5 ppm
Fe 0.5ppm or higher (?)
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post #12 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-01-2005, 06:33 PM
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If I were you:
1. I would read more about fertilization before doing any serious dosing
2. Be very patient with results once started.
3. Create record of dosing and water changes + effects on plant life.
4. Daily testing of water parameters to determine nutrient uptake so you can adjust dosing accordingly.
5. Oh and did I mention patience?

Raf
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post #13 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-01-2005, 07:34 PM
 
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Hey Sly,

One more log for the fire , Iíve slowly converting to Tom Barr's EI method with a little modification.

I measure my tank on water change day ... the ratio of 15 NO3 and 1.5 PO4

I micros w/ flourish (or CSM+B) and my macro with a premixed ratio of KNO3 & KH2PO4. (Which is 1 tablespoon of NO3 and 1 teaspoon of KH2PO4 mixed in to a 500ml bottle?)

Hope I didn't confuse the issue. Good Luck.

Thom
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post #14 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-01-2005, 07:45 PM Thread Starter
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Are there any PO4 tests out there?

And yes, you did confuse me. This feels like when I first started fish keeping and learning about the Cycle!! Daunting at first but a cinch now. Hopefully this nutrient dosing will be the same.
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post #15 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-01-2005, 07:52 PM
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PO4 is a fairly common test kit. My LFS carries the Hagen but there are others out there. Visit Dr Foster Smith website for some options.

Raf
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