Huge canister on nano tank? - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #1 of 8 (permalink) Old 05-12-2019, 09:17 PM Thread Starter
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Huge canister on nano tank?

Hey all,

I am planning on building a nano tank, with no expenses spared. It will be placed on a large desk, with plenty of space underneath. Now, I was thinking, wouldn't it be great if I could use a huge canister filter on this tiny tank? It would add water volume to the system! Of course normally the flow would be way too high and the fish would be *ahem*... congregated around the inflow.

I was thinking to add a piece of hose, with an adjustable tap, in between the outflow and inflow hoses of the canister, a short distance from the canister. This way, some of the water will flow to the tank, and (hopefully) most of the water will flow right back into the filter through the inflow hose. I think the volume of water flowing right back into the canister might be high enough, because the water has to fight gravity to enter the tank, and there will be some suction effect on the inflow, making the "bridge" between the two hoses the path of least resistance for the water.

What do you guys think of this idea? Is it possible for the water to spend too much time in the canister as opposed to the tank, thus being overfiltered, if there is such a thing? Do you think I can decrease flow in the tank enough this way? Anything am not considering?

I have thought about using a sump filter, but I want to be able to use lily pipes. If anyone knows of a way to do this, I would love to hear it too.

And a little unrelated question, does anyone know whether inline (external) heaters use more or less energy than conventional heaters? And would an overpowered heater be ok for a nano tank, since it has a thermostat?

Looking forward to your thoughts!
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post #2 of 8 (permalink) Old 05-12-2019, 10:37 PM
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I have an Eheim 2213 on a UNS 10g long shallow tank. The filter is located on the floor next to my stand. After trying a lot of different shaped lily pipes, I wound up with the standard shape and it is not too much flow. Tank is stocked with shrimp, green neons and pygmy cories. The neons play in the flow, and the cories stay on the opposite side of it. If you are worried about flow, try the spin pipe. It definitely cuts down on the current (and in my case too much so).
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post #3 of 8 (permalink) Old 05-12-2019, 11:21 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shattersea View Post
I have an Eheim 2213 on a UNS 10g long shallow tank. The filter is located on the floor next to my stand. After trying a lot of different shaped lily pipes, I wound up with the standard shape and it is not too much flow. Tank is stocked with shrimp, green neons and pygmy cories. The neons play in the flow, and the cories stay on the opposite side of it. If you are worried about flow, try the spin pipe. It definitely cuts down on the current (and in my case too much so).
I have had a 2213 on the tank for this build before, it worked fine with some strategic placement of the inflow and outflow. The tank is only 27 liters or about 7 gallons. The 2213 is one of Eheim's smallest filters. I am talking about a huge, insanely overpowered filter for this tank. The largest I have found from Eheim is their classic 1500XL, which has an internal volume of 23 liters or about 6 gallons, essentially doubling the volume of my system. I suppose this would be very energy inefficient, so it would be better to actually simply have a less powerful pump, rather than routing water back through the filter unnecessarily. The problem is I am not sure I am a capable enough electrician to replace the pump with a less powerful one. I suppose the 1500XL is an extreme example, but a a 30-40% increase to the volume of my system would be very cool too.
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post #4 of 8 (permalink) Old 05-13-2019, 12:42 AM
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There are also add on modules like this that could be added to add extra water volume. If your handy could even build something similar with pvc pipe etc.

https://www.amazon.com/Sunsun-38439-.../dp/B00INCS6PS

But yes, take bigger canister and only use like 1 pre and bio module, leave others empty just for extra water volume. Take output, split to a Y>2 valves and run one down right beside input tube to spraybar blowing left to right along back glass/gravel level, then the other side up to top right of tank nozzle/tulip blowing slightly right to left to give that nice surface ripple. Then you can valve output flow back a bit at output valves if needed.

You’ll end up with this nice firm high/low rollercoaster rotating current that keep proper nutrient circulation at gravel level/water surface that’s not to hard at any one place and will sweep up debris and carry them right over to intake strainer to pick up.

I wouldn’t go to big though on tank like that, maybe double size of norm. Regardless of how much capacity you add your evaporation rate is still going to be the same. It’s dictated by how many square in. of surface area tank has, temp and airflow/agitation across water surface. Only thing your adding is more volume of water for waste/organics to dilute into. It’s really almost same as just going to a deeper tank of same footprint.

Last edited by DaveKS; 05-13-2019 at 08:32 PM. Reason: Typo
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post #5 of 8 (permalink) Old 05-16-2019, 03:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultimatenano View Post
Hey all,

I am planning on building a nano tank, with no expenses spared. It will be placed on a large desk, with plenty of space underneath. Now, I was thinking, wouldn't it be great if I could use a huge canister filter on this tiny tank?

So just how large of a desk and space are you talking about. If I had plenty of room under the desk I might consider setting up a "Dual Stage" filter. So put a 10 gallon tank under the desk and put a good lid on it. Then set the canister filter next to it and have it filtering the water in the 10 gallon tank. Then run the over flow of the water from the seven gallon display tank down to the 10 gallon sump (maybe even with a filter sock) and the return from the 10 gallon back up to the tank. This way the water still gets filtered, you have a larger water column to work with, and get to to control the flow back into the display tank to not spin your fish around like they are in a tornado.


Hard to describe but here is a crude, and I mean CRUDE, picture of what I was thinking.

Click image for larger version

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Then again, if you have them spinning around like a tornado you could just tell everyone it is a themed tank of the Wizard of Oz.

Tim Sapp
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post #6 of 8 (permalink) Old 05-16-2019, 10:49 PM
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But why?

Some time ago now on a FB Tropical Fish Hobbyist group I saw a 55g tank with three large Sunsun filters underneath. You just gotta ask....why?

Filters just collect crud that decomposes and pollutes the water. Might better opt for a simpler system to get the crud out of the system as soon as possible.

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post #7 of 8 (permalink) Old 05-17-2019, 03:14 PM
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Filters don't just collect crud and waste. They maintain a huge volume of tiny surfaces for beneficial bacterial colonies to form. A proper planted tank isn't going to have much 'crud' to begin with if your system is in balance.

Having more filtration than you need is 100% fine. Most people in the hobby for long enough will probably advise you to have more than you need because it never hurts. Just so long as you can control the flow, as you've suggested, without damaging your filter. I've done it for years on my small tanks. More surface area = better.

There are a lot of great ideas in this thread. The sump idea (if you have the space) is my favorite. If your bioload isn't too crazy, you won't even need a proper filter - just use sponges and filter material (ceramic and the like). Tons of DIY videos and even threads here on the forum about it. Just silicone in some pieces of acrylic or glass to create sections in the sump tank to separate your material and create levels of 'filtration', add a small pump and you're good to go. Won't even have to drill. Just use flexible tubing and curved pipes on the back of your tank.

If you're set on using a proper filter, I've found that just using an extra-long outflow hose can help slow water flow (usually) without putting too much strain on decent filters. So can DIYing outflow pipes that have tons of holes in them so water isn't just gushing in one direction at full force.
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post #8 of 8 (permalink) Old 05-18-2019, 01:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by somewhatshocked View Post
Filters don't just collect crud and waste. They maintain a huge volume of tiny surfaces for beneficial bacterial colonies to form. A proper planted tank isn't going to have much 'crud' to begin with if your system is in balance.

Having more filtration than you need is 100% fine. Most people in the hobby for long enough will probably advise you to have more than you need because it never hurts. Just so long as you can control the flow, as you've suggested, without damaging your filter. I've done it for years on my small tanks. More surface area = better.....

Well I've been in the hobby 50+ years and feel too many people invest in oversize filters or more filters thinking it results in better water quality...but it really doesn't. And these same folks may not service these bigger filters for months. And there's more surface area in the average substrate and decor then any filter. Now I'll admit that even with 50+ years in the hobby, I'm still learning, but we'll have to agree to disagree. ;-)

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Last edited by AbbeysDad; 05-18-2019 at 12:20 PM. Reason: fix quote
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