Planted tank cycle? - The Planted Tank Forum
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 20 (permalink) Old 12-27-2004, 01:28 PM Thread Starter
Guest
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 76
Planted tank cycle?

I just added plants to my 4 day old 7 gallon yesterday (java fern, java moss, some "rotala", and water sprite. The brown cloudiness from the flourite totally dissapeared yesterday and the water has been slightly cloudy-white, which has gotten even better today (this is normal for a new tank, right?)
anyway its going to be a tank with 2 dwarf puffers, an otto catfish and a few shrimp...is it OK to just add these all at once because there are plants in the tank? Or do I need to buy some ammonia and start a cycle? my tanks almost all cleared up some im anxious to add fish, but ill wait if I must...
Vic711 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 20 (permalink) Old 12-27-2004, 02:37 PM
Planted Member
 
Sterving's Avatar
 
PTrader: (5/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Staten Island, NY
Posts: 189
Vic711, I would recommend fishless cycling of the tank first. I am currently waiting for my 10 gal tank to finish cycling (hopefully by new year's). Putting all that fish and shrimp in is a sure way to get you fish dead quick in such a small tank.

Get your ammonia in first and start testing daily. You can google alot of info on "fishless cycling".

HTH
Sterving is offline  
post #3 of 20 (permalink) Old 12-27-2004, 03:06 PM
Guest
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 2,165
Unless you have a ton of lighting, and CO2 setup for that tank, you'll need to cycle normally. Only 'high light/high tech' tanks with dense plantings of stem plants can 'skip' the normal cycling procedures...and even then I wouldn't try it on your first planted tank.
malkore is offline  
 
post #4 of 20 (permalink) Old 12-27-2004, 03:30 PM Thread Starter
Guest
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 76
K, im going to buy some pure ammonia today....so how much should I use and how often for a 7 gallon tank? should i do any water changes during the cycle or only before I add fish?
Vic711 is offline  
post #5 of 20 (permalink) Old 12-27-2004, 03:36 PM Thread Starter
Guest
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 76
oh and instead could I buy the fish along with a packet of Bio-Spira, add the bio-spira while the fish are adjusting to the temp in the bag, then release the fish 15 mins later? or is that not enough time for the bio-spira to take effect?
Vic711 is offline  
post #6 of 20 (permalink) Old 12-27-2004, 03:48 PM
Planted Member
 
Sterving's Avatar
 
PTrader: (5/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Staten Island, NY
Posts: 189
I've never tried Bio-Spira, but I hear it's the best cycle product out there.
The amount of ammonia to add largely depends on the brand you use. You have to figure it out by trial and error. Use ammonia test kit to determine the amount needed to reach desired concentration (ppm). About 2 ppm was enough for my 10 gal tank to get going, but I read some people went as high as 5 ppm to really accelerate bacterial growth. It is possible to put too much ammonia that will inhibit bacterial growth though.
Sterving is offline  
post #7 of 20 (permalink) Old 12-27-2004, 03:58 PM
Planted Member
 
Sterving's Avatar
 
PTrader: (5/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Staten Island, NY
Posts: 189
Also, generally when doing fishless cycle, no water changes are needed unless concentration of nutrients is too high that it inhibits the cycle. Once the cycle is complete, a large water change (50% - 90%) is needed. Then you can add your fish.
Sterving is offline  
post #8 of 20 (permalink) Old 12-27-2004, 08:56 PM
Planted Member
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: SE PA, USA
Posts: 194
Quote:
Originally Posted by malkore
Unless you have a ton of lighting, and CO2 setup for that tank, you'll need to cycle normally. Only 'high light/high tech' tanks with dense plantings of stem plants can 'skip' the normal cycling procedures...and even then I wouldn't try it on your first planted tank.
I respectfully disagree with this. In my low tech tanks, I usually install the plants on day one and add the fish on day two. The important things are to use fast growing plants, like water sprite, and to add just a few fish every few days. A little bit of substrate or mulm from an established tank helps. Before the ammonia/ammonium gets to a dangerous point, the plants will have started to grow and consume it.

If one has a bare tank that is large enough and he or she adds fish on day one, it will never "cycle" or, it has already "cycled", as one prefers.

Bill
aquabillpers is offline  
post #9 of 20 (permalink) Old 12-27-2004, 09:07 PM Thread Starter
Guest
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 76
Well my tank has reached pretty much crystal clarity now, so before I waste my money on Bio-Spira, any other views as to whether or not I should cycle the tank or just add the 2 dwarf puffers and an african dwarf frog, I wont be adding them until Thursday anyway thats when Petsmart gets them (only place I can find em)

So who thinks I should be cycling, who thinks otherwise?
Vic711 is offline  
post #10 of 20 (permalink) Old 12-27-2004, 09:19 PM
Planted Member
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: SE PA, USA
Posts: 194
Vic,

As you might have surmised, I am negative about the whole idea of artificial "cycling." If I had that tank and the plants were installed and a filter
with aged media running, I would add one or two puffers and feed them very lightly. I'd save the frog for a week or two.

I would also monitor the ammonia level and be ready to do a partial water change if it got very high.

Good luck.

Bill
aquabillpers is offline  
post #11 of 20 (permalink) Old 12-27-2004, 09:32 PM Thread Starter
Guest
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 76
I think i'll try your method - however, my filter and its media (2 sponges) are brand new and added to the tank a few days ago...the only bacteria in my tank maybe came on the bunch of plants I bought? im going to buy a couple more plants when I get the 2 puffers also, and ill skip the frog for a few weeks.
Vic711 is offline  
post #12 of 20 (permalink) Old 12-27-2004, 11:10 PM
Guest
 
PTrader: (3/100%)
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,939
Quote:
who who thinks I should be cycling, who thinks otherwise?
I think otherwise....
Cycling a tank is dependant on how many plants (of the right type) and how many fish you are thinking of adding. If you load the tank up with "fast" growing types of plants you can add some stock but but keep in mind this is not a full stock of fish.
Adding ammonia is the most ridiculous thing you can do in a newly planted tank. The fish's waste and the natural breakdown of nitrites/nitrates is plenty if done in moderation.
The ammonia will come naturally if you follow the basic "light" stocking method. Too few plants and too many fish are trouble, more plants then fish will assist each other in the cycle.

Forget the old days and use common sense when stocking your tank with fish and you will have no problems.
It all boils down to the plant types you choose when it comes to stocking fish.

Forget considering swords, anubia's, crypt's and any other root feeder you may want in the plant stock. They MUST be plants that draw from the water column.
Buck is offline  
post #13 of 20 (permalink) Old 12-27-2004, 11:11 PM
Guest
 
PTrader: (3/100%)
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,939
Not to mention that ANY new tank should have frequent water changes to absorb any build-ups of bad qualities.
Buck is offline  
post #14 of 20 (permalink) Old 12-28-2004, 12:17 AM
Planted Tank Guru
 
Rex Grigg's Avatar
 
PTrader: (65/100%)
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Portland Orygun
Posts: 9,600
Bio-Spira does work. I have used it on a couple of tanks.
Rex Grigg is offline  
post #15 of 20 (permalink) Old 12-28-2004, 01:49 PM
Guest
 
PTrader: (0/0%)
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 2,165
Quote:
Originally Posted by aquabillpers
I respectfully disagree with this. In my low tech tanks, I usually install the plants on day one and add the fish on day two. The important things are to use fast growing plants, like water sprite, and to add just a few fish every few days. A little bit of substrate or mulm from an established tank helps. Before the ammonia/ammonium gets to a dangerous point, the plants will have started to grow and consume it.

If one has a bare tank that is large enough and he or she adds fish on day one, it will never "cycle" or, it has already "cycled", as one prefers.

Bill
Adding a small amount of seasoned substrate does amazing things to kickstart a cycle.
It also sounds like you're not a noob...and that has a large impact on 'creative cycling'.
Since Vic sounds very new, and didn't mention an existing, cycled tank, I choose to play it safe, for the benefit of his future fish.
malkore is offline  
Reply

Tags
None

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the The Planted Tank Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome