Holey Tiger Lotus, Batman! - The Planted Tank Forum
 
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post #1 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-14-2004, 03:40 PM Thread Starter
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Holey Tiger Lotus, Batman!

I've got a red tiger lotus that was doing great, with growth right from the beginning that can only be described as explosive. Now, virtually all of the leaves have holes. The holes start out looking like a cigarette burn (small hole with crispy looking edges), then expand until the leave is reduced to a small triangle. There is some new growth, but it looks kind of anemic - small leaves that don't have good color. I've noticed the same problem to a lesser degree with my the only other red plant in the tank - A. reineckii - some little holes, but not as much destruction.

I added a couple of Flourish root tabs a couple of weeks ago, but nothing has really changed as far as I can tell. I haven't really been fertilizing at all; I've been a little skittish about it since I had an algae problem.

The tank is a 40 regular, heavily planted. Jebo 2X96 watt lighting. Small gravel substrate mixed with Eco Complete (less than 50%). It's been up and running for about six months.

Thanks.
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post #2 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-14-2004, 03:47 PM
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well, you do have a high light tank, so you really shouldn't be "not dosing because of algae" as this can sometimes lead to more algae and nutrient deficiencies.

What are your N P and CO2 levels at?

Do you dose iron and K?


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post #3 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-15-2004, 03:01 AM
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had the Exact same thing happen to mine. For me it started off as a sort of green discoulored area, and progressed across the leave into massive holes!!
I'm pretty sure it is caused by a nutrient deffecientcy, most likely iron *I* would guess.
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post #4 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-15-2004, 09:41 AM
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With that much light you should definately be adding CO2 as well as nutrients.
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post #5 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-15-2004, 03:18 PM Thread Starter
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I had guessed that there was some kind of deficiency, I just was hoping for something a little more specific before I start experimenting with dosing. All other plants appear to be doing very well, so I was wondering if the difficulty with my red plants was likely something specific - like nitrates or iron (thanks Sundewd).

Also, the tank is free of algae except for the occasional spot algae on glass and a couple of plants. Will dosing to achieve a 10:1 nitrate/phosphate balance help with that?

BTW, I forgot to mention that I'm also running pressurized co2.
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post #6 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-15-2004, 11:45 PM
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Originally Posted by fishwife
I haven't really been fertilizing at all; I've been a little skittish about it since I had an algae problem.
That probably sums it up There was an initial burst of growth, soon all nutrients were used up, and plants are starving to death now. They need food too... Nitrate, Potassium, Phosphate and CO2 for macros, and a nice mixture of micro nutrients like Flourish.

The slow-grow, fish-poop-fertilizer method works for lighting levels at about 1/3 of yours. You really ought to look into dosing nutrients.


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post #7 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-17-2004, 04:23 AM Thread Starter
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Ok, I get it - I need to start dosing. I just tested the tank for phosphate and nitrate, and both were 0. CO2 I've got. I'll start up again with nitrate and phosphate and test again tomorrow. I don't have potassium - is it essential?

Any idea why the Flourish root tabs didn't help at all? I thought lotuses were root feeders.
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post #8 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-17-2004, 11:05 AM
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They are root feeders, but Flourish root tabs contain very low levels of nitrogen, phosphorus, and potassium. In fact they are mostly calcium and sulfur
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post #9 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-17-2004, 11:51 AM
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Yes potassium is essential too. You don't want to dose N-P with no K, which can become the limiting factor. Holes are usually a sign of K deficiency.
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post #10 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-17-2004, 02:49 PM Thread Starter
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So . . . I'll get my hands on potassium. Any suggestions on a root tab that will give them what they need?
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post #11 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-17-2004, 06:49 PM
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I would worry more about dosing the water column than finding a root tab. IMHO root tabs are great for swords and crypts in lower light tanks but are not up to the task of providing nutrients to higher light tanks.

I feel that many products on the market are designed to work best in lower light tanks since the vast majority of tanks fall into this category. It might not seem like it to many people here on the forum but a tank with 2.5 wpg or more is actually quite rare in the aquarium hobby. Many people still buy the non-aquatic plants at the local big box pet store and are happy they "survive" for a couple of months. Most people don't do large water changes on any sort of regular basis. High tech planted tanks are a very small specialty in the aquarium hobby. I would almost guess there are more high tech reef tanks out there than there are high tech planted tanks. All I do is have to look around town and see how many stores sell high end reef supplies vs how many actually sell any decent planted tank supplies.
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post #12 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-18-2004, 02:21 AM Thread Starter
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Interesting. Thanks.
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post #13 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-18-2004, 03:46 AM
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Well, to be fair Rex... most reef supplies barring skimmers and doses have some purpose in another portion of the aquarium hobby. My belief is that when people generally look at startup cost (hardware) for a reef vs. planted (under 55 gallons) they figure that they'll get more bang out of the reef. Of course, this isn't true as reefs are painful expensive to set up and maintain properly.

Having said that, I'd agree that the "geek" planters are considerably rarer than the reefers or Petsmart java fern crowd.

I keep a 2x65 29 gallon... as has been stated previously, you have to dose the snot out of high wattage tanks . Fert tabs just don't cut it... the previous advice is solid.

HTH
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post #14 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-18-2004, 12:27 PM
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There is some cross over in the equipment. But other than reef geeks and plant geeks no one else uses high light over a tank. And if I look around my town it's really hard to find decent plant lights but very easy to find decent reef lights. If I need replacement PC bulbs for a reef tank they are very easy to find locally. But for my plant tank I have to either special order them or mail order them. Look at the big mail order houses catalogs or web sites. How much space do they devote to reef hardware vs plant hardware?

Face it boys and girls. We are the lunatic fringe.
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post #15 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-18-2004, 05:03 PM
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Quote:
We are the lunatic fringe.
How about "The Enlightened Elite"?

Rex's comments on planted aquariums are right on the mark. I am always amazed at the lack of knowledge and misunderstandings about planted aquariums among the members of my aquarium club.

Those guys can ramble off Latin names and breed fish in buckets, but when it comes to any understanding about how a planted aquarium works, particularly a high tech aquarium, the guys are in the dark. In fact, there was a bit of a stir a couple of months ago as the members of the club who run high tech aquariums started to rip through the growers program and inundated the club with plants. Club members have no concept on how we grow plants as quickly and as well as we do. They think we run reef lights and are amazed at CO2 injection and dosing.

We are a freaky little lot, but we surely know something they don't!

Mike

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