any stores carry ada amazonia? - The Planted Tank Forum
 
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post #1 of 11 (permalink) Old 08-08-2015, 03:32 AM Thread Starter
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any stores carry ada amazonia?

are there any shops that carry the ada substrates in eastern MA near boston?
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post #2 of 11 (permalink) Old 08-08-2015, 04:07 AM
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Han has some, but he only has a website.


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post #3 of 11 (permalink) Old 08-08-2015, 05:20 AM
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This store by my house sells ADA products........ come to the west coast, ayeeeee

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post #4 of 11 (permalink) Old 08-08-2015, 05:25 AM
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Take a trip to Monster Aquarium in NY? lol Controsoil is pretty good and amazon ships.


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post #5 of 11 (permalink) Old 08-09-2015, 05:27 PM
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I think there are very few if any stores in MA that will carry ADA now.

After ADG gave up on ADA a couple years back, ADANA has a continued monopoly on the supply for ADA stuff now. It's pretty hard for an east coast store to be competitive because of shipping costs etc. It's often more financially sound for both the store and the consumer to buy it from ADANA directly. I believe ADG cut ties with ADA(NA) because they couldn't provide reasonable prices given the prices ADA(NA) was giving them. It's the same reason why I dropped ADA. I didn't think it made any sense for me to bring in ADA stuff, then sell it for the same price as ADANA, only to lose money. I'd have to raise prices just to break even, and since that's not fair to the customer, you might as well send the customer directly to ADANA right? Stuff like this is probably why an ADA-focused store shut down a few years back (I think it was in the NJ/NY area?)

That said, a few alternatives have come on to the scene to compete with ADA products, namely Mr Aqua stuff. However, even Mr. Aqua stuff is hard to sell competitively on the east coast because of shipping costs from CA. At least it's more reasonably priced.

I have ADA 60P + 602 AquaSky/anthracite cabinet and instead of ADA aquasoil I put mr aqua shrimp sand. From my personal testing, mr aqua shrimp sand leaches less into the water and provides for a more sterile/stable/predictable setup, while retaining its structure very well. I've had the shrimp sand in a tank for 2+ years, then after breaking down the tank, the granules were still intact. There are also people that swear by ADA aquasoil and that's cool too. That's why I sold ADA aquasoil in the past. In my mind success depends on the user's ability to understand what they're working with and what they prefer. That's why some people can thrive with miracle gro and stuff like that or local garden soil. It's because they know what they're working with and are making it work.

I'm not sure if Han has an actual store, in that he has a sales/use tax id or if he imports stuff and just resells off the books. I think "lighter weight" operations are a good way to meet growing specific demands because it's really nuts for any "retail" store to be able to carry everything someone would look for. I'd rather have more diverse options! I look down at stores that try to squash hobbyist operations. Extreme enthusiasts are what keep this hobby growing, sharing their passions with others whether it's for profit or simply enjoyment. When all a store cares about is profit margins, that's when newcomers to the hobby lose, burnt out by what they believed to be a trustworthy source. I've met Han before and I think he's a super nice and great guy. He knows what he's doing and is willing to teach others. That's all I would look for when buying from anyone.

I'm not trying to plug any brand over one another here but just trying to explain how I see ADA availability and why things are the way they are. I have bags of mr aqua shrimp sand and mr aqua black aqua soil if you're interested, located in Natick.
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post #6 of 11 (permalink) Old 08-10-2015, 02:51 AM Thread Starter
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thanks for all the info! how good is the mr aqua stuff in terms of plant growth and health? and how expensive and the bags/how big?


Quote:
Originally Posted by aquaful View Post
I think there are very few if any stores in MA that will carry ADA now.

After ADG gave up on ADA a couple years back, ADANA has a continued monopoly on the supply for ADA stuff now. It's pretty hard for an east coast store to be competitive because of shipping costs etc. It's often more financially sound for both the store and the consumer to buy it from ADANA directly. I believe ADG cut ties with ADA(NA) because they couldn't provide reasonable prices given the prices ADA(NA) was giving them. It's the same reason why I dropped ADA. I didn't think it made any sense for me to bring in ADA stuff, then sell it for the same price as ADANA, only to lose money. I'd have to raise prices just to break even, and since that's not fair to the customer, you might as well send the customer directly to ADANA right? Stuff like this is probably why an ADA-focused store shut down a few years back (I think it was in the NJ/NY area?)

That said, a few alternatives have come on to the scene to compete with ADA products, namely Mr Aqua stuff. However, even Mr. Aqua stuff is hard to sell competitively on the east coast because of shipping costs from CA. At least it's more reasonably priced.

I have ADA 60P + 602 AquaSky/anthracite cabinet and instead of ADA aquasoil I put mr aqua shrimp sand. From my personal testing, mr aqua shrimp sand leaches less into the water and provides for a more sterile/stable/predictable setup, while retaining its structure very well. I've had the shrimp sand in a tank for 2+ years, then after breaking down the tank, the granules were still intact. There are also people that swear by ADA aquasoil and that's cool too. That's why I sold ADA aquasoil in the past. In my mind success depends on the user's ability to understand what they're working with and what they prefer. That's why some people can thrive with miracle gro and stuff like that or local garden soil. It's because they know what they're working with and are making it work.

I'm not sure if Han has an actual store, in that he has a sales/use tax id or if he imports stuff and just resells off the books. I think "lighter weight" operations are a good way to meet growing specific demands because it's really nuts for any "retail" store to be able to carry everything someone would look for. I'd rather have more diverse options! I look down at stores that try to squash hobbyist operations. Extreme enthusiasts are what keep this hobby growing, sharing their passions with others whether it's for profit or simply enjoyment. When all a store cares about is profit margins, that's when newcomers to the hobby lose, burnt out by what they believed to be a trustworthy source. I've met Han before and I think he's a super nice and great guy. He knows what he's doing and is willing to teach others. That's all I would look for when buying from anyone.

I'm not trying to plug any brand over one another here but just trying to explain how I see ADA availability and why things are the way they are. I have bags of mr aqua shrimp sand and mr aqua black aqua soil if you're interested, located in Natick.
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post #7 of 11 (permalink) Old 08-10-2015, 03:34 AM
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1 bag of Mr Aqua shrimp sand covers a volume of about 12" x 12" x 1", I sell it for $20 (same as amazon the last I checked)

I use RODI, seachem flourish tabs, and some CO2 and can grow a nice dwarf baby tear carpet. I then went "low-tech" with just RODI water changes, no more CO2 / tabs and have been growing anubias nana quite well as well as marimo moss balls. The dwarf baby tears lasted but didn't flourish. It's definitely more inert than most substrates so you'll typically want to dose stuff like flourish tabs. I'm more focused on shrimp than plants so I don't add much. I like more inert substrates in which I add stuff, so this is what I like the most. I just add RODI to mr aqua shrimp sand, put in some seiryu rock, throw on a light, add a sponge filter and my shrimp seem to be very happy.

their alternative product, aqua sand, are $40 per bag and have more volume than the shrimp sand bags. It's probably about twice as much, so the same volume / $. I have not personally used it before, but the reviews from barr report etc have been good. I ordered some in because someone told me they wanted some, but then they never came to get it.
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post #8 of 11 (permalink) Old 08-10-2015, 01:19 PM
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Hope it wasn't me :)

Anthony,
I hope it wasn't me who asked you for the aquasand if so let me know
Victor
Quote:
Originally Posted by aquaful View Post
1 bag of Mr Aqua shrimp sand covers a volume of about 12" x 12" x 1", I sell it for $20 (same as amazon the last I checked)

I use RODI, seachem flourish tabs, and some CO2 and can grow a nice dwarf baby tear carpet. I then went "low-tech" with just RODI water changes, no more CO2 / tabs and have been growing anubias nana quite well as well as marimo moss balls. The dwarf baby tears lasted but didn't flourish. It's definitely more inert than most substrates so you'll typically want to dose stuff like flourish tabs. I'm more focused on shrimp than plants so I don't add much. I like more inert substrates in which I add stuff, so this is what I like the most. I just add RODI to mr aqua shrimp sand, put in some seiryu rock, throw on a light, add a sponge filter and my shrimp seem to be very happy.

their alternative product, aqua sand, are $40 per bag and have more volume than the shrimp sand bags. It's probably about twice as much, so the same volume / $. I have not personally used it before, but the reviews from barr report etc have been good. I ordered some in because someone told me they wanted some, but then they never came to get it.
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post #9 of 11 (permalink) Old 08-11-2015, 04:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SBPyro View Post
Anthony,
I hope it wasn't me who asked you for the aquasand if so let me know
Victor
no it wasn't you, but you're welcome to take it! lol
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post #10 of 11 (permalink) Old 08-17-2015, 10:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aquaful View Post
I think there are very few if any stores in MA that will carry ADA now.

After ADG gave up on ADA a couple years back, ADANA has a continued monopoly on the supply for ADA stuff now. It's pretty hard for an east coast store to be competitive because of shipping costs etc. It's often more financially sound for both the store and the consumer to buy it from ADANA directly. I believe ADG cut ties with ADA(NA) because they couldn't provide reasonable prices given the prices ADA(NA) was giving them. It's the same reason why I dropped ADA. I didn't think it made any sense for me to bring in ADA stuff, then sell it for the same price as ADANA, only to lose money. I'd have to raise prices just to break even, and since that's not fair to the customer, you might as well send the customer directly to ADANA right? Stuff like this is probably why an ADA-focused store shut down a few years back (I think it was in the NJ/NY area?)

That said, a few alternatives have come on to the scene to compete with ADA products, namely Mr Aqua stuff. However, even Mr. Aqua stuff is hard to sell competitively on the east coast because of shipping costs from CA. At least it's more reasonably priced.

I have ADA 60P + 602 AquaSky/anthracite cabinet and instead of ADA aquasoil I put mr aqua shrimp sand. From my personal testing, mr aqua shrimp sand leaches less into the water and provides for a more sterile/stable/predictable setup, while retaining its structure very well. I've had the shrimp sand in a tank for 2+ years, then after breaking down the tank, the granules were still intact. There are also people that swear by ADA aquasoil and that's cool too. That's why I sold ADA aquasoil in the past. In my mind success depends on the user's ability to understand what they're working with and what they prefer. That's why some people can thrive with miracle gro and stuff like that or local garden soil. It's because they know what they're working with and are making it work.

I'm not sure if Han has an actual store, in that he has a sales/use tax id or if he imports stuff and just resells off the books. I think "lighter weight" operations are a good way to meet growing specific demands because it's really nuts for any "retail" store to be able to carry everything someone would look for. I'd rather have more diverse options! I look down at stores that try to squash hobbyist operations. Extreme enthusiasts are what keep this hobby growing, sharing their passions with others whether it's for profit or simply enjoyment. When all a store cares about is profit margins, that's when newcomers to the hobby lose, burnt out by what they believed to be a trustworthy source. I've met Han before and I think he's a super nice and great guy. He knows what he's doing and is willing to teach others. That's all I would look for when buying from anyone.

I'm not trying to plug any brand over one another here but just trying to explain how I see ADA availability and why things are the way they are. I have bags of mr aqua shrimp sand and mr aqua black aqua soil if you're interested, located in Natick.
This is not true. ADA tightly controls the prices of its products in each country. I don't know about the freighting cost, but yeah it's going to cost more to get something from Japan to the East Coast. I don't exactly see how ADA would be at fault for that. And Aqua Forest Aquariums isn't the only ADA distributor, there's Aquatic Garden:
http://aquatic-garden.com/
They sell everything except stands, tanks larger than 60P, and T5/MH lights. If you're still interested in selling ADA, I might contact them because you'll pay much less for shipping.


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post #11 of 11 (permalink) Old 08-18-2015, 02:17 AM
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All I am relaying is the most likely reason for few stores to carry ADA on the east coast. I'm not blaming ADA for anything. Every business / entity makes their choices and they are entitled to do what they want.

I tried to date my post by mentioning "a couple years back" so yes there may have been new distributors that have popped up since ADG gave up.

ADG received their product from ADANA so.. maybe ADA changed their model to work directly with other wholesalers? I'm not up to date on this part.

I think there's another point that has been glossed over. ADANA -and- this new distributor, aquatic garden, do direct sales as a wholesaler which means that the retailer ultimately can't compete. The retailer is going to pay some price that's more than the wholesaler, both in item cost and in shipping cost. The wholesaler typically does not sell at cost to a retailer.

So even though there's a new distributor, the model is still broken. In my opinion a retailer's job is to connect customers to products either directly or indirectly. Why not just send customers to the wholesaler directly? Make 10% which becomes 2% or less after credit card fees and freight plus take in inventory risk? Or charge more to claim some margin that works? What about the consumer? Why not just have them order online and then the customer can skip out on tax? Some distributors that sell direct also offer free shipping. A retailer can't do that. The numbers don't make sense.

I'm not sure it works. Maybe you know something I don't? What's your background? How do you know what ADA does in terms of price control? Have you seen the licensing agreements? I'm confused.

Just for clarification, I've never said ADA is at fault for anything, I said ADANA's pricing makes it hard to compete with ADANA itself. For all intents and purposes my understanding is that ADANA is AFA. Maybe I used the wrong names, but they lead back to the same people whenever I reached out. ADA itself is in Japan.

I'm not trying to have an argument but I am trying to educate the public. I don't think it makes sense to hold your breath for a store to carry ADA. At least I don't expect good local pricing in the NE area with the way the network is set up.

If you can find a way to make it work in this ecosystem then likely something has fundamentally changed in their wholesale model.

Some manufacturers only use distributors which don't sell direct. These are a retailer's best friend. Some manufacturers sell direct, hard for a retailer or distributor to compete. Some distributors sell direct, hard for a retailer to compete. Everyone has their reasons to do what they do but it ultimately affects the consumer chain. There's nothing wrong with any of these choices, it just drives retailers to make different choices since they're in the worst position of the chain.

I'm not sure what you're trying to communicate by quoting my entire post and saying "this is not true". You're misinforming people

Bump: P.S. "Aquatic Garden" isn't listed as a distributor

http://www.adana.co.jp/en/contents/distributors/country/id_138.html

Aquatic Garden's phone number matches Aquatic Nursery's phone number, whose NJ address on the ADA distributor site doesn't match their Facebook page's Florida address.

Do your research people.
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