Some new plants melting in new ada aquasoil setup - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #1 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-22-2020, 12:33 PM Thread Starter
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Some new plants melting in new ada aquasoil setup

Hi all,
I changed from regular aquarium gravel, which leached high amounts of calcium, to ADA amazonia 2.5 weeks ago. I currently have some issues with my Glossostigma elatinoides, staurogyne repens and ludwegia mini super red which all seem to be melting away. I have these plants about 2 weeks now with all other plants from my old tank doing good, besides some green spot algae on leaves and driftwood, which however is improving and i think it was due to the high ammonia. I currently have no fish yet in the tank except some baby fish which to my surprise must have been eggs on some of the plants from my previous set up, and even survived the 4ppm ammonia throughout the last few weeks. They are doing great and growing, but too small to add my other fish.
I have pressurised co2, ph controled, with my ph being about 6.8 with no co2 and 6.05 at all other times, day and night.
My tank is 290 litres with surface skimmer, external cannister filter, powerhead above the co2 diffuser, 2 120cm led lights, one 45 one 49 watts, dont know the other specs, one came with tank the other is designed for plant growth, aquaone plantgrow. Substrate ADA amazonia
My water parameters:
Gh= 8, normally 4-5 but added seachem equilibrium
Kh = 3
Ammonia= 0
Nitrite= 0
Nitrate = 20-40, strong orange colour but not red
Phosphate= 0.5-1.0, kind of confusing as my previous setup always had 5ppm using the same fert, maybe absorbed by the ADA amazonia ?
Calcium= 40ppm
Ferts are LCA all in one dry fertilizer mixed in bottled water.
Dosing 3 a week 30ml with 12ml in 100 litres of water resulting in 0.5ppm iron, 7.5 nitrate, 1.3 phosphate, potassium, 5.27 and small amounts of mag, zinc, copper, manganese, boron and molybdenum.
Please see photos attached.
Since changing the substrate, I know it hasn't been long, no more curled leaves on stem plants due to high calcium all other plants doing good.
What could be the reason for these new plants melting? Should I give them more time? Not sure if they were grown emersed or not. Also will the algae on the driftwood disapear eventually? The GSA on the Amazon sword is becoming less but my annubis are suffering and coated.
Any help appreciated!
Pascal
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post #2 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-22-2020, 02:35 PM
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Were these tissue culture by any chance?

Most plants are grown emersed (out of water with only the roots submerged). When they get put in our aquariums they have to transition to "submersed" growth. Its pretty common to have significant die back while this is going on. Look for new growth within the first 2 weeks. If you see new growth happening then you are good. If not then there is another issue at play.


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post #3 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-22-2020, 03:10 PM
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If the plants are new and were tissue-cultured or grown emersed, as @minorhero mentioned, that could be part of the problem.

But I'm betting it's also because of the switch to a buffering substrate. It's constantly absorbing (for lack of a better term at the moment) kH and releasing little bits and pieces of nutrients here and there in ways your previous substrate did not. Your plants will slowly adapt to their new environment but it may take some time.

Speaking of the prior substrate - was it crushed coral or something typically used in Cichlid tanks or marine environments?


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post #4 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-23-2020, 01:02 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by minorhero View Post
Were these tissue culture by any chance?

Most plants are grown emersed (out of water with only the roots submerged). When they get put in our aquariums they have to transition to "submersed" growth. Its pretty common to have significant die back while this is going on. Look for new growth within the first 2 weeks. If you see new growth happening then you are good. If not then there is another issue at play.
Thank you for your reply!
They weren't tissue cultures and I am not sure if they were grown emersed or not. Is it normal for the melting to happen so quickly though? I took the pictures last night, this morning one plant is gone completely the others look like they will be gone by the end of the day The ludwegia mini super red keeps rotting from the bottom stem. I took the photos just then, see the difference from last night.
Pascal
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post #5 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-23-2020, 01:10 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by somewhatshocked View Post
If the plants are new and were tissue-cultured or grown emersed, as @minorhero mentioned, that could be part of the problem.

But I'm betting it's also because of the switch to a buffering substrate. It's constantly absorbing (for lack of a better term at the moment) kH and releasing little bits and pieces of nutrients here and there in ways your previous substrate did not. Your plants will slowly adapt to their new environment but it may take some time.

Speaking of the prior substrate - was it crushed coral or something typically used in Cichlid tanks or marine environments?
Thanks for your reply! As I mentioned above I am not sure how the plants were grown I ordered them online from an aquarium gallery. My old plants seem to do great with the new substrate with only the new ones melting away extremly quickly now.
The old substrate was an aquarium gravel I bought in a petstore 7 years ago. When I put them in vinegar the rocks would start fizzing like crazy and within 48 hours dissolve completely. My gh would also go up to 12 from my tap water gh being 4-5. See picture below of the substrate.
Cheers, Pascal
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post #6 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-25-2020, 07:25 PM
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Does no one read the instruction booklet in the freaking soil? Do water changes. Every day for 3 days, every other day for the next 7 and then every 3 days for the next 7 and weekly thereafter.

Read the booklet, follow this guide: https://www.adana.co.jp/en/contents/process/index.html
be successful.

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post #7 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-28-2020, 02:06 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffww View Post
Does no one read the instruction booklet in the freaking soil? Do water changes. Every day for 3 days, every other day for the next 7 and then every 3 days for the next 7 and weekly thereafter.

Read the booklet, follow this guide: https://www.adana.co.jp/en/contents/process/index.html
be successful.
I don't see how you can assume from this post that I havent read the instructions and how many water changes I did and currently do. Like I mentioned, the ammonia is at 0 now, only took 1.5 weeks after frequent water changes. Anyway, my staurogyen repens, have unfortunately disappeared now, some green but melting leaves still hanging on but no sign of recovery.
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post #8 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-28-2020, 04:20 AM
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Okay but did you actually do 50% water changes every time, especially the day right after set up? This melting is characteristic of not doing water changes with fresh aqua soil. The fact you have 20-40 nitrates tells me you do not do enough water changes. As nitrate that high should not be happening if you are doing them as instructed.

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post #9 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-28-2020, 05:15 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffww View Post
Okay but did you actually do 50% water changes every time, especially the day right after set up? This melting is characteristic of not doing water changes with fresh aqua soil. The fact you have 20-40 nitrates tells me you do not do enough water changes. As nitrate that high should not be happening if you are doing them as instructed.
Hey, yes i did every day for 3 days, then every second for the following week. This is my first week I am back to my old weekly schedule. Isnt it normal though due to the high nitrates in the soil? Plus fert dosing. In my last setup I had nitrites up to 50ppm never experienced this. I think my ludwegia mini super red is surviving now, its just the repens. In the picture you can see the plants nearly all gone in the upper path in the middle.
Cheers.
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post #10 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-28-2020, 05:26 AM
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You may have an irregular batch of aquasoil if this is the case. I think it has happened to people before. I apologize for not considering this possibility. Often times people will start an AS tank and ignore the instructions to disasterous result. I would just continue water change until you can get down to 10ppm or so nitrates. The plants that melted away are probably done for because of ammonia burn. However the ones with solid stems should make it if you do more water change. I would also replant new plants to reduce your risk of algae.

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post #11 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-28-2020, 07:42 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffww View Post
You may have an irregular batch of aquasoil if this is the case. I think it has happened to people before. I apologize for not considering this possibility. Often times people will start an AS tank and ignore the instructions to disasterous result. I would just continue water change until you can get down to 10ppm or so nitrates. The plants that melted away are probably done for because of ammonia burn. However the ones with solid stems should make it if you do more water change. I would also replant new plants to reduce your risk of algae.
That's okay, I appreciate your input! Isnt it normal though for ada aquasoil to be loaded with nitrates and other nutrients, hence the high reading. Plus my dry ferts, all in one, are pretty high in nitrates too, but after long research it is still okay to dose with the soil even in the beginning. I think there are many tanks with 50+ nitrates but as long as you do 50% water changes it should be ok. I guess i won't find out whats happend to the plants, the ammomia was already at 0 when I added them or close to anyway.
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