ID parasite, bacteria, injury - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #1 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-07-2016, 06:53 PM Thread Starter
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ID parasite, bacteria, injury

Help me id so i can treat. Fish does not seem too affected by it, eating and normal appetite.

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post #2 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-07-2016, 07:17 PM
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Since it is not identified, yet, I would start with some extra water changes, and rinse out the filter media. The less debris in the system, the better. This will remove microorganisms that drift in the water, so there are fewer to re-infect the fish, and remove organic matter that any medication might stick to, so any medications can target the injured area.
If there are no Anabantoids in the tank I would add Melafix and Pimafix to the tank. These are good on external issues. These do not enter the fish's body to attack internal problems, though. If it does not start looking better pretty fast (few days) then switch to stronger meds.

I think you are asking about the red area at the bottom of the operculum and perhaps red abdomen? I have seen some Phantoms with a blush of red in this area. Is this color new?
Hard to see if either area is swollen.

The red area of the operculum could be an injury. Often, in chasing and being chased the fish may bump into something, or else another fish may nip. This is an odd area for a nip, though. If it is an injury, then clean water may be all that is needed to help the fish heal.

The red abdomen looks more like something internal, just under the skin, such as bacterial infection. (If it is not the normal color of the fish). If this is part of the problem, then internal antibiotics may be needed to fix it.
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post #3 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-07-2016, 07:22 PM Thread Starter
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The fish was fine until i started chasing my siamese algae eaters, suspect it bumped into something and then it got infected. It's hard to see in this picture but the red area is like an egg like object sticking out a little. I had not seen the red abdomen until i took this picture. I have furanol for internal and external bacterial infections but i don't want to treat until i'm sure. If i treat i will probably put this fish in quarantine, the other fish does not seem affected.

Bump: The object (red thing under head) is about the size of a 4.5mm bb but more egg shaped.
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post #4 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-07-2016, 07:30 PM
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Treating in a hospital tank is a good idea.
How long has this been on this fish? Is it getting bigger? An injury ought to clear up pretty fast, especially with clean water. If it is not significantly better just a few days after getting injured, or it is continuing to get worse, spreading, more red, then move the fish and treat.
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post #5 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-07-2016, 07:33 PM Thread Starter
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About a week or 1.5 weeks, it got worse the first day or so but has not changed since but also not been getting better. Thought it might be a parasite or a tumor but that was just a guess.

Didnt want to stress the fish but i actually took it up to take a closer look, carefully poked with a pair of tweezers and this lump fell out. As of now, the fish seems fine. I hope it survives the night.

It is soft and squishy, i fear it might be an inner organ but the fish would have showed alot more stress by now right? Gall bladder and liver comes to mind, anatomically they are at the right place. Although the gills itself did not look damaged, but inflamed. Was hard to get a good look.

dropped the fish into the med-bay with furanol again. If it is fine by morning i might re-introduce it to the aquarium.

I still am unsure what it is, my guesses so far include inner organs, tumor, some sort of parasite, mucus or some sort of organic debris.



Last edited by Darkblade48; 05-09-2016 at 05:00 AM. Reason: Please use the edit function for back to back posts
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post #6 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-08-2016, 09:22 PM
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Crazy stuff!
So it was sticking outside of the gills?
When you pulled it out, was it attached via any artery or anything?

I'm thinking since it's already out and likely you won't be able to put it back in/reattach (if it is an organ), might as well dissect it. Is it hard?
Anything in the tank that bears resemblance that the fish could have swallowed that?

Did you just buy the fish with this growth? Or was the growth/object not there before and suddenly appeared? Or grew slowly or rapidly?
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post #7 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-08-2016, 09:23 PM
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As you suggest, an internal organ doing this (getting outside the fish, hanging there for over a week, then coming off with tweezers does not sound at all likely.

Tumor or some kind of growth is much more likely.

Keep up the medication for as long as the label says.
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post #8 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-08-2016, 09:37 PM Thread Starter
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it had the consistency of soft rubber, almost jelly. it was not connected to anything and it came off without force. The fish was fine until i chased my SAEs, it must've been scared and bumped into something. It still seems alright and unaffected so that's good. will see if it wants to eat tomorrow.
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post #9 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-09-2016, 05:38 AM
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This might seem oversimplified, but is there anything in the tank that looks like the object? My guess would be some kind of pellet food that just got lodged in the gills, or maybe fish poop that it tried to eat?
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post #10 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-09-2016, 10:19 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrynnaCC View Post
This might seem oversimplified, but is there anything in the tank that looks like the object? My guess would be some kind of pellet food that just got lodged in the gills, or maybe fish poop that it tried to eat?
Was thinking this too but can't think of anything like this in the tank. Sometimes there are hard lumps in the flake food though, maybe it got lodged. Fish is still alive as of now, does not have any appetite though.
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post #11 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-11-2016, 09:32 AM Thread Starter
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Yesterday when i woke up the fish had no caudal fin. Not sure what is going on. Fish still alive though, if it gets worse im gonna put it to sleep. Don't want it to suffer
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post #12 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-11-2016, 10:21 AM
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I would have liked to know what it looks like under a microscope. Would be easy to see if the mass was tissue off some kind I think. I think a microscope is something on my list of items I would like to purchase and this thread has me even more convinced.

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post #13 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-11-2016, 10:24 AM
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Caudal fin is the tail fin. The whole tail was gone (chunk of flesh missing/exposed)? Or just the fin rays gone?

Anything (fish, crayfish, etc) that could have ripped/cut it off?
Look weak swimming on got caught on the filter intake or something like that?
Or does it look infected, like rotting flesh or fungal growth?

Never heard of organs being expelled out, so I doubt the object was a organ. I haven't seen/heard of everything though! (actually may have heard of one or two cases, but extremely rare and none of any object this large). Dissecting the object may have shown what the center of it looked like to better ID it.

No parasite I know of would tear down a tail fin overnight.
Rotting flesh from a disease would normally progress fairly slowly.
So I am thinking something larger would have caused the tail damage.

Besides the tail, how's the fish doing? Eating, still colorful and active? Any other signs of deteriorating health?
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post #14 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-11-2016, 10:45 AM Thread Starter
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The fish does not eat, it's swimming alright even though no fin. I have a wavemaker but i doubt it would got sucked into it. Other fish nipping on it because it was weak? I got rams in the tank, but they are usually not agressive. The tail is a little bit white on the edge, a little ragged, but there is no fin whatsoever, looks like the tissue that holds the fin is still there though. hard to see because i have it in a bucket atm

Bump: The best pictures i could get without taking it out.



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post #15 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-22-2016, 05:42 PM Thread Starter
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Just wanted to give you an update. Fish is alive and well! tail is starting to grow back nicely and it was very happy to be reintroduced to the big tank after living in a bucket for some time Fish 1 cancer 0, sorry for picture quality but the fish likes moving

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