5730 SMD help. - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #1 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-12-2016, 04:47 PM Thread Starter
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5730 SMD help.

I have some of these and some cheapo 5730 SMD's to try this with.
First attempt at SMD stuff. So if anyone has worked with these I sure could use some help.

1. From what I can see as a notch to determine polarity, when I put it on the PCB the silkscreening is mirrored. That is instead of lining up with the notch it is flipped. I assumed that since the contact runs all the way across, this is just a silkscreen issue?

2. Do I need to put solder on the middle pad?

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post #2 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-12-2016, 06:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ichy View Post
I have some of these and some cheapo 5730 SMD's to try this with.
First attempt at SMD stuff. So if anyone has worked with these I sure could use some help.

1. From what I can see as a notch to determine polarity, when I put it on the PCB the silkscreening is mirrored. That is instead of lining up with the notch it is flipped. I assumed that since the contact runs all the way across, this is just a silkscreen issue?

2. Do I need to put solder on the middle pad?
2) No a bit of thermal paste or adhesive..
attach all first (I'd use heatsink plaster or some such glue)

1) Won't matter as long as all are in the correct direction.
Glue them down first and test.
Testing which is which w/ continuity and a VOM is easy enough..

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post #3 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-12-2016, 06:37 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks, so that is just for heat?

ya I gotta figure that out because the notch is so poorly done on these cheapos!

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post #4 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-12-2016, 06:50 PM
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Thanks, so that is just for heat?
Yes. you can verify to see if the center pad is electrically isolated..
plus to center ect..
It "should" be...

you do know that if you populate the entire board you need 90V DC or better?

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post #5 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-12-2016, 06:59 PM
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Can you post the link to that PCB board?


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post #6 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-12-2016, 07:28 PM Thread Starter
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Can you post the link to that PCB board?
Ebay item # 321445686962

if you search 5730 PCB you can find all sizes.

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post #7 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-12-2016, 08:40 PM
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Those PCB's look kind of neat, I may have to order a few to try em out.

1. In terms of the PCB, you should be able to trace the copper conductive pathway to double check the orientation. Could be the silkscreen is screwed up. I think with SMD 5xxx series LED's the thermal pad is connected either the anode, so check the datasheet of the LED's you are looking to use to confirm and check the PCB with voltmeter (conductivity setting) to check this connection. Likely you are right, the issue is probably cosmetic, but hard to tell without a voltmeter.

2. YES, your intuition is correct. Thermal pads need to be soldered down. Use thermal paste or solder flux to help you get the job done. Typically thermal pads need at least 50% solder connection in order to be considered viable. Unlike a computer CPU, most microelectronic components rely on their metal solder connections for everything.

~600 to 700 F (?) is typically the temp I solder at

A. Apply flux (small amount)
B. Dot some solder on each pad, coating the pad in a thin layer of solder (smooth and even)
C. Apply more flux (small amount)
D. Apply some solder to the tip of the soldering iron ("tin the tip")
E. Place the LED down and head the pad up from the side. The Thermal pad should heat up with the anode, as they should be connected. They should both solder down together. Get practice with the first few until you feel comfortable with what you are doing, have a magnifier glass near by to check your work. The best solder is the one that was just long enough to heat up the pad to melt the solder and 'glue' the metal contacts together, but not too much as to damage the LED or other electronic component.


Additional notes:
-Solder and solder flux when heated can release unsafe chemicals into the air. Do not solder in a confined room without air filtration or without ventilation. If you are female, take extra precautions, as many of these chemicals can harm reproductive health.
-I recommend lead free solder ("silver solder"), but the PCB's could come with lead on them and you wouldn't know (this is made in china after all, save 2 cents)


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Last edited by Cmeister; 01-12-2016 at 08:57 PM. Reason: Additional notes
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post #8 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-12-2016, 10:01 PM
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Quote:
I think with SMD 5xxx series LED's the thermal pad is connected either the anode
No..

Center pad is just thermal.. no need to solder it there..except for heat transfer. If flat enough paste will work fine..
http://www.lumileds.com/uploads/351/DS201-pdf

Quote:
1.5
Electrical Isolation
The thermal pad of the LUXEON Mid-Power 5630 emitter is electrically isolated from the cathodes and anode.
http://www.lumileds.com/uploads/353/AB201-pdf

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...8FNmpg&cad=rja


You can screw up by 30%..
Quote:
Whereas in internal studies and simulations OSRAM Opto Semiconductors determined a
maximum up to 30% of voids in the thermal pad which have only a minor effect on the thermal
resistance. The limit of the acceptable voiding can vary for each application and depends on
the power dissipation and the total thermal performance of the system

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Last edited by jeffkrol; 01-12-2016 at 10:14 PM. Reason: edit
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post #9 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-12-2016, 11:08 PM Thread Starter
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The notch in the silkscreen denotes - as should be. I just have to figure out the - in the 5730 itself. I'll throw them on a Multimeter tomorrow and figure it out. Next to figure out is a power supply.

I put the electrical aside and went something more concrete...millling...lol...cut a heat sink. Doubt if it needs it, but I wanted to see what my new XCarve machine would do. Took a long time but it handled 3/8 aluminum.

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Last edited by ichy; 11-02-2016 at 12:29 AM.
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post #10 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-13-2016, 11:21 PM
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Thought of your power supply issue.
I think 5730 is designed to operate @ 150mA.
A 16watt CFL ballast is rated @ 270mA output.
If you tap only the rectifier circuit on the board it is 180VDC.
You could use it to power 4 discs, 2 series sets in parallel.
Only 135mA but close to 150.

I have re-purposed these ballasts for similar projects.
If it works well you can remove the unused components from the ballast.


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post #11 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-14-2016, 03:57 AM
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If someone who is not experienced in working with components this tiny, soldering them and wiring them, I suggest not assuming you can do this too. It takes some time, practice, and knowledge to do this so it works. For example, I can do regular soldering, or connecting circuit boards to some components, but soldering these tiny LEDs is way beyond my abilities. And, while I understand a lot of electronics, I would hesitate a long time before tearing into a CFL bulb to get a working ballast, then using a portion of it as a LED power supply. I greatly admire those who have the experience and knowledge to do this - I just accept that I'm not in that group.

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post #12 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-14-2016, 03:21 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoppy View Post
If someone who is not experienced in working with components this tiny, soldering them and wiring them, I suggest not assuming you can do this too. It takes some time, practice, and knowledge to do this so it works. For example, I can do regular soldering, or connecting circuit boards to some components, but soldering these tiny LEDs is way beyond my abilities. And, while I understand a lot of electronics, I would hesitate a long time before tearing into a CFL bulb to get a working ballast, then using a portion of it as a LED power supply. I greatly admire those who have the experience and knowledge to do this - I just accept that I'm not in that group.
Hoppy,
I'm going to partially rock your world...the LED SMD stuff is MUCH EASIER than soldering!!!

Use this to put a little tab of solder on each pad
http://www.amazon.com/MG-Chemicals-4900P-25G-Solder-Silver/dp/B00XYB73MU/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1452788098&sr=8-4&keywords=solder+paste
Put a little thermal paste on the heat pad. Populate your PCB paying strict attention to polarity.
Gently put it on a hot plate and heat it up until you magically watch the solder melt, turn a nice shiny silver and get sucked right onto the pad! DONE! Works like a charm!

Then the only hard part is tired old eyes finding the notch in the case to determine polarity.

The power supply, ya, you better know what you are doing in there.

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post #13 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-14-2016, 09:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ichy View Post

Put a little thermal paste on the heat pad. Populate your PCB paying strict attention to polarity.
Gently put it on a hot plate and heat it up until you magically watch the solder melt, turn a nice shiny silver and get sucked right onto the pad! DONE! Works like a charm!
Very cool, I haven't had the chance to try hot plate type soldering. I'm curious as to try hot air type soldering though.


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post #14 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-14-2016, 10:00 PM
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Just for fun:
How compact fluorescent lamps work--and how to dim them | EE Times


Anyways:
http://www.inventronics-co.com/uploa...4404673411.PDF
http://www.powergatellc.com/pdfs/LCM-40DA-DRIVER.pdf

https://kutop.com/meawell-lcm-40da-m...FQyFaQodWY8Geg

3 in parallel.. 117mA per puck..

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Last edited by jeffkrol; 01-14-2016 at 10:21 PM. Reason: edit
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post #15 of 29 (permalink) Old 01-14-2016, 10:51 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Cmeister View Post
Very cool, I haven't had the chance to try hot plate type soldering. I'm curious as to try hot air type soldering though.
I have a hot air SMD station as well. Its tough....
1. If you have a heat sink, you spend a LOT of time getting it hot.
2. You can mess up the silkscreen and flux pretty easy.
3. You blow the parts off a lot!
Now granted I'm really a rookie, but the hot plate is 100% easier.

Bump: Dang, my desktop DC power supply only goes up to 24v. I populated a couple but don't have anything over 24 volts to test them.

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