Help in manually dimming ldd - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #1 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-02-2016, 05:57 PM Thread Starter
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Help in manually dimming ldd

Hi,[censored]

I have been working on a DIY lightning.

I almost finished but no matter what i do i cant seem to make it dimm.


This is the working lightning

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It is based on Cree leds powered by meanwell Ldd drivers.

The architacture is as following:
48V 200W PSU that is connected via a pcb to all the ldd drivers.
the leds are connected to each driver in a row, Sets of 8-12 leds each.

MEANWELL LDD specs:[censored]
https://www.google.co.il/url?sa=t&so...V_Vnb9VYS-DaIg


Well as i said it is working but does not dimm a thing.

I tried severel dimmers and nothing, they all just act as switches on or off, no dimming.

this is my wiring diagram:
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this is the dimmer:
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and the diagrames that came with it
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i marked how i wired the dimmer:
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the power + and - are from a 5V transformer.

the PWM+ is connected to the right [censored]PWM input, circled in red as i showed on the picture below

of course i tried it on a single driver: [censored] [censored]driver 2 and input PWM 2, driver 3 and PWM input 3 and so on....


The negetive PWM from the dimmer(stated GND) is connected to the negetive pwm on the PCB(circled in black),

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from my understanding i could have also connect it to one of the other negetives on his left(tried that also did not work).

As i said no dimming.
tried a different dimmer:
[Ebay Link Removed] 5V 6V 12V 2A DC Motor PWM Speed Control Controller Speed Switch LED Dimmer FAN[/url]

same thing[censored]

I have been stuck with that issue for a long time.

I would REALLY REALLY appreciate if some one couled figure out what the F**k am i doing wrong!



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post #2 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-02-2016, 06:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shoeyal View Post
As i said no dimming.
tried a different dimmer:
[Ebay Link Removed] 5V 6V 12V 2A DC Motor PWM Speed Control Controller Speed Switch LED Dimmer FAN[/url]

same thing[censored]

I have been stuck with that issue for a long time.

I would REALLY REALLY appreciate if some one couled figure out what the F**k am i doing wrong!

ONE MORE test.. Use the 5V but check the "output" channel (same terminal block as the input.. IF 5V just run the pos side to the LDD. Bridge the grounds of the 2 ps.
until see some specs your PWM output on that is probably unusable for LDD's

I'M taking no responsibility for letting any magic smoke out..



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That is a strip light dimmer.. "Technically" w/ the 5 V in it should work OK (never tried it) but there may be some issues here .. The "type" I'm familiar w/ is this:



Which taps off the MOSFET (added wire inside, on yours probably the gate of Q1 (by r3 most likekly..)
IF you add a wire to that and run it to the LDD PWM out, remove the "ground" to the LDD, Ground the 2 ps together (switch to 9V or so, low amps)
you should be good to go..



You can try removing the ground from yours to the LDD but connect the grounds bhind the unit to the 2 power supplies..but not guaranteeing it..
You can stick a VOM between your 2 output wires and seeing if it is at 5V. Then dim. most meters will average and it will appear to drop in voltage (but not really, just changes on/off time..)

Next possible complication is the PWM output is not in the Hz range of the LDD (most are)

NOTE above, due to the extra wire the "output" of the dimmer is never used..though it would be "possible" to skip the wire and just use a 5v ps like you did. Never had one to test..

The internals usually have a voltage regulator to drop the "input" to logic level 5V or so (3.3 whatever, depends)

your dimmer doen't show it will work at less than 12v (probably a lie but 5V may be too low)

Another solution was getting a 12V output "step down" voltage regulator, adding it to the 48V line, feeding to the dimmer and, using the same 1 wire addition.. attaching to the LDD..

different controller, same principal:
https://www.plantedtank.net/forums/20...drivers-3.html

Oh I'm also guessing your "output" you are using is supposed to be 10VPWM (more industry standard than 5V).. Need better specs on dimmer..

Motor speed controls generally use a higher Hz frequency than LDD's (in the MHz range)

More I look at it the more likely the PWM side is 10v PWM..

WELL (and you owe me IF this is the same thing)
Looks like you do have 5V PWM (freq. unknown) IF it is like this one..

In which case change your feed power to 12V (try a 9V battery, should work)
If that doesn't work the neg to the LDD needs to be removed and ps neg bridged b4 the unit..



http://light.co.nz/products/led-dimm...with-ir-remote

Got to admit a bit confusing..



Lot of wasted writing here..
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Last edited by jeffkrol; 12-02-2016 at 07:16 PM. Reason: edit
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post #3 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-02-2016, 08:36 PM
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Where you label v-out in the dimmer is actually ground.


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post #4 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-02-2016, 09:36 PM Thread Starter
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Well that's a lot of information to handle.

So I try to start with step 1.

After looking at your diagram I understood that u connected the ground before the dimmer do I need to change it l like that?

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Another question:
u suggested try connecting the dimmer to 12v or 9v ps.

I thought ldd only accepts 2.5-6v pwm signal.
How can it work with a 12v?

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post #5 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-02-2016, 09:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shoeyal View Post
Well that's a lot of information to handle.

So I try to start with step 1.

After looking at your diagram I understood that u connected the ground before the dimmer do I need to change it l like that?

Attachment 696282

Another question:
u suggested try connecting the dimmer to 12v or 9v ps.

I thought ldd only accepts 2.5-6v pwm signal.
How can it work with a 12v?

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The dimmer has a voltage regulator inside..
Will drop the 12V to 5 (or 3.3V) for the chips and IR circuit (and PWM "out")..

First just try a 12V supply to the dimmer..

If that doesn't work we can see about the grounds..


IT is designed to output 12V to strip lights on the "other" output using the MOSFET (Q1) as a high speed switch..THAT will output the 12V to the other output (green arrows above)
The PWM output should be different (either 5V or 10V at full depending on design...)
IF like the other diagram I found it is 5V

If you are worried about the LED's or drivers take them off and just put a voltmeter on the PWM plus and minus.. W/ pot on full..Should be between 3.3-5V

NOTE: The size (mA) of the 12V ps is not crucial ..

"A man with a watch knows what time it is. A man with two watches is never sure."

Last edited by jeffkrol; 12-02-2016 at 10:01 PM. Reason: edit
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post #6 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-02-2016, 10:03 PM
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Pull out a multimeter and measure input and output voltage.


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post #7 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-05-2016, 10:29 AM Thread Starter
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It worked! You are awesome!!!

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And the the real deal(i only dimmed the two white light channels)

Minimum light
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Full white light
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Full light+ red blue purple
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I took the dimmer apart so I can attach it to the case I made
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post #8 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-05-2016, 12:54 PM
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Yea, glad you got it sorted out..Nice rocks btw..

"A man with a watch knows what time it is. A man with two watches is never sure."
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post #9 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-05-2016, 02:07 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks, made them myself out of cement for swimming pools.

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post #10 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-05-2016, 02:38 PM
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So what was the problem in the first place? A multimeter helps a lot.


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post #11 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-05-2016, 03:02 PM Thread Starter
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I was under the(wrong) impression that because the ldd accepts 5v pwm I need to use a 5v power source for the dimmer.

Jeffkrol told me that the power source should be 12v.



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post #12 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-05-2016, 03:36 PM
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Weird, maybe your original 5V power supply was really under 5V. You can never really tell until you measure the output.


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post #13 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-05-2016, 05:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mistergreen View Post
Weird, maybe your original 5V power supply was really under 5V. You can never really tell until you measure the output.
The LDD will pulse as low as 2.5V's ..
But the circuit he feeds the dimmer with goes right from 12V to a 5V voltage regulator (well one of the 2 branches, othr just being through the MOSFET). This powers the pulse generator and output to the MOSFET gate..

Powering w/ 5V-ish probably will not allow the regulator or pulse generator circuit to work correctly..
That is my, limited, feeling about this.

I've had these "types" work w/ as low as a 9V supply. May just need a voltage differential to work correctly, like most step down circuits..

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post #14 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-05-2016, 05:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffkrol View Post
The LDD will pulse as low as 2.5V's ..
But the circuit he feeds the dimmer with goes right from 12V to a 5V voltage regulator (well one of the 2 branches, othr just being through the MOSFET). This powers the pulse generator and output to the MOSFET gate..

Powering w/ 5V-ish probably will not allow the regulator or pulse generator circuit to work correctly..
That is my, limited, feeling about this.

I've had these "types" work w/ as low as a 9V supply. May just need a voltage differential to work correctly, like most step down circuits..
Oh, right. That's what the drop out voltage is. Usually, you can do V+2 -> V. So, a 9V to a 5V would work too. The higher the input voltage, the hotter the regulator will be.


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post #15 of 15 (permalink) Old 12-05-2016, 07:03 PM
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Originally Posted by mistergreen View Post
Oh, right. That's what the drop out voltage is. Usually, you can do V+2 -> V. So, a 9V to a 5V would work too. The higher the input voltage, the hotter the regulator will be.
Depends...both will be "hotter" but a matter of degrees..
Quote:
Voltage regulators come in 2 types:
  • Linear
  • Switching
Linear:
A linear voltage regulator converts your voltage by dissipating the remaining as heat. What this means is that in your application the heat dissipated is
(InputVoltage - OutputVoltage)* Current Supplied = (12-5) * 1 = 7W!!!!
Now that is a large amount of heat that you will need to dissipate, so you will definitely need a heatsink and good airflow in order not to burn your regulator.
Switching:
Now a switching regulator works by switching states, this is way more efficient and dissipates way less heat. A switching regulator is the best option when your current draw is high.
What I would recommend for your application is buying a readily available switching regulator PCB that has all the components already soldered, all you need to do is connect the input supply, test the output till you get 5V and power your usb device.

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