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post #1 of 9 (permalink) Old 09-24-2006, 07:59 PM Thread Starter
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submerged and emerged (56 K warning )

I've recently been attempting to emerge a sword / java moss its doing quite well and just starting to send out its emerged leaves

Also i have been working at submerging some mosses i discovered some submerged fiddisens as well as some emmerged fiddisens so il closely watching the mosses i have collected. I think there are about 7 different species at the moment i have only photograped a few as they are hard to get at.

submerged fiddisens sp

emerged fiddisens sp

more emerged mosses im trying to submerge



Just wondering if anyone else thinks this could be a hydorcoytle (sp) its every where at my cottage and to me it looks very similar? ant thoughts
reallly its EVERYWHERE!

runners look like this

leaf look like this

and the bud where the leaf forms looks like this


thanks for looking !


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post #2 of 9 (permalink) Old 09-24-2006, 09:20 PM
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The plant looks more like ground ivy than pennywort, but they are hard to distinguish from each other.

Are you having luck with the fissidens? I found moss that looks similar and it didn't do much at all.
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post #3 of 9 (permalink) Old 09-24-2006, 09:44 PM
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yes! another idiot like myself collecting mosses outside and seeing if they will grow in the aquaria!

some tips that i have figured out on collecting mosses + seeing if they will survive aquatically + storing them +other random stuff.

i have found that plastic zip-lock baggies are probably the best things to use, they take up little space when empty so you can take a lot of them and there are diffrerent sizes and shaps to fit your needs. i use the freezer samwich size and the gallon freezer ones usually.

it looks like you put them in a new tank but that isnt needed. moss needs VERY little to grow and will grow inside the baggies. what i normally do for emersed moss (dry,collected on the land) is put it in the baggy when i collect it. a day or two later add a small amount of water like a spray or two from a spray bottle right out of the main fish tank. then see how the moss goes. if it is living and or growing more! add more water. keep adding water untill you have the baggy filled with water and no or little air. the moss is living! it will at least live aquatically for a little while. i usually float the bags in my 55g tank so i get the light. i have a few baggies in the 55g and a bunch of dry moss going aquatic on the table next to it. the best part about the baggies is if the moss dies and turns to mush. there is no mess in the tank.

i have moss growing in the baggies and i change the water in them when i think of it. so it isnt very frequent.

i also collected some more emeresed moss over the weekend and some looked like a fisseden... i think it might be but we are both probably wrong and it probably isnt the normal ones we are used to but another one, or a whole new diff moss all together.

moss collecting is lots of fun!

glad to see someone else doing it!

as for the other plant... throw some in a 1g baggie and add a bunch of water. gradually or all at once. make it so there is no air in the bag and if it lives and grows. you have your answer if it will live or not!

good luck! and let me say thanks! for looking at new mosses!

- fish newb -
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post #4 of 9 (permalink) Old 09-24-2006, 11:17 PM Thread Starter
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hey im glad you have replied fresh newby im pretty sure where the same age and i find it interesting we have simmilar intrests! i thought about ziplock baggies but i find they become stagnant quickly! even the thank has a tad pondish smell much like the smell of an aquarium you keep tadpoles in but dont change water i like having them in a tank also because i can keep closer watch and fertilize directly im using lots of light and ferts to speed up the change form non aquatic to aquatic. also i have tried the baggie in the tank with some java moss i was selling and even half open the water became stagnant quickly.

being one of the ppl who will be biking along a path stop and go back i have become quite framilliar with mosses a nature interested venture leader also helped id this one as a split tooh mosss sp ( fisddisens ) im pretty sure where we were there were at least 2 different species but the fiddisens family is extremely large and difficult to id so most guides only have a common sp listed. thanks for the ideas and comments. i'd love to hear back !


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post #5 of 9 (permalink) Old 09-24-2006, 11:38 PM
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yeah i find it funny too, since i think we are the same age and both do the same things....

as for stagnent water moss doesnt care at all. it grows in stagnent water all the time, once a month or so i give a full waterchange but besides that the ones im quarenteening are all stagnent. on the other hand a week ago now i set up a moss tank in my gaurage, with just a home made mattenfilter style filter and 2ft shop light over the 28g rubbermade containor and have some other mosses that are growing in that. this seems to work well so far... but ill have to keep a close eye on them over the winter... i might need to bring them inside.

now looking back at the pics it does look like you have some fissedens, i would also check out the creeks and streems near where you live there should be some native willow mosses around which are the only true aquatic moss IDed by bryologists so far. which is cool.

i see where you are going with the whole fert light thing but if i where you i would wait like a week to make sure they dont just melt right away. or try using some type of containor for them to sit in inside the tank. im going to be making metal mesh baskets for my 28g so i can have lots of diffrent collected mosses in the same tank and hopefully keep them organized... (fat chance)

as for hikes and bike rides and stuff baggies are easy to carry and dont take up any room so you can keep samples seperate till you get home. that works well for me so far, im looking into getting small plastic containors to keep them at home, similer to what people in the dart frog hobby keep fruitflies in.

as my dad said to me,"there aren't any moss guides to New England why not write one yourself?" and i probably will try and fail at doing that lol, but it will be fun!

also if you havent already i would encourage you to get a 10g or a tank around that size and fill it with shrimp, any dwarf algea eating shrimp will do red cherry shrimp, snowball shrimp, blue shrimp, CRS, bumble bee shrimp. to have a tank you can put moss in to get it all cleaned off! im working on getting my 55g filled with shrimp and other algea eaters. on the other hand i wouldnt recomend "glass/ghost" shrimp since they dont really eat algea, also i wouldnt really recoment "amano" shrimp because they are known to eat moss when there isnt much algea around.

good luck with your project. i wonder who will get the most moss first. i counted my baggies and have around 4 in the 55g 9 next to it and 1 or two outside. lol.

- FISH NEWB -

oh and btw FRESH NEWBY and FISH NEWB are diffrent names... but this happens all the time lol.
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post #6 of 9 (permalink) Old 09-25-2006, 12:19 AM Thread Starter
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lol sorry about the name the moss might not mind the stench but i do there arent many local streams that would have anything growing in them as i live in the city althought i did find the fiddisens in a river / lake so there may have been other species of moss i just didint find. You seem to be quite the moss finatic! i think its the coolest type of plant deffinatly ! i wish i could try to sell mosses here but there isint much demand and being in canada theres so many rules and paper's needed to be signed for shipping ( not to mention costs ). I hope one day to have one of the overflow type plant tanks from stores filled with different mosses and carpet plants along with shrimp that i could breed/ propigate and sell ! good luck with your moss guide ! mabey you could visit a universety near where you live and try to see if they have any records of species then go out and collect some of your own and identfy and name some species for them? just as a start. i did a dragonfly program with the universety of guelph ( near me ) and collected and recorded species i caught they now use them for seminars school work ect. Its a neat experience you learn lots.

I like your shrimp idea i have a 20 gal rimless kicking around but am also saving up for a pressureized c02 system. Also i cant decide between attempting an ADA, south american biotope, african shellies, or moss / shrimp tank ! so ive got ideas on my mind, i just have to wait for them to all come in place.

The race is on ive found about mabey 30 species i could identify but havent really collected them. I even found dsome liverwort ( aka pellia) up in the haliburton area but unfourtinatly didint collect any. it was grat up there i found prbbly the 20 outta 30 species there as there was a small beaver dammed stream with just a trickle i have only one mosss stone from there though! good luck


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post #7 of 9 (permalink) Old 09-25-2006, 06:39 PM
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i believe i have found two native pellias. i live in the city too, now not a huge one with sky scrapers but i'm not in the country. moss is one of the oldest plants in the world. why? they grow places other things cant, and that includes drainage ditches gutters streams creeks ponds. basically anything wet, so you shouldn't have any problems.

as for the stench... thats why you dont open the bag alot =-p

i'll have to look into getting intoutch with the botnists/bryologists around here...

good luck. i would deffinatly go with a shrimp/ moss tank it is very rewarding!

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post #8 of 9 (permalink) Old 09-26-2006, 07:26 PM
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I have that same exact plant that you think might be hydrocortle growing wild all over by my place, too. It sure looks similar. I also think it's ground ivy.

Tommy

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post #9 of 9 (permalink) Old 09-26-2006, 09:57 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks by the way fish newb my fidisens seem to be forming a goop around them i can remove it and its not slimy. Im just wondering if youve ever had this happen? thanks for the help! also it seems to only be affecting the submerged stuff ?


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