The Breeding Project: Dark Rams ( Update: + New EBR/GBR Pairs) - Page 11 - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #151 of 344 (permalink) Old 01-24-2020, 11:05 PM Thread Starter
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Excellent video of Ram fry development:

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post #152 of 344 (permalink) Old 01-26-2020, 12:57 AM Thread Starter
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I haven't updated this much because everyday is pretty much the same:
feed 4-5 very small feedings a day (1 feeding with new Life Spectrum fry growth, the others with BBS.)
50% water change.
Repeat.

They are starting to become more defined, where before they looked kinda like an amorphous tadpole, you can start to make out eyes, mouth, etc... and color.
There are more darks in here than I thought, possibly close to the 25% as would be expected with a dark/gold pair. How dark they will be as mature is the question.
Some have died in last 5 days. There looks to be about 50 fry ? It looks like have lost about 20. These were probably the weaker individuals, which appears normal.
I ordered some golden pearls to add to their diet from Brine Shrimp Direct as recommended by Tom.

Anyways, here is a video, you can see me going in and out trying to get these little guys in focus. Its tough.



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post #153 of 344 (permalink) Old 01-26-2020, 05:54 AM
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Great success so far and so cool to see that many. Can't wait to see them grow more and start to color up.
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post #154 of 344 (permalink) Old 01-28-2020, 01:46 PM Thread Starter
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Great success so far and so cool to see that many. Can't wait to see them grow more and start to color up.
Thanks, Sue!
There have been some losses; but, Im thinking these are some of the weakest, genetically weak fish. I saw a dark ram swimming by itself yesterday that was substantially smaller than the other fry, but he did feed when I put food in the tank. Its swimming seemed strong, appeared alert. They really respond to me when I come to the front of the tank--- danger! danger- big blob coming uo ahead, lol!
I think that with this smaller ram, this is a good example of a situation where, if he/she were separated from the group, would probably do much better. Its amazing how quickly the healthy fish grow. They are about 16-18 days old now ( I lost count) and Id say they have doubled in size. The colors are very distinct between the golds and darks now. But, as I said earlier, wont know how dark the darker ones will be until mature.


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post #155 of 344 (permalink) Old 02-02-2020, 02:41 AM
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I haven't updated this much because everyday is pretty much the same:
feed 4-5 very small feedings a day (1 feeding with new Life Spectrum fry growth, the others with BBS.)
50% water change.
Repeat.

They are starting to become more defined, where before they looked kinda like an amorphous tadpole, you can start to make out eyes, mouth, etc... and color.
There are more darks in here than I thought, possibly close to the 25% as would be expected with a dark/gold pair. How dark they will be as mature is the question.
Some have died in last 5 days. There looks to be about 50 fry ? It looks like have lost about 20. These were probably the weaker individuals, which appears normal.
I ordered some golden pearls to add to their diet from Brine Shrimp Direct as recommended by Tom.

Anyways, here is a video, you can see me going in and out trying to get these little guys in focus. Its tough.

Hi Discusluv,

25% would be the typical number to expect based upon the number of 'darks' that Dean Tweeddale here in Seattle gets from his spawns. I was just at his home and fish room today, along with the really small fry food and newly hatched bbs he also feeds the really the fry infusoria as soon as they become free-swimming.
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post #156 of 344 (permalink) Old 02-02-2020, 04:40 AM Thread Starter
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Hi Discusluv,

25% would be the typical number to expect based upon the number of 'darks' that Dean Tweeddale here in Seattle gets from his spawns. I was just at his home and fish room today, along with the really small fry food and newly hatched bbs he also feeds the really the fry infusoria as soon as they become free-swimming.
I think your right. Now that they are older there are a lot more darks than I originally thought. 25% seems like what i have.


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post #157 of 344 (permalink) Old 02-02-2020, 05:55 AM
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I think you're right. Now that they are older there are a lot more darks than I originally thought. 25% seems like what i have.
This is fascinating. So what proportion of the remainder are gold? And is there intermediate phenotype that's in between gold & dark? And are the dark as vigorous as the others, or smaller & slower growing?
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post #158 of 344 (permalink) Old 02-02-2020, 04:43 PM
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Hi @Desert Pupfish,

From what I saw yesterday, all of the remainder (75%) are 'Gold'. Assuming the 'gold gene' is dominate and the 'dark gene' is recessive then only 25% of the total (33% of the golds) are 'true gold' and 50% of the total (67% of the 'golds') have the dominate 'gold gene' and the recessive 'dark gene' however visually all the golds seem to look the same.. The 'darks' and 'golds' all seem to grow at the same rate.
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post #159 of 344 (permalink) Old 02-02-2020, 04:50 PM Thread Starter
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This is fascinating. So what proportion of the remainder are gold? And is there intermediate phenotype that's in between gold & dark? And are the dark as vigorous as the others, or smaller & slower growing?
Roy explains it better than I could.


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post #160 of 344 (permalink) Old 02-04-2020, 01:14 AM Thread Starter
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Day 23.



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post #161 of 344 (permalink) Old 02-04-2020, 01:26 AM Thread Starter
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1 of the female dark rams has her breeding tube down. I wish I had a tank set up to put her and a dark male in. She looks to be pairing up with another dark male, but its hard to be sure.
Im still not absolutely sure which sex is which, but have a gut feeling. I was hoping I would get a spawn on a stone like last time so I could put eggs in dip and pour like Tom does and raise them up myself. Seems to be more control here considering that they sometimes kill the partner or eat the eggs.

The gold that bred with the dark female ( now dead, remember?) that resulted in fry seems to be odd man out this time. Interesting. He seems more docile than the first go around.
I have been feeding these guys brine shrimp every day and the Green Rasbora females are getting full with eggs! I can see another breeding opportunity opening up here, but how to get another tank without the hubby noticing! Now I see why it is recommended to prepare fish for breeding with live foods, it really works to generate egg production.


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post #162 of 344 (permalink) Old 02-04-2020, 02:04 AM
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1 of the female dark rams has her breeding tube down. I wish I had a tank set up to put her and a dark male in. She looks to be pairing up with another dark male, but its hard to be sure.

Im still not absolutely sure which sex is which, but have a gut feeling. I was hoping I would get a spawn on a stone like last time so I could put eggs in dip and pour like Tom does and raise them up myself. Seems to be more control here considering that they sometimes kill the partner or eat the eggs.



The gold that bred with the dark female ( now dead, remember?) that resulted in fry seems to be odd man out this time. Interesting. He seems more docile than the first go around.

I have been feeding these guys brine shrimp every day and the Green Rasbora females are getting full with eggs! I can see another breeding opportunity opening up here, but how to get another tank without the hubby noticing! Now I see why it is recommended to prepare fish for breeding with live foods, it really works to generate egg production.


You may have to come up with something better than chicken pot pie!


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post #163 of 344 (permalink) Old 02-04-2020, 02:19 AM Thread Starter
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You may have to come up with something better than chicken pot pie!


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post #164 of 344 (permalink) Old 02-04-2020, 03:07 AM
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Day 23.

Are the hydra not a concern for the fry?
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post #165 of 344 (permalink) Old 02-04-2020, 04:44 PM Thread Starter
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Are the hydra not a concern for the fry?
Not really, no. I find that worry to be overblown.
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