River 2.0 update 11/2 - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #1 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-22-2018, 06:52 PM Thread Starter
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River 2.0 update 11/2

The flow to go stream tank was a concept and it turned out great. I got a 135 gallon, 6 ft long tank to refine the stream type and add a waterfall. A detailed journal will follow but here is a quick video to show where it's at currently

Hope you like it!


Last edited by billb; 11-03-2018 at 02:23 AM. Reason: new title
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post #2 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-22-2018, 09:45 PM
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Very cool!
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post #3 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-22-2018, 10:48 PM
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All these river and stream aquariums are just too cool!

My tank journal.

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post #4 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-23-2018, 04:02 AM Thread Starter
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I have always wanted to have a river/stream tank. My efforts to create one had been pretty unsuccessful. Things looked up when I became aware of the work that Oliver Knott was doing with Panta Rhei in Germany. Their “Flow to Go” tanks did an excellent job in creating a true stream in an aquarium. Uni-directional laminar flow. I was hooked!

My goal was to recreate a South East Asian stream. A series of YouTube videos from DiscoveryplanetUK showed these habitats in great detail with a focus on cryptocorynes and associated fauna.
My first attempt to produce my own Flow to go style tank worked pretty good.

https://www.plantedtank.net/forums/1...nspired-2.html

There were things I thought could be done better and things I wanted to keep. A few surprises too!
As mentioned before, this was my inspiration photo:



My Goal:

1) A natural stream as might be found in Borneo. Bucephalandra and crypts with Borneo hillstream loaches (Gastromyzon) and gobies (Rhinogobius)
2) I wanted to create an abundant and diverse aufwuchs layer on the rocks to provide much of the food for the fish
3) Keep the water quality very high

What worked:

1) The flow to go concept kicks butt. It creates a very realistic stream.
2) The Maxspecht Gyre XF 280 is a perfect pump for this



3) The giant PurFlo filter housing with the 20” by 8.5” diameter pleated filter cartridge was unexpectedly awesome – not in the way I would have predicted though!



Turns out this filter is an excellent Gastromyzon nursery! I cannot find any published accounts of these fish breeding and the fry being raised. I have at least 10 fry I pulled from the filter.



Sorry for the crappy picture. They come out at night. You can see three G. ctenocephalus (?) on the rock and three White Cheek goby fry. All are hanging out in a 10 gallon tank waiting for the new home to cycle!

4) Seeding the tank with various items from Carolina Biological Supply worked great! These items got the fish into breeding condition and kept the fry alive with no supplemental feeding. I did feed the adult gobies with live food and I believe the fry ultimately started feeding on small daphnia too. They have big mouths!
5) The Neptune Dos peristaltic pump system was set up to do continuous water changes. It kept things clean and stable. I have a 30 gallon Brute trash can and I pull out 15 gallons every day. The RO water is dosed with ferts and a small amount of Sodium Metasilicate to help with diatom growth. The crypts seemed to like this too as I had both C. nuri and my mystery crypt flower multiple times.



What I am doing differently

1) I am adding a sump ( the old 90 gallon) along with the closed loop cartridge filter. This will add a significant additional water volume and keep the water level constant in the stream tank. The additional pump will add flow to the water fall.
2) No island. I can make the tank deeper
3) Water fall – So cool looking!
4) No Monte Carlo. It started to grow over everything!
5) No Eleocharis vivipara. It was even more invasive than the monte carlo! Keeping with mostly Bucephalandra, some crypts and a few ferns
6) Longer tank! 6 ft instead of 4 ft. Lots of caves for the loaches and the gobies and their offspring

I will go into more about the design and build in the next post. Please ask any questions. This is a fun concept and it can scale down to fit smaller spaces.
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Last edited by billb; 10-23-2018 at 04:04 AM. Reason: spelling
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post #5 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-23-2018, 08:58 PM Thread Starter
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I talk too much

Or rather, write too much.

One of my favorite quotes:

“I apologize for such a long letter - I didn't have time to write a short one.”

― Mark Twain


Oops, I am doing it again. A picture is worth a thousand words, so I am going to focus on those.
Please ask for any details that you are interested in. I will gladly prattle on at great length with a reply!

The build

Drilled some holes


Drilled two more


Used 3/8 inch acrylic. Stronger and easier to work with


Old flow to go tank is now a sump!


Made a water fall box


The filters – overflow and canister


Put in two Gyre pumps
This one pulls from the top and pushes across the bottom


This one is on the other end and pulls from the bottom and pushes up


Put in a lot of rocks (and sand and some Aquasoil light for the crypts)


It works!


Oh, and there are 4 AI prime lights, two Ecotech Vectra L1’s, a 7”filter sock, a Synergy Reef Shadow overflow, 9 Marine Pure Ceramic Biomedia bricks as structural support, an Apex system, an Apex Dos system for water changes, a 30 gallon brute reservoir for RO water and a new high capacity power line direct to San Diego Gas and Electric to provide enough electricity.

Bump: Continuing on...

Trying to be consistent with my plant choices to match what might be found in Borneo.

Bucephalandra:
Green Wavy
Belindae
Brownie Blue
Kedegang Original
Red Blade
Black Pearl

Cryptocorynes:
C. nuri
C. crispatula tonkinensis
C. wendti Tropica
C, mystery crypt – who knows but it has a nice red flower

Diatoms
Navicula
Synedra

Algae
Desmids – mixed

Annelids
Dero
Stylaria
Aeolosoma
Lumbriculus

Others
Mixed rotifers
Paramecium multimicronucleatum – that’s a name and a half!

It is likely that all of those critters were killed by going into an uncycled tank. I will admit to being in a rush to get my fish back into a tank with a thriving aufwuchs community.
-
I do know the plants are still alive so here are some pics:










Now I need to wait. Get the tank matured and try to keep my fish happy in the 10 gallon!

Thanks for looking!

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post #6 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-27-2018, 10:46 PM Thread Starter
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This is a better picture of the water fall flanked by Bucephalandra "belindae"

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post #7 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-30-2018, 03:46 AM Thread Starter
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Move in Day!

The tank is cycled and diatoms are coating the rocks. Time to introduce the fish to their new home.

I have been feeding both the gobies and the gastromyzon pretty heavily the last few days to ensure they are healthy. The gobies have been eating daphnia, bloodworms, black worms and mosquito larvae. Even the babies have been eating these items. They have surprisingly large mouths!
The Borneo loaches have been eating diatoms and algae that I have been culturing in tubs on my patio. Subway tiles serve as the substrate.

Here is an adult G. zebrinus with two baby G. ctenocephalus (or scitulus)



It took a while to net everyone out of the ten gallon. The gastromyzon stick to the side of the glass! Eventually everyone was safely transferred and they were checking out the new digs. I was pleased to see the baby gastromyzon quickly got to work feeding on the rocks

Here are two baby loaches



Here is one of the baby gobies



The strong current does not seem to be causing any trouble.

Here is a male goby checking out caves



Adult G. ctenocephalus (or scitilus) and G. zebrinus seem to be making claims to the same rock. Believe it or not, the ctenocephalus drive off the larger zebrinus more times than not!




Can you see all five baby loaches? The white rock at the top of the picture shows the new algae growth. This is actually a type of diatom.



A good first day! We will see how things go over the next week.

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post #8 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-30-2018, 04:49 AM
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Brilliant work! Subscribed, can't wait to see how this develops.

This is my dream tank - ever since I learned about hillstream loaches and saw a flow-to-go tank I wanted to put them together in a hillstream biotope.
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Everything flows.
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post #9 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-30-2018, 05:50 AM
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So cool, great work, im sure the loaches love the new house! Can you share how much / how long you run the lights for?


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post #10 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-30-2018, 03:16 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ursamajor View Post
Brilliant work! Subscribed, can't wait to see how this develops.

This is my dream tank - ever since I learned about hillstream loaches and saw a flow-to-go tank I wanted to put them together in a hillstream biotope.
Thank you! I had the same wish. Hill stream loaches and the Flow to Go style tanks are made for each other. Very satisfying and fun to watch. The fish have been very visible which is great as they usually hide out. Granted it has been only one day...

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post #11 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-30-2018, 03:35 PM Thread Starter
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So cool, great work, im sure the loaches love the new house! Can you share how much / how long you run the lights for?
This tank is definitely a rambling beast, suitable for my garage - but not the house. If I ever got permission to set up a tank in the house, I would model it after yours!

There are 4 AI Prime lights running full power for 10 hours per day. This was done to drive a quick growth of diatoms so I could get the fish back in. I will need to pump the brakes a bit so that things don't get out of control. I also need to try and keep from contaminating my new tank with BBA - I have it in my other community tank. My last Flow to go tank got BBA and you can't get rid of it with out destroying the diatoms. Keeping my fingers crossed.

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post #12 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-30-2018, 04:25 PM
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This tank is amazing!

I imagine with both maxspects running and your sump/filter running, the tanks pretty loud? Is that the case? Would love to set one of these up, but I appreciate practically silent tanks.

There was only one catch and that was Catch-22.
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post #13 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-30-2018, 06:00 PM Thread Starter
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This tank is amazing!

I imagine with both maxspects running and your sump/filter running, the tanks pretty loud? Is that the case? Would love to set one of these up, but I appreciate practically silent tanks.
Well the sump is pretty quiet and the pumps are too, but... it isn't silent. The waterfall makes the most noise. Sounds like a stream though. As I said previously, what goes for a garage tank, wouldn't work in the house!

Here is a video that will give you an idea of the noise.


Two Gastromyzon sumo wrestling for dominion over a rock



Also, the algae, IT"S GONE! The loaches were busy last night. I will have to supplement the supply until things catch up. I suspect the loaches did not feed enough in the ten gallon.

Last night



This morning

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post #14 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-31-2018, 01:39 PM
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Originally Posted by billb View Post
This tank is definitely a rambling beast, suitable for my garage - but not the house. If I ever got permission to set up a tank in the house, I would model it after yours!

There are 4 AI Prime lights running full power for 10 hours per day. This was done to drive a quick growth of diatoms so I could get the fish back in. I will need to pump the brakes a bit so that things don't get out of control. I also need to try and keep from contaminating my new tank with BBA - I have it in my other community tank. My last Flow to go tank got BBA and you can't get rid of it with out destroying the diatoms. Keeping my fingers crossed.
Cheers for the info, I think I am going to increase my light / lower it closer to the water, the green algae / diatom growth isnt what I want... I think the light is lacking... but then will the BBA also take off with the extra light!

I hear you about BBA, I have it in pretty much all my tanks, but my river tank is the worse, small dots of bba over all the rocks, I did try clear out with h2o2 but as you said it also cleared out the diatoms / green algae... I am tempted to reset the whole tank but that would mean catching all the fish and housing them elsewhere which I cant really do at the moment.


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post #15 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-31-2018, 10:20 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by doylecolmdoyle View Post
Cheers for the info, I think I am going to increase my light / lower it closer to the water, the green algae / diatom growth isnt what I want... I think the light is lacking... but then will the BBA also take off with the extra light!

I hear you about BBA, I have it in pretty much all my tanks, but my river tank is the worse, small dots of bba over all the rocks, I did try clear out with h2o2 but as you said it also cleared out the diatoms / green algae... I am tempted to reset the whole tank but that would mean catching all the fish and housing them elsewhere which I cant really do at the moment.
Do you have access to an outdoor patio or space that gets sun? A small container can be used to culture algae or diatoms too. Can't beat the sun for this. I have two containers that I seeded with different diatom cultures. The water is dosed with a nutrient solution designed for algae culture. I add sodium metasilicate for the diatoms. Here is the nutrient solution info"

Proline F/2 Algae Food from Pentaire

https://pentairaes.com/proline-f-2-algae-food.html

I am suplementing my tank as it matures. The loaches like the diatoms and baby bloodworms that attach to the subway tiles I use. Here is a picture of them in the tank



My hope though is to optimize the growth within the tank but, as discussed, it is a fine line!
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